Unit #'s & 10 Codes

[One13Truck]

I'm amazed at all the different numbering scemes out there (we have County #'s that are not used and our mutual aid #'s that are used). Our County # is 172, 172 engine 1, 172 engine 2, 172 ladder 1, 172 F1, F2, F3, and F4. Ambulance 11A and 11B (also our rescue). Our Mutual Aid is Station 10, E11, E12, L113, A14, R15, Chief 16, 17, 18, and 19. Anybody care to share theirs? For any further info on the system our County uses click on our homepage which can be found at the bottom of this post (cheap plug), I have both the "official lists", 10 code lists, and the Lists actually in use by the units in the County. On a secondary subject as well: Plain language vs. codes, your opinions??? I seem to be outvoted on this one so far. I prefer all codes and #'s. What do you think???

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Edwardsville Emergency Services, Station 10
We came, we saw, WE KICKED IT'S *****!!!

[One13Truck]

This topic in it's original form is posted in the Meet and Greet section of the forum, I'm also posting it here as well to see what kind of a response it gets here since it seems to be a topic that was fairly well received over there.

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Edwardsville Emergency Services, Station 10
We came, we saw, WE KICKED IT'S *****!!!

[Dwight Conrad]

First of all, your numbers would confuse me. In my dept, we use unit numbers such as eng. 1, tanker 1, rescue 1, etc. And our members and officers use numbers, too. Such as 1501, 1502, 1503, etc.

We also use the 10-code system. But we've also agreed that if we can't remember the number, just say what we mean. I say what i mean. I think it's easier to say responding than it is to say 10-6 or 10-8, or whatever the individual dept uses.

I regards to my first paragraph, I know of depts that also assign three or four digit numbers to their trucks, too. Such as 304, or 305.

Hope this helps you out.

[Eng91ine]

I don't think that the 10-codes are recognized by the FCC. Personally I think that 10-codes cumbersome and unprofessional. With 10-codes you need to memorize the codes, and know when to properly use them. With the use of plain english, everyone on the air knows exactly what you mean....its that simple, and simple (along with short) is important when communicating via radio. Granted that slang such as "On the job" is unprofessional (but it sounds cool) and not everyone on the air may not know what you mean, but at least you dont have to relearn a second langauge to use a radio. Thats just my two cents.

[9m18]

Keep in mind that the incident command system uses Plain English. Keeps the confusion to a minimum.

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Stay Safe.
You asked for my opinion, now you have it. It's mine and mine only. Any similarity to another opinion...living or dead...is purely coincidental.

[FFTrainer]

I'm with 9m18 on this one!

The National Wildfire Coordinating Group(NWCG) Incident Management System states that their will be no 10 codes and the Plain English will be used when transmitting.

[pyroknight]

I wish the NWCG and the CDF wouldn't have run ramshod over the US fire service, but it's our own damn fault for laying down and letting them tell us how to do our jobs. Ten codes were wrong thinking developed by the police departments years ago when radios were first introduced. Ten codes are antiquated and cumbersome and the national trend is to phase them out. There are still cases where codes not commonly known to the general public are of use (mental patients comes to mind), but I remember entire sentences in ten codes back in the eighties (Engine 191 10-8, 10-24, 10-19 - in service, assignment complete, returning to quarters).

I had an assistant chief one time request an additional 10-52 thinking he was getting a second tow truck. Dispatch confirmed that he was requesting an ambulance his location? He switched to plain english.

Probably the best use of ten codes I've found is with my dispatcher wife. We use them on our numerical pagers to communicate. Since we know the codes for enroute, arrival, disregard, etc., we can pack a lot of info into a digital pager.

[RDWFIRE]

One13Truck, "clear text" is really the best way to communicate on the fireground. This has nothing to do with NWFCG or any other group. It is common sense. Could you imagine the chaos when several mutual aid counties respond to a large incident and start trying to use different 10-codes? You get the idea. If you work on any large wildland incident that involves the USFS, BLM NPS, or most state forest agencies, you will be using clear text, or no one will talk to you. As for equipment numbering, each department will probably have their own system, and then when they go to a large wildland incident, they will be under a 4 digit strike team number, or single resource number, assigned under the Incident command system. As for the one response that says the FCC might not recognize 10-codes, that only applies to the amateur radio system.
Just my opinion. http://www.firehouse.com/interactive/boards/smile.gif
Be safe. The dragon lurks!!!

[JJordan]

Too many numbers!
When I was young and green,I liked 10 Codes because radio traffic was cool to me then. Now that my priorities have changed from whats cool to whats practical and safe, I'm liking the plain English method better.On our job,misunderstandings can kill us. Codes leave room for error. In my area, we recognize either now, and will most likely phase out codes.

In the southeast, apparatus are designated by Station number, and unit type. For instance, pumpers are 1's,2's,3's,and 4's. So the first due pumper from Station 5 would be known as 51. Or, if 292 checks enroute, you know that it's Station 29, 2nd due.
Thanks and stay safe.

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*THE ABOVE TEXT IS THE OPINION OF THE WRITER AND NOT THAT OF ANY FIRE DEPT. OR ASSOCIATED ENTITY.*

[Dalmatian90]

There's nothing wrong, indeed some benifits, to using codes for routine administrative messages in your local area.

