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Kobersteen
10-06-2006, 11:38 AM
I have a question that has been circulating around several departments that I have worked for.

Should recruits (in the academy) be offered a chance to join the union?
If no, when?
If yes, when (beginning, middle, end of academy)?

Thanks...
Resq1scnd2none
10-06-2006, 12:08 PM
While I am not in/on a union. I would think recruits would need to wait until they are on? Meaning, they have been assigned. And maybe even through their probation period?
FFFRED
10-06-2006, 12:26 PM
I have a question that has been circulating around several departments that I have worked for.

Should recruits (in the academy) be offered a chance to join the union?
If no, when?
If yes, when (beginning, middle, end of academy)?

Thanks...

I'm a little confused...once you take your oath of office you are a member of the department and join the union (although you are on probation for a year and don't enjoy the same rights and job securty as a member off probation)

You don't join the union until after your probie school?

I don't remember when the Union offical came to us but I recall it was in the first week.

FTM-PTB
jasper45
10-06-2006, 12:27 PM
We take the oath, and are sworn into the Local during our first day of recruit school, and we all pay dues right away.
We also had an extensive presentation from a member of our E-board to explain the Local, the IAFF, grievance policies, member rights and responsibilities, and answers to any questions we had.
CaptainGonzo
10-06-2006, 03:23 PM
Almost ditto to Brothers Jasper and FFFred.

New Hires are voted into the Local at our monthly union meeting.

They have a 1 year probationary period, as as FFFred stated, they don't have the same protections and such until they reach their 1st anniversary of their date of hire. In my 25 years, we have only lost 2 firefighters during their probie year. One lost his driver's license ( job requirement) due to DWI and didn't tell anyone, the other took a short leave of absence for what he said was a "family problem" back in Jamaica, then requested a year, which was turned down. He never returned to duty.
SBrooks
10-06-2006, 04:54 PM
K, across the river, L36 comes in during the first week, but as mentioned, you don't have much protection. And, of course, while you pay the same dues as everyone, no one listens to new guys.

Of course, VA is right-to-work.
FWDbuff
10-06-2006, 09:00 PM
Getting a paycheck? You have the right to be represented by the bargaining unit. Period.


(Now.....You also have the right to a probationary period in the union as well.....And all the accompanying requirements such as keeping thy yap shut, etc.....)
fyrmnk
10-06-2006, 09:40 PM
We used to wait until ours were off probation. We've since reduced that and now they can join upon successful completion of the academy. We do also meet with them in the academy to tell them about our Local and when and how to join.

We are not recognized and in a right to work state here.
Kobersteen
10-07-2006, 09:17 AM
Okay, a couple of you have said something along the lines of 'reduced protection'. How so?
SBrooks
10-07-2006, 10:11 AM
During the first year, you're on probation with the city, and can be fired at will. There's not much the Union can do for you. Don't know how it works in VA.
MIKEYLIKESIT
10-07-2006, 12:22 PM
Our probationary firefighters also become union members. They should be paying dues to support the contract that they are benefitting from. Here in Illinois, probationary firefighters can get fired within the first year and basically do not have recourse. Cities aren't stupid. They spent a lot of money to get this person hired. There is always a good reason if a probie gets canned. The Union will fight it if this not the case. It is common practice for probationary members to join the local in this area. The city begins payroll dues deduction immediately, unless the probationary firefighter decides to go fair share. That dosent happen around here.
Smoke20286
10-08-2006, 09:04 AM
On date of hire our recruits draw for seniority and are welcomed into the union. Officially they are sworn in at the first union meeting they attend
fireman8611
10-09-2006, 10:54 PM
During the first year, you're on probation with the city, and can be fired at will. There's not much the Union can do for you. Don't know how it works in VA.


Same here. You start paying dues the day after your 1 year hire date. Don't recall anyone being let go inside thier year. City has put too much money in them.

L495
mikeyboy
10-10-2006, 12:22 AM
Both of my Departments views are that once you are off probation, then you are no longer an At-will employee and are welcomed into the Union.
Smoke20286
10-10-2006, 06:30 AM
In Canada any union local which accepts union dues from an employee has a "duty of fair representation"
KyleWickman
10-12-2006, 10:33 PM
Are rookies also join the union. *but* as mentioned here you are an at will employee your 1st year. We are members of the www.njfmba.org
BFire31
10-18-2006, 09:03 PM
In Dayton, OH (Local 136) you don't join the Union until completing the academy and a 6-month probation. I'm not sure if it's always been that way or not, but it is currently.

www.iaff136.org
HenryChan
10-19-2006, 11:35 PM
What's the current process for Fairfax County? Are recruits allowed membership while in the academy? Or, are they required to wait until assignment or post-probation?
thelife
10-21-2006, 10:40 AM
What's the current process for Fairfax County? Are recruits allowed membership while in the academy? Or, are they required to wait until assignment or post-probation?

Recruits are permitted to join the Union while in the Academy.
Jonathan Bastian
10-24-2006, 12:11 PM
I have a question that has been circulating around several departments that I have worked for.

Should recruits (in the academy) be offered a chance to join the union?
If no, when?
If yes, when (beginning, middle, end of academy)?

Thanks...

While not an exact comparison, my PD allows recruits to join the union after they are sworn in as police officers. We have 6 months prior to swearing in and another month in the academy after that. However, the contract provides little protection to probationary officers. Probation lasts 12 months from swear in (not hire) date.

Because we are covered by collective bargaining, officers that do not join the union are asseessed "fair share" charges for the contract.
DeputyMarshal
10-28-2006, 04:17 PM
Getting a paycheck? You have the right to be represented by the bargaining unit. Period.

Couldn't have said it better. :)
SPFDRum
10-28-2006, 06:58 PM
In St. paul, the recruits are not in the union as a sworn member, but the union will still represent them as if they where fair-share.
On the last week, the recruits get their applications and sign up, then at the next meeting after the academy, they are sworn in and recieve all voting and representation privilages.
UAFIRE1999
10-28-2006, 08:21 PM
In Ohio, in accordance with the Ohio Revised Code - we can not start collecting union dues until the member has completed 60 days of employment {ORC Section 4117.09 (C)}. They are "at will" employees until they complete 12 months of probation. None the less, from day one they otherwise enjoy the benefits of the contract other than job protection.
Smoke20286
10-31-2006, 08:22 PM
In St. paul, the recruits are not in the union as a sworn member, but the union will still represent them as if they where fair-share.
On the last week, the recruits get their applications and sign up, then at the next meeting after the academy, they are sworn in and recieve all voting and representation privilages.

Didn't you guys have a lot of trouble with that "fairshare" thing?