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Thread: McCain VP PIck

  1. #1461
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    Quote Originally Posted by txgp17 View Post
    Not true.
    Truman (a Democrat) was sending Military Advisers to Vietnam. The real escalation came under Kennedy, and even then, Eisenhower recommended that he fight it like a real war, or get out of Vietnam.

    Based on the data presented by the Heritage Foundation here, I created a graph showing US Troops levels in Vietnam by year. Kennedy took office in 61'. View the full size image here.

    Attachment 15544
    Thanks for helping with the facts. I was about to go there. Liberal spin is a terrible thing.


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    The American people will never knowingly adopt Socialism. But under the name of 'liberalism' they will adopt every fragment of the Socialist program, until one day America will be a Socialist nation, without knowing how it happened. --Norman Mattoon Thomas, 6 time presidential candidate for the Socialist Party of America

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    Quote Originally Posted by scfire86 View Post
    What does this have to do with Iraq?
    It doesn't matter, we all know what it has to do with Iraq, but you'll deny it. There's no point.
    The American people will never knowingly adopt Socialism. But under the name of 'liberalism' they will adopt every fragment of the Socialist program, until one day America will be a Socialist nation, without knowing how it happened. --Norman Mattoon Thomas, 6 time presidential candidate for the Socialist Party of America

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    Quote Originally Posted by scfire86 View Post
    I'm curious, CKN: Why is Iraq about the US "winning"?
    It doesn't matter, we all know what winning in Iraq is about, but you'll deny it. There's no point.
    The American people will never knowingly adopt Socialism. But under the name of 'liberalism' they will adopt every fragment of the Socialist program, until one day America will be a Socialist nation, without knowing how it happened. --Norman Mattoon Thomas, 6 time presidential candidate for the Socialist Party of America

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    Quote Originally Posted by ScareCrow57 View Post
    See what happens when you use WIKI. However, the quote shows up in both forms. Regardless, JFK came up with Trickle down before Reagan Implemented it. It's a Democratic pilosophy.
    Reagan also raised taxes four times when he realized there wasn't enough trickling down to support the expanded government he had created.

    Quote Originally Posted by ScareCrow57 View Post
    So what. You are listening to a man who walked the walk. As opposed to a man who talks the talk (aka Obama)
    And what of the people who live there that want us out? The majority of Iraqis want us out ASAP. Do they have no say? Or are we to let the isolated experiences of a single soldier on the ground dictate policy? And how much should I be asked to pay for something he believes is the right thing?

    As I asked CKN. How much more in taxes are you willing to pay to support this effort costing over $10B/month?
    Last edited by scfire86; 11-02-2008 at 11:29 AM.
    Politics is like driving. To go forward select "D", to go backward select "R."

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    Quote Originally Posted by ScareCrow57 View Post
    Not Anecdotal at all. It is fact and proof of how inefficient Government is.
    So one experience is indicative of the entire system? What kind of engineer are you? A domestic engineer?

    Quote Originally Posted by ScareCrow57 View Post
    Your complaint is about the billions we are spending on the NATO exercise in Iraq. I merely showed you that we are spending far more propping up other countries as well. Your only real beef with Iraq is that George W Bush did it instead of William Jefferson Clinton or Barack Husein Obama.
    Your chart shows otherwise. No expenditures even come close to the Iraq War.
    Politics is like driving. To go forward select "D", to go backward select "R."

  7. #1467
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    Quote Originally Posted by ScareCrow57 View Post
    Thanks for helping with the facts. I was about to go there. Liberal spin is a terrible thing.
    What this really means.

    "I made a claim of fact before ensuring its accuracy and blamed it on liberals (even though I claim to believe in personal responsibility), even though none of the liberals on this board claimed it as fact." Or, "I have no idea what I'm talking about."
    Politics is like driving. To go forward select "D", to go backward select "R."

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    Quote Originally Posted by scfire86 View Post
    Reagan also raised taxes four times when he realized there wasn't enough trickling down to support the expanded government he had created.
    Can you please cite your source on this? I'd like to know when Reagan stated this.


    Quote Originally Posted by scfire86 View Post
    And what of the people who live there that want us out? The majority of Iraqis want us out ASAP. Do they have no say? Or are we to let the isolated experiences of a single soldier on the ground dictate policy? And how much should I be asked to pay for something he believes is the right thing?
    OH, they want us out! Oh, well then we should leave. Gosh, I didn't realize that the country we invaded wants us out.... golly gee.