Codes where originally developed not to conceal the message, but transmit it in a compact form to reduce the length of transmission -- you know, back in the days when fires could be put out without the benifits of four fireground channels or trunked radios http://www.firehouse.com/interactive/boards/smile.gif

Codes also convey a SPECIFIC message that may not be present with plain-text. When you say "53" in my area, it means your responding to the call. Is it the same as "On the Air", "Enroute", "In Service", "Responding" -- probably, but you don't need to choose which plain english to use. We have maybe half a dozen Signals used regularly for routine messages, and these are pretty consistent for this half of the state so departments do understand each other. Most of the less used forty odd signals we have, just go over in english know.

Which brings up the simple point that plain english ain't plain english unless you have already agreed to definitions in advance -- witness the great Tanker/Tender debate, or for that matter that "Out of Service" at one department means the truck is operating a call and thus unavailable for another call, while Out of Service at another department means the truck is broken down.

[N2DFire]

O.K. - I'm not going to "vote" in the which is better 10 codes or plain text debate. Both have benifits and drawbacks. Bottom line is use what works best for you.


As for the numbering Scheme -

All Apparatus here are named based on type of truck & station number.
Ex. Engine 3, Tanker 5, Mini-Pumper 2, Brush 7, Pumper12, etc.

Ambulance are done this way as well. "Med" units are ALS and "Rescue" units are BLS. Hence names would be Med 3, Rescue 1, Med 3B, etc.

Personal radio numbers are 3 to 5 digit numbers.

First digit is either a 2 for Rescue or 3 for Fire, next come the station or district number, followed by the individual unit number (which in most cases is asigned in no great order)

So - "Firefighter #12" from station 7 would have a radio number of 3-7-12, while "EMT #27" from station 10 would be 2-10-27 and so on.

Take Care - Stay Safe
Stephen

[daysleeper47]

I know that FDNY uses the codes religeously. Just curious of what some of NYC's bravest think of the 10-codes...anyone got their opinion?

[ENGINE18-3]

In Camden County the county assigned every town a fire district number ours happens to be 18 and we are station 3 (no there isn't a station 1 or 2 the 3 was a compromise when the to original companys merged in 1976) So our apparatus is numbered: ENGINE 1832, ENGINE 1833, LADDER 1834, RESCUE 1835.
And County Communications has nixed the 10 codes and streamlined every thing. So we get dispatched as Station 18-3, or Engine 18-3. And when talking to county or on radio you use just plain English like "Camden County, Engine 1833 responding to __________ for a _________."


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The statements above are my own opinions

FF Greg Grudzinski
Oaklyn Fire Dept.
Station 18-3

[SRFD1604]

While going through the Firefighter I & II course just recently we had a subject of communications and the essentials book advised not to use the 10 codes cause they are confusing. Even the instructor recommended plain english.

We use four digit numbers to recognize our departments and units,I.E. 1600 is the station call numbers and 1650 would be an engine from that station.


*these thoughts are solely mine.

[FFTrainer]

Dalmation --

You make a great point about definitions.

The out of service / in service one that definitely varies.

I listen to guys say they are in service but to them that means they have pulled the unit out of the door and are waiting to staff it. While to others, if they say in service that means the wheels are turning and they are going to the job.

The Out of Service one gets me to since some will say Out of service upon returning to the station meaning they are done with the call and ready for the next. To me, if I call my unit Out of Service at the station that means I am back at the station but not available for a job. I may need to fill cylinders, whatever, but I am Out of Service.

I guess you are right and it will go on forever like the Tanker/Tender, Volunteer/Career and all the other never ending Fire Service debates!

[Nick SBFD 6]

In our area we are dispatched on a common channel, I can't even count how many agencys use it from towns I've never heard of, any way each department is assigned a number ours happens to be 61, so our first run truck Engine 2 is called 61 Engine 2, In recent years our department has gone away from the numbering system and go just with the title of South Berwick ie; South Berwick Engine 2
as far as 10-Codes go, there are only a few that we use, 10-4 makes life so easy there is no doubt that when you are acknowleged. Also in our area a MVA happens to be a 10-55 and for some reason that one just stuck.

[One13Truck]

Well I see I'm still mostly in the minority on the codes. But I guess everybody's entitled to their own opinion. What works great somewhere will fail miserably somewhere else, I guess....

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Edwardsville Emergency Services, Station 10
We came, we saw, WE KICKED IT'S *****!!!

[SRVFD2]

When we were organized 9 years ago, we used the codes religiously ----- but, as a small dept. with few calls, we would have had to use every month's training to practice them again. A few of our members still use them, but most have opted for the easier method of just telling dispatch what we're doing. I agree with "Nick" - 10-4 is always acceptable, but otherwise it's too easy to use the wrong number and send the wrong signal!

[Untouchables21]

In Middlesex, Engines are numbered 21,22,and 23. Ladder is numbered 24 and the utility is 25. Our county number is 48, and is to be used on in-county mutual aid calls. Because we border another county, if we respond to a mutual aid call out of county, we call in Middlesex Engine 21, instead of 48-21. In Bound Brook, Engines are numbered 101, 102, and 103. Ladder is numbered 114, and utility is 113. The county number is 23,a and is used whenever you call into service. As for codes, we do have them but we are supposed to use plain english as per ICS. Most people are still stuck on using the codes and the dispatch desk still acknowledges them because our police dept. still uses them.

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Not for self, but for others...


The views posted above are not the opinion of the companies or departments I am affiliated with.

