Ok so we had a structure fire tonight. 2 story structure, Flames showing from 1 and 2 floor on B & C side of structure. Smoke throughout structure.
My partner and I got the rear structure knocked down w/ a 1 3/4 line without to much difficulty. Second story B/C corner was put out well due to angle. And yes I tried my best to indirectly hit the fire. No dice though. So I was told to set up another ladder at the B/A corner window, take a line inside, search for possible victims and try to knock down B/C corner from inside.
Well myself and 3 other FF from another company got inside and made our way down the hall way, knowing that we had an escape route from which we came in and also another escape route through the A side window that was close to A/B corner with a ladder.
Well we were in there for approx. 5 minutes when it started getting really hot. Apparently the fire had gone right over us and was blowing through the roof.
Command blew the evacuation siren and I lead my team back to the entrance window from wince we came. Command blew the siren again, which for us means get H3LL out!! well I had 2 FF blocking the entrance window and had 3rd FF waiting to get out, well I told that FF to go out the A side window that was near the A/B corner and go down the ladder setup there. I to went out this window.
Got on the ground and I had an officer up my butt telling I should have gone out the same window as the other 2. I told him that we could not wait for those guys to get because it was getting extremely hot in there and was time to get out, besides the siren had gone off twice and that means evacuate immediately. He did like that answer and scolded off. I was waiting for him to tell me to go back to fire school. I wasn't given the opportunity to find him and let him know that we were all out.
My question is this...
What would you have done in this situation? Would you have found an alternate route or wait?
Be brutal. I'm a big boy and can accept if I'm wrong.
Besides I've taken his advice into account anyway. I'd probably do the same thing again but made sure I got to him a little faster letting him know we were all out.
What do you think?
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Thread: Your opinion please.
08-28-2008, 01:39 AM #1
Your opinion please."Courage is the resistance to fear, the mastery of fear, not the lack of fear." Mark Twain"If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough." Uknown
08-28-2008, 06:20 AM #2
You were in the room. He wasn't.
You got out safely and were able to post the story.
Good enough answer for you?"The education of a firefighter and the continued education of a firefighter is what makes "real" firefighters. Continuous skill development is the core of progressive firefighting. We learn by doing and doing it again and again, both on the training ground and the fireground."
Lt. Ray McCormack, FDNY
08-28-2008, 07:11 AM #3
When the poop hits the fan, and the everybody out is sounded, you get the h3ll out, period. In the end, does it matter how you got out? No. As long as you still have all your fingers and toes, and that you meet up with your team (sector boss, company officer, whatever) and then ultimately the accountability officer.
Was this clown a member of your company? If not, do you know who he was? Did you report the incident through your chain of command? Make sure your chief knows about it.
If he is a member of your company, next time you see him (perhaps at a drill or whenever) and approach him in a non-confrontational manner, ask for a moment of his time, and go someplace where you can be alone. Ask him what that was all about- what did you do that got him so excited? Find out his side of the story, listen, and try to come to amicable conclusion.
It might be hard, but also indicate to him that the fireground is NOT the place to issue a scolding. Let him know next time to wait for an opportunity to do it quietly and in private, or the next time you will call HIM on the carpet in front of the Chief."Loyalty Above all Else. Except Honor."
08-28-2008, 03:41 PM #4
any other opinions?"Courage is the resistance to fear, the mastery of fear, not the lack of fear." Mark Twain"If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough." Uknown
08-28-2008, 03:47 PM #5
- Join Date
- Mar 2004
From you first post you stated taht the other firefighters were getting out the window. So you can safely assume that they were going to get out. I think you did no wrong and no one was hurt. If they hadn't been escaping and you left them that is a different story.
08-28-2008, 04:08 PM #6
You did what you what you had to do to get out safely. Would he have rather you remained in the room and suffered burns, simply because your original means of entry/egress was blocked?
I say good job making a decision in the heat of battle (no pun intended).Career Fire Captain
Volunteer Chief Officer
Never taking for granted that I'm privileged enough to have the greatest job in the world!