    As for your opinion about getting out. Fine, run for congress and then you get a say. A majority of congress authorized and continues to authorize it. As a representative democracy, that is how these things are decided.

    The majority believe that it was the right thing and staying there continues to be the right thing.

    Quote Originally Posted by scfire86 View Post
    As I asked CKN. How much more in taxes are you willing to pay to support this effort costing over $10B/month?
    Actually, this is really one of the most basic things that taxes are supposed to be used for. The military and supporting our interests in the region.

    I can't possibly come up with an amount, I won't profess to being that involved in the process of planning a war.

    However, so far the investment as part of the overall ware on terror seems to be very effective based on the results. To which, we should all thank those who serve.
    I am now a past chief and the views, opinions, and comments are mine and mine alone. I do not speak for any department or in any official capacity. Although, they would be smart to listen to me.

    "The last thing I want to do is hurt you. But it's still on the list."

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    Quote Originally Posted by ChiefKN View Post
    Can you please cite your source on this? I'd like to know when Reagan stated this.
    This should help. You'll probably blow it off as untrue.

    Excerpt:

    Faced with looming deficits, Reagan raised taxes again in 1983 with a gasoline tax and once more in 1984, this time by $50 billion over three years, mainly through closing tax loopholes for business. Despite the fact that such increases were anathema to conservatives--and probably cost Reagan's successor, George H.W. Bush, reelection--Reagan raised taxes a grand total of four times just between 1982-84.


    Quote Originally Posted by ChiefKN View Post
    OH, they want us out! Oh, well then we should leave. Gosh, I didn't realize that the country we invaded wants us out.... golly gee.
    Yes. They've done a great job of letting everyone know but you.

    Quote Originally Posted by ChiefKN View Post
    As for your opinion about getting out. Fine, run for congress and then you get a say. A majority of congress authorized and continues to authorize it. As a representative democracy, that is how these things are decided.
    And I'm voting for a congressional candidate who supports that belief. And she just might pick off a nine term GOP congressman who supports the war.

    Quote Originally Posted by ChiefKN View Post
    The majority believe that it was the right thing and staying there continues to be the right thing.
    Majority of who? Defense contractors? The majority of Americans are wanting out immediately.

    Quote Originally Posted by ChiefKN View Post
    Actually, this is really one of the most basic things that taxes are supposed to be used for. The military and supporting our interests in the region.
    What interests? I thought we were there to bring freedom and democracy to the oppressed Iraqi peoples. They have both and we are still there hemorraging red ink.

    Quote Originally Posted by ChiefKN View Post
    However, so far the investment as part of the overall ware on terror seems to be very effective based on the results. To which, we should all thank those who serve.
    I am very thankful for those who serve. How has invading and overturning a country that had nothing to do with terrorist acts committed in America be considered effective? That's a lot of water to carry (at $10B+/mo) and you're not Gunga Din.
    Politics is like driving. To go forward select "D", to go backward select "R."

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    Quote Originally Posted by scfire86 View Post
    Saw it. So what? The military works for the civilian authority in our country. And I love how conclusions about an entire nation of people are drawn from anecdotal experiences.
    So what? The guy is actually out there fighting this war. 80% of his brothers and sisters in the military agree with him that McCain is the person to lead as Commander-in-Chief.

    Sadly, many of their votes won't even be counted for some reason or another. 98% of Virginia's soldiers are expected to have their absentee ballots discarded because they have to have a notary witness their vote. Not many of them out there in the field, are there. I think it was another 50-60% of military votes that haven't been delivered or won't be delivered in time to count.

  11. #1471
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    Quote Originally Posted by scfire86
    Faced with looming deficits, Reagan raised taxes again in 1983 with a gasoline tax and once more in 1984, this time by $50 billion over three years, mainly through closing tax loopholes for business. Despite the fact that such increases were anathema to conservatives--and probably cost Reagan's successor, George H.W. Bush, reelection--Reagan raised taxes a grand total of four times just between 1982-84. [/I]
    Your original statement, in case you forgot.

    Quote Originally Posted by scfire86
    Reagan also raised taxes four times when he realized there wasn't enough trickling down to support the expanded government he had created.
    That author seems to think that is why he did it, but you claimed that Reagan made that statement.

    Can you show me where Reagan made the statement about why he raised those taxes?


    Quote Originally Posted by scfire86 View Post
    Majority of who? Defense contractors? The majority of Americans are wanting out immediately.
    My comments were about the majority in congress who continue to support the war.