[AJKeech]

In our county, where each department is it's own entity (not part of a county wide department), our unit numbers serve two purposes. First to identify the department, then the unit. For example, our department is 19. Our rescue unit is 70. When the rescue unit is requested, 1970 is asked for. Our pumper is 1920, tanker is 1965, and so on and so forth. Our officers have numbers as well. Our chief is 1990, all the way to Corporal, 1995. Our station is 1900. If we were to have a second station (we don't), then it would be 1901, and so forth.

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To those who fight for it, freedom has a taste the protected will never know.

[cozmosis]

I think one of the benefits of 10-codes is uniformity. There may be a million ways to say something, but only one 10-code for the occasion.

Of course, it also helps if you don't have dozens to remember. There is no need to have a 10-code for every little action you take. And you've got to ask yourself why you are using 10-codes. To keep things secret from scanner listeners? Or for a legimate reason?

Monroe, La. FD uses three number designations for engine companies. E109 would be the engine at station nine, etc. Truck and rescue companies have single-digit numbers. Rescue 5 is the rescue company in station five.

The smaller department across the river uses three-digits for all rigs. The 600 series is for engine companies, the 700 series is for ladder companies and the 900 series is for command vehicles.

[Firefighter2197]

we use plain english
no ten codes have been use officialy in 10 years. and units are numberd as followes
eng 21
eng 21-2
eng 21-3
and so on same foe squads,tankers,rescues
the whole county does this
2197
stay afe and have fun

[cmjones]

We are on the county wide frequency. We use 10 codes.

ex..2201 is 10-8, 10-17
in service enroute

2201-pumper
2202-pumper
2204-tanker
2206-Brush Truck
2207-Brush Truck
2208-Rescue

2210-Chief
2211-Asst. Chief
2212-14-Captain's
2215-Safety Officer
2216-Lead FF
2217-Training Officer
2218-2299-Firefighters

All other stations in Kershaw County use the same format

[J Almon]

We've used plain English for almost 20 years. You have to say what you mean, though. If we have an engine that needs to have hose washed and loaded when it leaves a call, it is "unavailable." It is "out of service" when the diesel tank is empty. We use "copy" to signify a transmission was received, and "affirmative" if answering a question. We got tired of being dispatched to a "10-72 Structure Fire" when just "Structure fire" would suffice.
Our numbering scheme uses districts, so it isn't too complicated. Due to changes, the member numbers change frequently. Nothing like paging the wrong guy at 3 a.m.

[Ross Johnson]

I have had a extemely bad experiance with 10 codes and unit #'s in the last couple years. In NJ where I run as a volunteer, we changed dispatched centers a couple years ago and went from plain text(engine 2, 3-and a structure was a structure, not a 10-45) to a numbering system that is modelled after a county wide system in central jersey. We started having incrediable problems with mutual aid and no one new who was talking to who and what we were getting dispatched too. Every town around us has a different system(FFTrainer I am sure can understand this) and you have no clue what a unit is that is coming. It creates quite a problem for officers staging apparatus if you have 3 towns all with different numbering system for there trucks. The incident command system advises clear text. In the department I run with in PA has a great system. It goes like this:
If your an assitant chief out of Company 1, your Assistant 1. And a deputy chief is Deputy 1 and so on. For units its, what your unit is(Engine, rescue, Quint, ect) and the station and the unit in that station. So if you have two engines in Company 1, its Engine 1-1, 1-2 or if you have a quint, its Quint 1. And so on. All dispatching is plain text. THis is what I feel is best. However, if a county has a had a county wide system that works, then by all means stick with it. But in terms of clear communications and easy system usage, I see clear text hands down the way to go.

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Gettysburg Fire Department (PA) FF/NREMT-B
Brookside Engine Company,Div of Mendham Twp Fire Dept(NJ) FF
Mendham Twp EMS EMT-B
These views are my own and do not reflect those of these departments

[Captain Gonzo]

My department uses clear text...remember KISS.....everyone knows what is being said, and in mutual aid situations one can communicate and understand with the neighboring departments.

We only use one code number...code 13, which means the rig is out of service for mechanical problem.

The fire buff paging network I belong to (East Coast Paging Systems)uses 10-45 to indicate an injury or fatality.
10-45C1 is a fatality, 10-45C2 is major injury, 10-45C3 is a minor injury. The do use some abbreviations, the code is given on their website and when you receive your pager.

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Firefighters: Today's heroes protecting our tomorrows....
Captain Gonzo

[ChiefJTL]

I was visiting a friend in a small department down south and after the call was through the radio blurted out - "Engine 1 is 10-98, 10-8, 10-76 to Station 1". On the other hand, my good friend from Providence is apt to say "Engine 3 is in quarters and off the air-Engine 3" Repeating the number. There are a million ways but I hate 10 Codes.

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"Stay in the House"

[BucksEng91]

No 10-codes in Bucks County, PA. I think, like many here, that they would seriously hinder operations in mutual-aid situations (we're right on the border with Montgomery County, PA). Plain English is simpler, and everyone knows what it means. Remember, the purpose is to communicate the message, not to sound cool.

In Bucks, apparatus are numbered by station. Engine 91, Ladder 90, and so forth. Nice and simple.

[This message has been edited by BucksEng91 (edited October 20, 2000).]

[OFDLUIT33]

In my area there are several different systems used. I live in St. Clair county and all departments on the 154.190 frequency(although some of us have our own channel) were issued numbers 0- I belive 519. Each department has ten numbers to use( IE..0-9)
My department is 0 - 9 and every one tries to keep like equiptment with like numbers. For example most areial apparatus is 9 like 9 or 29 or 259. most squads are 0's. Just across the river St. louis county uses 4 digit codes like 5721 57 is the municipality 2 is engine house and 1 is the truck number.



