Thread: Well Stretch

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    Default Well Stretch

    Hey All - Our most common fire is in a 700 sq ft slab ranch house.

    On the occassion that we have fires in multi-story buildings we generally lay the hose to the outside of the stairs from the ground level. This consumes a lot of hose with a high "kink" potential.

    I'd like info from guys that regularly use well stretches about using this type of stretch - hose estimation, how to make it work better, etc.

    Thanks

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    Quote Originally Posted by Geinandputitout View Post
    Hey All - Our most common fire is in a 700 sq ft slab ranch house.

    On the occassion that we have fires in multi-story buildings we generally lay the hose to the outside of the stairs from the ground level. This consumes a lot of hose with a high "kink" potential.

    I'd like info from guys that regularly use well stretches about using this type of stretch - hose estimation, how to make it work better, etc.

    Thanks
    The engines in my department use the well stretch pretty routinely.

    You can really only perform it on certain types of buildings. Not every multi-storied multiple dwelling will lend itself to this tactic.

    You need an open stairwell and you need a "well" wide enough that the hose can pass through it and be charged without gettting stuck.This type of stairwell is typically found in new-law tenements. Fire-proof muiltiple will have enclosed stairwells and typically concrete stairwells without wells.

    It will really only require one length to make it all the way up to the fifth floor of a tenement, as opposed to conventional stretches that often assume a length per floor. What needs to be determined is how far is the base of the stairwell from the engine, and how many lengths will you need to make the fire apartment from the top of the stairwell.

    Getting the nozzle up the stairs is definitely something that a company needs to practice. Your manpower would dictate how ot best accomplish this. But basically you are running the hope straight up to the top of the stairs, or whatever floor you are going to, through the opening between the railings (the well). You must also secure the hose to the railing at the top of the steps, otherwise you will be fighting gravity and the weight of a length of charges hose standing vertically.

    Hard to explain. Much easier to see it in practice.

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    You also need to make sure when the second (back up) line is stretched it goes straight up. Other than that it'll be twisted around the first. When they're charged you'll have a braid that can't be advanced.

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    ive also heard the addage 1 length per 5 for a well. 1 length per floor for a return stair.

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    A good operation for these types of structures is to raise the hose line aloft via rope. ("Drop bagging", "Lines aloft via rope bag", etc.) Your company ascends the stairs with the appropriate equipment, with or without hose depending on the operation. If the hallways of the fire floor have been filled with smoke/fire and the door to the fire room cannot be controlled, you throw your rope bag to the ground from the floor below the fire floor, whether from a window in a stairwell or balcony/window of a unit on this floor. A FF on the ground ties off the nozzle. The FFs who threw the rope bag raise the nozzle and pull the appropriate amount of hose to the area below the fire floor, which allows them to only have to move hose up one floor to the fire floor. If the door to the room on fire can be controlled and the hallway is tenable (and no fire over head), you drop bag to the fire floor and pull the hose directly to the unit/occupancy on fire. After the necessary amount of hose has been pulled, it is tied off, then charged. This is a quick operation, which obviously avoids the problems when hose is extended up stairwells: kinks, multiple personnel needed to extend the lines up multiple floors, more hose, etc. We drop bag on structures 3 stories or higher, up to 6floors, especially if dry standpipes are installed in a building. We don't trust dry standpipes, for obvious reasons, and will use wet standpipes on high rise buildings. We will also ascend the stairs with a high rise pack (1 3/4), then throw our drop bag to the ground and raise a 2 1/2 with a gated wye to the floor below the fire or floor with the occupancy on fire, again based on smoke/fire conditions. This allows two attack lines off the gated wye, simulating a standpipe. 3 excellent articles were written in "Fire Engineering" called "Hoseline Aloft Parts 1, 2, 3 and 4", with pictures as well. Good luck.

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    Just carry it up the stairs. Also make sure you have a hose strap or the guys upstairs are gonna have a tough time advancing that line. One length per 5 floors is a good estimation, then 2 for the fire floor depending on the size of the building.

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    For the bottle stretch, which can be used from inside the stair well if you have a window that is accessible from the front or side of the building, take a clorox bottle and cut of part of the top and side, to make it like a scoop just make sure to leave the top where the cap goes on. Put your rope in that coiled up with the end with a bowline on it, which should be on both ends. Now just open window on floor below fire, drop bottle have members attach nozzle to rope and hoist.

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    Why would anyone need to stretch a hose into a well? There's already water down there...

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    here is an excellent resource. http://www.sageauthoring.com/fdny/fdny1.htm .we have a 5 story parking garage that allows us to use it as a training tower in my first due. try in places like that or places with service stair wells.
    PM if you want for more

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    We trained on the rope drop/hose hoist evolution a couple of weeks ago at the tower. Two shifts ago we used it for fire on the third floor. We got the line in operation just as the truckies got the door forced. It was a very fast and effective evolution. Truckies pulled the occupant out, we put the fire out, everyone was happy. Except the occupant, she was sleeping off her buzz. Seriously though, if you don't train on this simple evolution, you won't be comfortable with it, but it is so easy, it should seriously be considered more times than one might think.

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    Quote Originally Posted by GregMasters View Post
    Why would anyone need to stretch a hose into a well? There's already water down there...
    must be a dry well...
    I guess you gotta fill it up before you can get it out

    Puttin the wet stuff on the red stuff!

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    I am having a hard time picturing this. Anyone have any links?
    Career Firefighter
    Volunteer Captain

    -Professional in Either Role-

    Quote Originally Posted by Rescue101 View Post
    I don't mind fire rolling over my head. I just don't like it rolling UNDER my a**.

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    does this help
    Attached Images Attached Images  
    Originally Posted by madden01
    "and everyone is encouraged to use Plain, Spelled Out English. I thought this was covered in NIMS training."

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    http://www.sageauthoring.com/fdny/ft&p/ftpeng08.pdf the only thing to mention in the picture is that you need to support the coupling or tie it off using a rope or strap
    Originally Posted by madden01
    "and everyone is encouraged to use Plain, Spelled Out English. I thought this was covered in NIMS training."

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    We figure one length for four floors and at least two lengths for the fire floor and maybe more. You need to tie the hose off at a coupling to hold it in place.

    Stretching this way keeps the hose line off the stairs and makes it easy for the members to get up and down and if civilians are using the stairs to evacuate they will have a clear path and won’t have to watch for the hose under the feet.
    Stay Safe and Well Out There....

    Always remembering 9-11-2001 and 343+ Brothers

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    Quote Originally Posted by ffmedcbk1 View Post
    does this help
    Perfect!!!!
    ‎"The education of a firefighter and the continued education of a firefighter is what makes "real" firefighters. Continuous skill development is the core of progressive firefighting. We learn by doing and doing it again and again, both on the training ground and the fireground."
    Lt. Ray McCormack, FDNY

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