Breathing Air on Ladders

[VanIsleEVT]

Why is it that breathing air seems to be a "must have" on a ladder platform yet straight stick ladders don't have that luxury and it appears to be accepted?
Both aerials will have you operating a master stream in a IDLH environment, most likely for extended periods of time. Why would a member ever come down for rehab or a break if provided with an endless supply of air?
Just wondering? Enlighten me please.:confused:

[CaptainGonzo]

Breathing air systems also add about $8K to $9K to the cost of a truck!

When we spec'ed out our tower, we did not have breathing air for that very reason.

Just about every tower ladder I have seen with a breathing air system, it is rarely used.

[nameless]

I agree with gonzo. I also see no point at all to having it on a straight stick. I haven't found a reason to have someone on a ladderpipe for an extended period of time.

[MG3610]

it puts more coin in the salesmans pocket.

Big waste of money in my opinion. Of the 3 tower ladders that I've worked with in 15 years, I have never seen used or personally used the systems.

[giweff]

Our ladder is a straight stick and we have air and I have used it a couple of times. But to tell you the truth I could have done with out it our ladder was a demo truck and I feeling if it was not on the demo we wouldn't have paid the money for it.

[RFDACM02]

I agree with it seems most everyone here. We did not see any value in putting breathing air to the bucket on our 06 tower. After traveling around studying different tower ladders we found very few used their air at all never mind regularly, but the initial cost is high and the upkeep fairly involved. We opted to mount to SCBA with 60 min. bottles at the compartment nearest the bucket access for master stream ops. Standing in a bucket for 45-60 minutes stinks and a break is welcomed, though not required.

As for straight sticks with air? We stopped putting guys on the tip for defensive operations 12 years ago. We saw little value as opposed to the risk of flying a firefighter over the fire with limited protection. Most times the firefighter has very limited direct control of the MS, whereas a tower offers much more protection and far greater MS control and accuracy.

[Rescue101]

We put it on ours.The way we're going to hook it up allows the bottle on the operators to stay full. That way,if the operators have to leave the bucket onto the roof or in the structure after a stay in the bucket,they're going with a full tank. T.C.

[Chief1FF]

My department has a 18 year old straight ladder which does have Breathing Air. I can count the number of times we used on one hand. The times it was used some one could of used a regular air pack and been fine. Next truck will not have it on!

Chief1ff

[RoofTopTrucky]

While doing home work for the replacement of our current truck (both are sticks)... a Kool aid sales man was talking to us and trying to tell us that it was a good idea to haver breathing air on a stick in the event you are in a master stream operations and there is alot of smoke. then about 2 minuets later was telling us how you can use the controls at the turn table to operate the master stream... lol I don't think he realized that he totaly contradicted himself.
Anway, we opted to NOT get the option. our SOP says anyone on the at the ladder pipe during master stream operations must have a SCBA in the event the conditions warent breathing air. And if that is the case, you'll get about 40 min of air, and if it is a master stream operation...chances are you arent in much of a hurry so you can afford to switch guys out every 40 minuets.

[LFDAO10]

Our KME 75' stick has two breathing air ports on the tip. I have never seen them get used but it is nice to know that they are there should we ever desire or need to use them.

[FireFuss]

Our tillers are 100' sticks. When we put a ladder pipe in service we use 2 ropes to control the vertical aim of the pipe, and the rotation is controlled with the whole platform. Who needs anyone up there at all?

[Gonzo25]

Our ladder is a 1995 Simon Duplex LTI tower. It has breathing air, and I believe the air in the tanks is actually the initial fill. Hasn't ever been used to my knowledge.

[VanIsleEVT]

That's funny but scary.

[fltmaint23]

We have a 1982 85' Snorkel and I can count on one hand how many times we have used the breathing air on the truck.

Our SOG states that we wear an SCBA when operating in the platform and that the on board air is for backup.

What is really scary is that the only pressure gauges for the tanks is up in the platform. Would have been nice if there were gauges on the tanks themselves but that would be asking too much back then.

We've spent a good deal of money over the years making adaptors to fit our SCBA masks which have changed quite a bit since 1982.

[FIREMECH1]

On the outside, looking in again.....

Is there a reason why you can't store 2-4 bottles in the platform??? (don't know how long it takes to switch one)

Our 3 platforms have the large 4,500 psi bottles on them. Out of curiosity, I asked if any one has ever used theirs. Answer was no. So why are they considered "must have", if they are not used???

FM1