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The views here are mine and do not reflect that of my department or any of it's members.

[FireFJayT]

Plain english ....... simple and effective.

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"No matter what rank I have attained, I am, at heart, a Firefighter First"

[BTFD11-19]

we don't use 10 codes either. ours trucks are number engine 11, engine 11-1, ladder 11, field 11, marine 11, and marine 11-1. we are station 11. station 14's trucks are engine 14, engine 14-1, and tower 14. i think it is the easiest way to number trucks. this job is hard enough.

[MBrewer]

Dane County, Madison Wisconsin went to plain language in our radio protocols a few years ago. I think it's made for a lot less confusion for both dispatch and field personell. Using the terms enroute, on-location, returning etc.

All our equipment is numbered using the communitiy name in the callsign. Oregon engine 3, Middleton Ladder 4, Monona Squad 5 etc...Fire officers are identified simply using the department name and a number. Middleton Fire 1 is the chief, Middleton Fire 2 is the asst chief. Captains/Lt's are assgned fire 3, fire 4 and so on. All departments in the county are dispatched by a central communications center so, including the community name was essential to clear and safe communications.

[Chris Deyerle]

At our station which is station 6 we have 606 (pumper) 603 (pumper) 611 (Tanker) 612 (Tanker) 620 (Brush Truck) 625 (Rescue) 630 (Command) and 635 (Service Truck). This is what we use to call en-route and etc. A far as 10-codes we really don't use them. The one that we do use is 10-4. Wetumpka Fire Department uses 10-codes. I my self use 10-4 10-25 and 10-23. That is because I know most of the 10-codes in Elmore County

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Chris Deyerle

[Chris Deyerle]

At our station which is station 6 we have 606 (pumper) 603 (pumper) 611 (Tanker) 612 (Tanker) 620 (Brush Truck) 625 (Rescue) 630 (Command) and 635 (Service Truck). This is what we use to call en-route and etc. A far as 10-codes we really don't use them. The one that we do use is 10-4. Wetumpka Fire Department uses 10-codes. I my self use 10-4 10-25 10-84 10-70 and 10-23. That is because I know most of the 10-codes in Elmore County

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Chris Deyerle

[Tentruck]

The Russians aren't listening anymore. Call it what it is. Engine, Truck, Squad, Ladder, Pumper, Wagon, Whatever

[firecadetak]

We have five station, each have there own name, but also use the numbering system, ie. Station 1, Station 2, etc.

Each station's officers and apparatus start with the number of the station:

Station 1 - Engine 11, Engine 13, Truck 12, Utility 11, Medic 1.
- Chief - 101,
Asst. Chief - 102, Capts - 103, 104, 105
Lts. - 106, 107, 108
Station 2 - Engine 21, Engine 23, Rescue 21
- Chief - 201
- Asst. Chief - 202
- Capts.- 203, 204 - Lt. 205, 206
Station 3 - Engine 31, Engine 33, Truck 32, Utility 31
- Chief - 301
- Asst, Chief - 302
- Capts.- 303, 304, 305
- Lts. - 306, 307, 308
Station 4 - Engine 41, Engine 42, Utility 41
- Chief - 401
- Asst. Chief - 402
- Capts. 403, 404, 405, 407
- Lt. - 406
- Engineers - 421, 422, 423, 424
Station 5 - Engine 51, Tanker 52
- Engineer - 521

Of course there are exceptions, like our ambulances - Medic 1&3 @ Station 1
- Medic 2&4 @ Station 3

Coordinating Fire Chief - Fire 1
Division Chiefs - Fire 2 and Fire 3
Fire Marshal - Fire 4
Fire Training Officer- Fire 5
EMS Training Officer - Medic 5

As for 10 codes- we don't use them, except for 10-4, which we aren't even supposed to use.

[FitzBFDT2]

Clear text is the proper, safest and most efective method of communicating with each other.

10 codes vary from municipality to municipality.What good is it to have 10 codes if when you call mutual aid, you have to use clear text because the other town does not know your system.

All these county and station #'s are just blowing my mind. Why not Engine 1,2,3..., Ladder 1,2,3..., Battalion 1,2,3...,etc? If you go on mutual aid, use your munipality name before your company #. For example, Bayonne Engine 7 to Jersey City Fire Dispatch or Bayonne Ladder 3 to Newark Fire Dispatch

KISS


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Kevin M. Fitzhenry, bfdt2@fitzhenry.com
Firefighter, Truck Co. 2
City of Bayonne (NJ) FD
www.bayonnenj.org/fire/ (http://www.bayonnenj.org/fire/)

[Fire29_1999]

I could be confused very easy from any of the posts I have read here concerning numbering and 10-codes, but that could be because I am from Montana. We for the most part don't use 10-codes, their are times when you don't want the folks in scanner land to have to hear what you might be dealing with like a bad 10-58 (fatality mva)but we are dispatched by the city PD so if we do use a 10-code they should know what we mean. Also it seems that we either have too small a dept. or the other local depts. and us have found an easy way to get the right equipment to whatever we are sent to, when we are needed we decide what will be sent,example="Whitefish fire have a report of a one car rollover." We would than respond to dispatch by saying "Whitefish Rescue 22 or Ambulance 18 responding to _____ " the other local city or county depts.would do the same if responding to mutual aid, they would call "Whitfish IC Columbia Falls eng 4 responding, where do you want us." and our appearatice is numbered consecutivly starting at eng.16 and eng. 17 than amb.18 to 21 than rescue 22 and eng.23 and 24.
stay safe

