How Do You Get The Door To Come Off?

[rmoore]

A Posting by Ron Moore, Forum Moderator
Rmoore@firehouse.com

The process of attacking a jammed door at the hinges is becoming more popular among extrication crews. This technique works well for situations such as a door crushed in towards a trapped patient or when there is a loaded side impact airbag in the door. It's not difficult to expose the hinges and attack them with cutting or even spreading tools.

So now you've got the door broken loose at the hinges and you've cut through that wiring harness. How do you get the door to come off the car? What do you do in your department to release it at the Nader latch side?

Enquiring minds want to know.

[e33]

Pop it like normal, or cut the pin. Now that you have broken the higkes you can sort of guide the forces of the door by spreading it out and away from the patient. With our new hydraulic cutter, snapping the pin is cakework, or with a lennox 650R blade on a tiger saw....same deal. The other less frquently used option we use it to completely remove the "b" post with the front door still attached....it really depends on the situation.

[LifeRescue]

All of the above. Also, I expose the hinges and use an impact wrench to remove the bolts if possible. Another thing to try...Loosen up the bolts on the hinges, but don't remove them. This takes the pressure off the Nader pin/latch assembly. Try opening the door with the door handle like normal. If you need to break the hinges, break them, push the door back into place with the help of another rescuer, and try releasing the door handle latch. Doesn't always work, but sometimes it can save you the trouble of breaking apart the door and/or the Nader pin/latch assembly. It can be safer, and a lot easier on the patient with regard to noise and the impact of breaking the door.

[This message has been edited by LifeRescue (edited March 06, 1999).]

[SCCARESCUE]

My experience has been to cut/break the hinges and wire harness, then pull the hinge end of the door out a couple of inches and use the spreaders ABOVE the Nader pin and spread. Reposition and spread from the bottom if necessary, then finish with a final spread at the top. The door is popped off and the energy is directed towards the ground. But as stated above, sometimes ya just gotta be creative.

[ccc530]

I agree. Just did it a couple months ago. I have found that if the hinge(s) are exposed, starting with the nader pin "door pop" is difficult and time consuming, due to the door overlapping the B post and/or body, thus losing your "purchase point". I think that it is quicker to work on the exposed hinges and either cut or pop them (if you have the extra tools and manpower, have them start working the nader pin at the same time as long as it doesn't conflict). Be willing to try different things and most of all: watch out for pride and tunnel vision. It should always be a team effort and if what you're doing isn't working, then all ideas should be considered.

[This message has been edited by ccc530 (edited March 05, 1999).]

[This message has been edited by ccc530 (edited March 05, 1999).]

[This message has been edited by ccc530 (edited March 05, 1999).]

[unit3sfd]

I love to start at the hinges seems like the door does not absorb the force since it can't move around freely. Seems like the nader pin is the only problem (not Really) we simply place a wedge in the inside of the door lever in the passenger compartment so that when the force takes the hinges if it works right the nader pin will be released and the door usually comes off the pin also. doesn't work all the time but sure is nice when it does. Still using the wedge makes it easier to spread the door off of the pin, no need to fight the latching mech. if its still working. Just making it easier.

[Jim Greene]

Well Ron up here in this little town , after dissconecting the door by the hinges, we would try to cut the Nadar with a sew-zall if we got the room. If not we would spread the door in between it's self & the B post to either pop the door off the Nadar or to get more room to cut the Nadar with the saw-zall.

[cra539]

Ron,
if you take the hinges first with the spreader used in a VERTICAL position, you roll the door away. The top hinges break first, followed by the bottom, after the bottom is broken, keep spreading until the door falls off, or you run out of spread. You might release or break the nader this way. If it didnt and you rolled the door way part way, spread at the nader. Cutting the bottom of the B post on a 4 door could allow for the removal of 2 doors at one time. Sawzall, 300 psi chisel or cutter could be used on the nader. We've used all of the above methods.

[Perry2085]

We usually will pry at the hinges if and get them to release. Then cut the wireing harness and then start to work on the nader pin. I have found that when we get the hinge side released that about 90% of the time it opens up the other side of the door. At that time we just use our Holmatro tool to pry away the door and then we look over the area and decide if we have to make a third door or cut the rear door out to gain better access.
Perry2085

[meegs]

Ron,
we have also had great success with attacking the door at the hinge side. With our new hydraulic tools we are able to roll the hinge side down and away from the pt. compartment. If you wedge the door handle on the inside pt. compartment with a sprinkler wedge, we have had success with it rolling of the nadar at times. If not, once the hinges fail and wiring harness is cut we can attack the nadar side. 9 out of 10 circumstances the door "pops", if not we go to cutters, sawzall or air chisel. All work well.

[This message has been edited by meegs (edited April 29, 1999).]

[Rescue 42]

Ron, if I read your question correctly, you are look at how we remove a door that is attached by the Nader Pin only?

I've found that removing the door from the hinge side normally leaves the door dangling loosely from the Nader pin. Our next procedure is to check that the door is unlocked, then simultaneously operate the interior and exterior door latch mechanisms. Unless the door is totally trashed, the lock releases off the Nader Pin, and you carry the door away. If the latch mechanisms are all disconnected inside the door, we might try prying the "wings" apart with a screwdriver to free the Nader Pin. After these methods failed, we would commence one of the fine cutting or spreading techniques mentioned by my colleagues above.

"Try Before You Pry" is our motto.

Tim O'Connell
Company 42
Butte County Fire

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www.rescue42.com (http://www.rescue42.com)

[RescueLogic]

Our department has typically removed the door from the hinged side after placing a piece of cut innertube around the inside door handle and over the locking mechanism. This keeps the handle under some tension allowing the door to open if the nader pin/door area should free up.

[smokediver65]

I teach the hinge attack in extrication class.After the hinges are broke, sometimes you can get the door off by trying the door handle. Just like opening the door regularly.If we can't get it that way then we use the jaws or cutters, whichever the situation calls for.

[the rookie]

Can you cut the nader or hinges with a regular hydralic cutter? Will this damage the tool?

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[J T Whidby]

Ron, Most times when we remove a door we do attack at the hinges, top first. But, prior to removal we trip (open) the inside and outside door handles.

We hold the handle open by selecting from a set of pre cut 3/4" angles. We have two of each length in 1/2" incriments from 1" to 5" carried on the hydraulic pump by a detachable ring.

When the latch is in the tripped or open position and the pressure is released by breaking or cutting the hinges, the door comes open. Therefore there is 0 time spent on the Nader pin or newer hasp or enclosed type latches.

This also eleminates the stress on cutters and or spreaders attaching the latch.

Both of our cutters will cut the latch reqardless wihich one it is, but why cut something that is hard steel when you can do it faster and safer?

J. T. Whidby
Canton, GA USA

[nbfd131]

Ron, it varies tool to tool as to weather they are rated to cut the nader pin. Most O-sears that are hinge rated can be used to cut the nader pins. As for what we do, We generally will use our old 32 inch hurst spreader and either expose the hinges for the O-sears or continue to spread the hinges until they fail. Then, if the door can't be opened manual (door handle), we'll used the O-sears to cut the nader pin, which is usually exposed. If not, here comes the spreaders again. Depends on the situation.
Gregg