08-28-2008, 04:37 PM #7"Courage is the resistance to fear, the mastery of fear, not the lack of fear." Mark Twain"If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough." Uknown
08-28-2008, 06:14 PM #8
- Join Date
- Apr 2003
08-28-2008, 07:01 PM #9
- Join Date
- Jan 2007
- Green Bay
I agree with the general consensus here. Why have a secondary means of egress if you are not going to use it when you have to. Some people just have to be right though, even when they are clearly wrong.The thoughts and opinions posted here are mine and mine alone and do not reflect the thoughts and or views of city or dept affiliation.
08-28-2008, 07:14 PM #10
Perhaps not your call, but the primary search should have been attempted or accomplished BEFORE you tried to extinguish any of the fire from the exterior.
Maybe it looked worse before the pictures were taken, but I cannot see a reason to be blowing horns or sirens ordering everyone out of the building.RK
Management is making sure things are done right. Leadership is doing the right thing. The fire service needs alot more leaders and a lot less managers.
"Everyone goes home" is the mantra for the pussification of the modern, American fire service.
Comments made are my own. They do not represent the official position or opinion of the Fire Department or the City for which I am employed. In fact, they are normally exactly the opposite.
08-28-2008, 08:00 PM #11
Robert I agree ..............on both counts.IACOJ both divisions and PROUD OF IT !
Pardon me sir.. .....but I believe we are all over here !
ATTENTION ALL SHOPPERS: Will the dead horse please report to the forums.(thanks Motown)
RAY WAS HERE 08/28/05
LETHA' FOREVA' ! 010607
I'm sorry, I haven't been paying much attention for the last 3 hours.....what were we discussing?
"but I guarentee you I will FF your arse off" from>
08-28-2008, 08:42 PM #12
I'm not 100% sure on the reason they blew the evacuation siren, but from my understanding is they didn't want anyone inside due to the possiblity of flashover and they had setup a master stream from station 100 and didn't want anyone getting hit with 800 gal. per minute.
I had done a primary search on the second floor. unfortunately only was able when more crews got on scene. That was why we did a knock down before a search on the 2nd floor."Courage is the resistance to fear, the mastery of fear, not the lack of fear." Mark Twain"If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough." Uknown
08-28-2008, 09:09 PM #13AJ, MICP, FireMedic
This message has been made longer, in part from a grant from the You Are a Freaking Moron Foundation.
08-29-2008, 08:09 AM #14
Yeah, but he's i think was more worried about his guys i'd assume. I just wanted to make sure i was right in my decision."Courage is the resistance to fear, the mastery of fear, not the lack of fear." Mark Twain"If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough." Uknown
08-29-2008, 07:53 PM #15
Thanks for the opinions all. I appreciate it a lot."Courage is the resistance to fear, the mastery of fear, not the lack of fear." Mark Twain"If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough." Uknown
08-29-2008, 09:12 PM #16
- Join Date
- May 2000
- Harrington, DE
Chris...Everyone got out alive and unhurt...you should sleep well tonight. So should the officer(s). Some things don't always matter in every situation...that was probably one of them.
Last edited by davjohnson; 08-29-2008 at 09:16 PM.
08-30-2008, 01:16 AM #17
Everyone Goes Home.
Everyone did. You did what you had to do to get out. If there was no urgency to get out, sure, take your time and follow the others. On the other hand, if you have to get out, and get out NOW, you do it by any means necessary. Plus, you did your duty to make sure everyone got out. I say good job!
I don't see a problem here.Jason Knecht
Altoona Fire Dept.
IACOJ - Director of Cheese and Whine
EAT CHEESE OR DIE!!
08-30-2008, 09:03 AM #18"Courage is the resistance to fear, the mastery of fear, not the lack of fear." Mark Twain"If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough." Uknown
08-30-2008, 09:40 AM #19
- Join Date
- Nov 2006
- Cupcake NY
Explain to him one of the basics of physics, no two pieces of matter can occupy the same space at the same time!
08-30-2008, 10:01 AM #20
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