[FM593]

As of right now my County uses 3 different ways to talk on the radio. For Ex. for Chiefs(1255, 88-5 and Chief 33). A couple of years ago the County tried to get every Company to switch to plain speak since we implemented the Incident Command System. Of course not every Company switched and the County had no "B---S" to make them, and now this is where we are left. "CONFUSION"!!!!
We are not speaking in codes right now, so why do it in the fire service when their is so much confusion to begin with.
Most of the people who like codes are either Wackers who want to be like FDNY or have been in the Fire Service since Buckets were used.
Like My Friend said "THE RUSSIANS AREN"T LISTENING ANYMORE!!!!!!!!!!!

[snowmankw77]

Personally I have used both 10 codes and verbal. And i think it is much easier to do verbal. The station that i run with in Pittsburgh while i am going to college used 10 codes and it is really difficult to use. But back home we just use verbal and the communication between Garrett Central and us is easy to understand on both sides.

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Matt Briskey
Eastern Garrett County
Station 80

"What's in it for me?

Hard Work
Injury
Possible Death
A deep and abiding feeling of personal satisfaction found in few aspects of life"

"Nobody ever called the fire department when they did something smart!!"

[Sparkill Fire dept]

In Rockland County, New York (S.E New York state Borders New Jersey)

Each Dept is numbered alphabetically 1 to 26

All radio designations are preceeded with the Departments alphabetical number.

The apprattus are designated as to what they are.

Example > Department 9

The chief is... 9 - 1
Asst. Chief is. 9 - 2
9 - 3, 9 - 4, & 9 - 5
as line officers.

Apprattus> A 1250 gpm pumper is 9 - 1250
A 1000 gpm pumper is 9 - 1000

Ladders> A 75 ft aerial is 9 - 75
A tower is ..........9 - Tower

Other Equip> 9 - Rescue, 9 - MP (mini pumper)

this allows the I.C. at mutual aid to know the capacities of the units responding.

It works for us.

[E_man9RFD]

In Madison County every department including police use 10 codes. I personally have no use for them. The IMS system doesn't use them; plain english is used.

Our Department, Richmond, is dispatched by the police dept. They have toned us out with almost no words at times.

"Respond to wherever, for a code this, the signal that is code this break on signal 8 million."


Even our own officers bastardize the 10 code sytem.... saying everything is 10-4. Our 10 codes translate 10-4 as, "understood"
All jibberish to me.

I don't know... maybe I'm a simp.

[dousaems]

Pretty obvious that ten codes are not real useful unless they are standardized. I run with four companies in two different states. In MD, a motor vehicle accident is a 10-50 PI or PD (personal injury or property damage) and can be dispatched with rescue. In PA it's a 10-45 I (injury) with confinement or entrapment. Somebody should just call it an MVA or MVC and do away with the ten codes; it's too confusing for many people, especially dispatchers between the states. Interestingly enough, the private ambo service I work for part time RELIES on ten codes, but only because they don't have to deal with multiple agencies.

Onto apparatus numbering. The PA counties are simple and use plain english with station #and rig 1,2,3 etc.: Engine 56-1, Supply 56, Brush 56, Medic (or ambulance 56).

But the MD side is different. Helps track what is what with categorized numbers -
Each unit's # is usually a three or four digit #, indicating the company and type of piece. We have 10 independent companies (all volunteer) in the county, numbered 1 through 10 plus 12 and 13. Each company may have multiple stations, but this does not play into the numbering.
Here's the fun part -
anything in teens (11-19) is an engine
so if company 1 has four engines they would be 111, 112, 113, 114 (or some variation).
Anything in the twenties is a tanker (there's only one, 1321, out of...you guessed it...Co.13).
Anything in the thirties is a truck, regardless of tower, quint, or stick.
40's = brush truck
50's = rescue truck
60's = air cascade unit, utility vehicle
70's = more utility vehicles
80's = special units (draft pieces)
90's = EMS units. Medic units are usually 91, 92, and 93; EMS chase vehicles are 99, 98, and 97.
So in summary, at one of my stations (Co.4), we have:
5 engines (411, 412, 413, 414, 415)
no tanker
two trucks (431, 432)
a brush (441)
a rescue (451)
a boat (Rescue 452)
utilities out the wazoo (461, 471, 472 and a few others, I think)
no special units
three medic units (491, 492, 493)
Talk about confusing. I grew up with it and it is second nature to me, but I would almost guarantee that anybody else who reads it is confused. Oh well, we all have our methods.

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Todd Dousa
NREMT-P, CCEMT-P

[This message has been edited by dousaems (edited 12-04-2000).]

[One13Truck]

Great work everybody, keep 'em coming!!! Have a safe and happy new year!!!

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Edwardsville Emergency Services, Station 10
We came, we saw, WE KICKED IT'S *****!!!

[Adler]

We have mutual aid and fire protection pacts with cities in the surrounding two states. So this means that we help cover three states. Each state seems to have their own version of the ten codes. So most of the new guys, < 5 years, are using plain English because that is what they are use to. We were taught plain english. But, you have some of the old guys that try using the 10 codes, and once in a while the dispatch throws a fit because they are requesting "a package or item" be brought to the scene instead of the "assignment is complete". Can't teach an old dog new tricks?? Well most of the old timers have learned, but you have to guys that tell you "that f*#@&!^* dispatch don't know what the "heck" they are talking about". I have to leave, because I am laughing inside so hard, that I begin crying.

[This message has been edited by Adler (edited 01-09-2001).]

[MTNRESQ]

As Far as 10-codes go they are out!
Our county still uses them on the sheriff Channel, but the disbatchers use them limited with the ambulance services and Fire Depts. My Amb Service went clear by far it is the way to go.
Most of the ambulance services in our county still use ten codes and Clear text together
"We are 10-76 enroute to the call"
"We are 10-23 on Scene" This is definately a waste of radio traffic.

All our ambulance services are Labeled by tens, 10, 20, 30 etc.
Ours is rescue 70, 1st out unit is 71, 2nd 72 and our rescue is 73.

the fire dept has all its numbers in the 20's but we are the only one in our county to do this.



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Barry Butrymowicz FF/EMT

The views expressed above in no way represent the views of Mountain Ambulance Service or Riverview Fire Department.

Remember if it is bleeding - bandage it, if it is on fire - put it out.
and extricate when you have to.

[spotthedalmation]

Monroe County, PA uses a truck numbering system as follows:

Station Number - Truck Type - Truck Number

With:
1 - Engine
2 - Tanker
3 - Brush
4 - Rescue
5 - Utility
6 - Ladder

7, 8, and 9 are officers

Ex. 34 - 1 - 4 Would Be An Engine From Pocono Township, (Station Numbers are alphabetical) and the 4 is their arbitrary truck number.

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Challenge Yourself To Rise Above Adversity and Do The Right Thing

[One13Truck]

Well it seems I'm still in the minority on the codes issue. But like I said before only my opinion and what works here won't work in other places so whatever is best for your area should be in place. I'm not going to argue with anybody over it. But here in N.E.Pa. Monroe and Carbon uses them a good amount of the time, and Pike County is all codes and they all run fine. Here in Luzerne our police use them but Fire-ems rarely do. But then again we have to use town name and #'s when we call because they still have no idea who we are if we don't even after almost 5 years of being in service as a 911 center. So instead of saying: E11, R15, 17 to the 48, 123 Main. It has to be Edwardsville Station 10 to Luzerne County, received the page Edwardsville Engine 11, Edwardsville Rescue 15 is responding to the fire at 123 Main Street in Edwardsville (yes there are times when even that has to be specified, like there are always multiple calls at the same address going for the zones that that dispatcher is working?). Or this one: Edwardsville Chief 16 to Luzerne County, opperation complete, command terminated, Edwardsville Engine 11 is available and returning to Edwardsville Station 10 (like he'd release us to go to another town, but hey gotta say it or they don't know where Station 10 is at). This can be made much easier by just sayng: Chief 16 to County, 10-24, E11 10-8, 17 back to Station 10. Wilkes Barre City can do it and they are through the County, and it works fine. What we need to do In Luzerne County is to drop the 911 center and go back to our old dispatching. It was much quicker, everybody knew who they were talking to. But I still feel that the codes are still the best way to go. But like I said my opinion only because what works fine here just creates chaos in other areas.

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Edwardsville Emergency Services, Station 10
We came, we saw, WE KICKED IT'S *****!!!

[This message has been edited by One13Truck (edited 01-18-2001).]

[One13Truck]

That can't be all!!! Nobody else wants to share anything???

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Edwardsville Emergency Services, Station 10
We came, we saw, WE KICKED IT'S *****!!!

[windham3]

In Bradford County, the apparatus is referred to by dept.#, type, and internal designation. For example, my department # is 19. We have 19 Engine 2,(we no longer have engine 1), 19 Tanker 1, 19 Tanker 2, etc.

Line officers are called by department name, and order of rank.
Chief- Windham 1
1st Asst- Windham 2
2nd Asst- Windham 3
Captian- Windham 4

10-codes are not used for fire or EMS in our county, only police. It is a pretty simple system.

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Bradford County PA.
Department 19

[TCFire]

In Niagara County all the Vol. Fire Companies are dispatched from the County Sheriffs communication center. We are dealing with dispatchers that work both Fire/EMS and law enforcement. Law is a lot of 10 codes, Fire has almost none. Fire is dispatched in plain language.

Each Company has a numeric designation that relates to our NYS OFPC County code of 32. My Companies NYS code is 32025.

Each type/class of equipment has an alpha designation plus the actual apparatus number. Our Engine 1's call sign is 25E-1.

Pumpers are E-X, Aerials are A-X, Tankers are T-X, Rescue's and other misc. equipment (including Chiefs, Asst Chiefs) are M-X. Chief is always M-7, 1st Asst is M-7A, 2nd Asst is M-7B, etc. Our rescue is 25M-4. Ambulances are R-9, second ambulance for same company would be R-9A.

Agree with KISS, plain language communications. 10-4 is about the only regularly used 10 code along with 10-97 (arrived on scene). You can tell the guys who listen to the cops on the scanner as they'll try using all the other 10 codes on the radio. Fire Control knows what they mean but if they're talking to another piece of equipment/company with somebody onboard that is not scanner-wise, it gets pretty amusing when the reply comes back 'Speak English please!'.

[This message has been edited by TCFire (edited 01-26-2001).]

[Lewiston2Capt]

I to am from Niagara County and our Code is 32008 which makes our station 8. I agree with some of the problems of in service and out of service. In our county (correct me if I am wrong TCFire) In service means available for call, out of service means not available. If we are out of the station on training or for special events we say out in radio contact. Plain text is typically the easiest to understand, however some people do not know the KISS method of speaking. For example people have been known to tie up the radio expressing info that could be summed up in a 3 word message. This becomes extreemly stressful when responding to mutal aid calls and attempting to contact the requesting agency.
TCFire you know what I mean if you hear any of our calls this end of the county.


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Shawn M. Cecula
Captain
Lewiston Fire Co. No. 2

[One13Truck]

TCFire, Lewiston2Capt,

Maybe I'm overlooking the KISS again here, but being from an area where letters aren't used was there any set formula to come up with what's used there? I can see where the ones you use there would fit in, but who sat down and came up with what to mean what? Anybody from the New Hampshire area care to answer this question as well? I know from some of the posts here that they use letters up there too. Just to be curious.

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Edwardsville Emergency Services, Station 10
We came, we saw, WE KICKED IT'S *****!!!

[WFDTruck1]

we dont use 10 codes that much anymore. we find it alot simplier using plain english. for our appartus, we use the type of appartus then the number, ie: Truck 1, Engine 2,3,4,5. Car 1,9,10,11,12. Utility 8. We find it much easier that way. as far as firefighter identities, we find no need for the 3 or 4 digit code. we use the appartus idea with a numerical. ie: Engine 3A (A= officer, B= right tailboard, C= left tailboard, D= driver. been using this way for years, found no problems with it.

[Lewiston2Capt]

Originally posted by One13Truck:
TCFire, Lewiston2Capt,

Maybe I'm overlooking the KISS again here, but being from an area where letters aren't used was there any set formula to come up with what's used there? I can see where the ones you use there would fit in, but who sat down and came up with what to mean what? Anybody from the New Hampshire area care to answer this question as well? I know from some of the posts here that they use letters up there too. Just to be curious.



The Letters designating the apparatus type are assigned by the company but consideration is given to the apparatus' primary function. For example we have a Rescue/Engine that is a front line engine, it could be considered an M under the Niagara county coding system. We named it 8E-3, We also have an 8E-1 being our older engine. Our apparatus is coded as follows

8E-1 is a 1988 Saulsbury Engine
8E-3 is a 2000 RD Murray Rescue/Engine
8T-2 is a Saulsbury Tanker/Pumper
8R-9 is the ambulance
8M-5 is a Fire Police vehicle
8M-4 is our old rescue truck

Basically the number after the dash is made up by the company. Ambulances are always given the #R-9 code and the backup ambulance is called #R-9A and so on. Typically only the companies that respond mutual aid with each other frequently will need to know what the unit code is. If I were to be responding to a call in TCFires area I would call Saying: Lewiston 2 Rescue Engine/Tanker/Engine to ...

Usually the codes are used to minimize radio traffic.

Hope this clears it up a bit.



------------------
Shawn M. Cecula
Captain
Lewiston Fire Co. No. 2

[Don Witner]

Originally posted by One13Truck:
I'm amazed at all the different numbering scemes out there (we have County #'s that are not used and our mutual aid #'s that are used). Our County # is 172, 172 engine 1, 172 engine 2, 172 ladder 1, 172 F1, F2, F3, and F4. Ambulance 11A and 11B (also our rescue). Our Mutual Aid is Station 10, E11, E12, L113, A14, R15, Chief 16, 17, 18, and 19. Anybody care to share theirs? For any further info on the system our County uses click on our homepage which can be found at the bottom of this post (cheap plug), I have both the "official lists", 10 code lists, and the Lists actually in use by the units in the County. On a secondary subject as well: Plain language vs. codes, your opinions??? I seem to be outvoted on this one so far. I prefer all codes and #'s. What do you think???



Maybe you should get into the 90's and read a little about incident command. "10" codes have gone the way of the dinosaur...

[St11FireEMS]

We just usually use plain english so no one gets confused. our county has assigned to our different departments. my department number is 11. our units in the county go by the following:
station number then unit type then unit number for example
1112 is our engine
11 is the department
1 shows its an engine
2 is the id number
0 chief, 1 engine, 2 ladder, 3 tanker, 4 brush, 5 rescue, 6 ambulance, 7 utility, 8 fire police, 9 unit portables Emergency ID #

[LtStick]

Our county use to use two sets of numbers; The first set was your station number the second was for the type of unit you responded or which officer you were.
the numbering for aparatus was as follows;
Engines were 11 through 14
Towers or snorkels were 16
Ladder trucks and Tele squirts were 17
Rescues 18
QRS units 19
Tankers 20,21
pumper tankers 22,23
Squads 24
Engine Rescues 29
Fire Police vehicle 31
Ambulances 51-54, 61

line Officers 00-05
fire police 07-09
ambulance chief 50
rescue chief 55

Only Police and County EMA normally used the ten code sysytem.

Currently Fire units call out using there the type of unit it is and station number . IE Truck 22 Responding or if its a line officer then it would be there title and there station number. IE Captain 25 responding. They did not change the system for Fire Police and EMS.

[E_man9RFD]

I think 10-codes are obsolete. unfortunately, the county I'm in uses them. Plain english is more professional, in my opinion.



------------------
AAD
Eng. Co. 9
RFD

"In all of us there are heroes... speak to them and they will come forth."

"In order for us to achieve all that is demanded of us, we must regard ourselves as greater than we are."

[18f17]

we just use engine 1, rescue 1, etc.. When on a mutual aid we use dept. name then engine 1. Each person has a county number ie. battalion 18, firefighter # 17 = 18f17. Clear text is the only way to go in my opion.

[CaptainCarp]

To many numbers already,stick with the plain text. As far as the numbering goes our Department is numbered like this.

First 1-2 numbers indicate Dept. 3rd number is the station number. And last number is the type. 1-4 Engines 5-Ladder 6-Tankers 7-Rescues 8-Utlitys 9-Aid Cars

5511-Engine
5512-Engine
5516-Tanker
5519 Aid Car ETC.
This way you know what type of equip. and were it is coming from during mutual aid calls. Seems to work for us. But remember if it ain't broke don't fix it.

[570eck]

first for the short part.
i prefer plain language it keeps the confusion to a min. and the whackers off the radio, there is something about the numbers that gives them a wood? I dunno!

second we have a # syestem similar to some others i have seen posted

Ex. 5730
57 is station #
30 is a pumper 500-1500 gpm 500-1500 gwt

the 57 leads off every unit and officer

the second set of #'s is as follows

00-09 line officers 00 chief 01 asst. 02 capt. etc.
10-19 command vehicles
20-29 mini pumpers\Brush units
30-39 pumpers 500-1500 gpm & gwt
40-49 super pumpers 1500+ gpm & gwt
50-54 snorkels
55-59 quints, ladders, towers, tillers
60-69 not used can be for amb. medic
70-79 Rescues
80-89 Tankers
90-95 Special resource, flood trucks
96-98 boats
99 would be base sta. radio

i feel these are flexible to most areas and give you a half decent idea of what you have coming for mutial aid, you might not know how much hose you got coming but you know the truck will fill a certian need. this is in an area where most co.s are vol. and might not apply to cities that have all paid dept.s but then again it probably could.

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the truth never hides for long

[12865]

in PG County maryland units are designated thus:
ex.
Station 8 units
Chiefs - #, #A, #B (Chief 8,8A,8B)
Engines 1-5 (engine 81,82,83)
Ambulance 8-9 (ambulance 88,89)
Squad 8, truck 8 etc...

the only "codes" that PG uses are these:

Level 1 Operations - working fire
Level 1 Stage - take normal fireground positions, lay out but stay in the rig
Level 2 Stage - Stage at a designated point, do not layout and do not get out of the rig

[FFSThomas]

I know there are alot of differences in East Coast and West Coast Departments, but the East seems to use the most diverse numbering and 10 code systems around. Here in the south West it's straight forward, unit type, then number-"Engine/Truck/Squad/Rescue-1 or 11 or 111 or 1111".
I hate the 4 diget unit id, "Engine 2314" the 23 is the dept, 1 is an engine,4 is the station!!?!! Stupid!! This taken from the Cal Dept Forstry,
The 10 codes seem to work for FDNY who doesn't need any help from any other depts but most of So. CA relies on other depts for auto aid and we all use the ICS.

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[postal79]

our county number is not used when we call in for local calls,, only when we go on mutual aid. as for codes we have used them forever but it is changing in the last year we are now using plain english

[One13Truck]

As I've said, codes work great for us... But what works good one place is a disaster for other places. Our County does all use the same code system though (okay Wilkes Barre City uses a code for in quarters nobody else uses but very rarely is mautal aid needed/provided by them) so they have a universal County-wide meaning to them. Makes for a lot less radio traffic.

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Edwardsville Emergency Services, Station 10
We came, we saw, WE KICKED IT'S *****!!!

[One13Truck]

As I've said, codes work great for us... But what works good one place is a disaster for other places. Our County does all use the same code system though (okay Wilkes Barre City uses a code for in quarters nobody else uses but very rarely is mutual aid needed/provided by them) so they have a universal County-wide meaning to them. Makes for a lot less radio traffic.

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Edwardsville Emergency Services, Station 10
We came, we saw, WE KICKED IT'S *****!!!

[Eng522ine]

My town uses plain english on the radio to comply with ICS but, this is a recent thing (2 years ago). Prior to plain english, we used 10-codes. The main problem that I've noticed with the transition is that we have some members that seem to love to hear their own voice so, they turn what could be a 5 second message into a 3 minute dissertation with a ton of things that nobody really needed to or cared to know.

As far as truck numbering goes, our system seems overly complicated when it's written but its rather simple in use. OK, in all honesty, it IS extremely complicated on paper and all but impossible to explain but there is a rhyme and reason to it and it works for us. It's similar some described here and it's also similar to systems used by our neighboring towns. Our unit numbers use the second digit of our county district number (35) for the first digit (we only get the second number because the cops use a similar system and they don't want duplicate unit numbers). The second number is the company number that the apparatus is assigned to (1-5). Here's where it gets REALLY strange... IF the second number is 1-5 and the third number is a zero the unit is an ambulance, if the second number is a 6 it's the department chief. Nevermind this... if you really want to see it check out our pathetic homepage at: www.fire@rockawaytownship.org/fire/fire_department.html (http://www.fire@rockawaytownship.org/fire/fire_department.html)

See?? Even our site address is overly complicated!!! I guess it's just they way they do things around here.

[This message has been edited by Eng522ine (edited 03-20-2001).]