    Quote Originally Posted by scfire86 View Post
    What interests? I thought we were there to bring freedom and democracy to the oppressed Iraqi peoples. They have both and we are still there hemorraging red ink.


    I am very thankful for those who serve. How has invading and overturning a country that had nothing to do with terrorist acts committed in America be considered effective? That's a lot of water to carry (at $10B+/mo) and you're not Gunga Din.
    Seems like a lot of dead terrorists in Iraq. Each one is one less that may try to come here and perpetrate attacks on our soil.
    I am now a past chief and the views, opinions, and comments are mine and mine alone. I do not speak for any department or in any official capacity. Although, they would be smart to listen to me.

    "The last thing I want to do is hurt you. But it's still on the list."

    "When tempted to fight fire with fire, remember that the Fire Department usually uses water."

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    Quote Originally Posted by ChiefKN View Post


    Seems like a lot of dead terrorists in Iraq. Each one is one less that may try to come here and perpetrate attacks on our soil.
    Another fallacy. If we fight them there, we won't have to fight them here. It's like shooting fish in a barrel around here today.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Geinandputitout View Post
    Another fallacy. If we fight them there, we won't have to fight them here. It's like shooting fish in a barrel around here today.
    Prove him wrong. I guess you think it is just coincidence that so many Islamic militants travel to Iraq and Afghanistan and that there have been ZERO attacks on our soil since the wars there started. Seems they're more worried with getting us out of their homeland than they are attacking ours.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ChiefKN View Post
    Your original statement, in case you forgot.

    That author seems to think that is why he did it, but you claimed that Reagan made that statement.

    Can you show me where Reagan made the statement about why he raised those taxes?
    I never said that Reagan stated any reason for his tax hikes. But hey, maybe Reagan raised taxes because he realized the feds were collecting too much money and needed more.


    Quote Originally Posted by ChiefKN View Post
    My comments were about the majority in congress who continue to support the war.
    That will be changing soon. The President is able to head off those interests in congress via procedural manuvering. It's why it is important Obama wins on Tuesday.

    Quote Originally Posted by ChiefKN View Post
    Seems like a lot of dead terrorists in Iraq. Each one is one less that may try to come here and perpetrate attacks on our soil.
    Red herring.
    Politics is like driving. To go forward select "D", to go backward select "R."

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    Quote Originally Posted by Catch22 View Post
    Prove him wrong. I guess you think it is just coincidence that so many Islamic militants travel to Iraq and Afghanistan and that there have been ZERO attacks on our soil since the wars there started. Seems they're more worried with getting us out of their homeland than they are attacking ours.
    It might also be that folks who were in charge of this activity are doing their jobs with a bit more diligence. There was an FBI agent who was suspicious of some of the Saudi nationals taking flying lessons. The report she published was ignored by her higher ups as being too unlikely.
    Politics is like driving. To go forward select "D", to go backward select "R."

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    Quote Originally Posted by scfire86 View Post
    It might also be that folks who were in charge of this activity are doing their jobs with a bit more diligence. There was an FBI agent who was suspicious of some of the Saudi nationals taking flying lessons. The report she published was ignored by her higher ups as being too unlikely.
    So, what you are trying to say is that Bush did a good thing by investing our homeland security, as well as creating DHS?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Catch22 View Post
    So, what you are trying to say is that Bush did a good thing by investing our homeland security, as well as creating DHS?
    Dunno. Was the FBI around before 9/11? Have I ever criticized Bush for doing either of the things you mention?
    Politics is like driving. To go forward select "D", to go backward select "R."

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    Quote Originally Posted by scfire86 View Post
    Dunno. Was the FBI around before 9/11? Have I ever criticized Bush for doing either of the things you mention?
    They were around, but they sure didn't prevent it, did they.

    Have you ever gave Bush any credit for anything? It seems all I see out of you is that he's never done anything good.

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    Quote Originally Posted by scfire86 View Post
    Reagan also raised taxes four times when he realized there wasn't enough trickling down to support the expanded government he had created.


    And what of the people who live there that want us out? The majority of Iraqis want us out ASAP. Do they have no say? Or are we to let the isolated experiences of a single soldier on the ground dictate policy? And how much should I be asked to pay for something he believes is the right thing?

    As I asked CKN. How much more in taxes are you willing to pay to support this effort costing over $10B/month?
    When did you go over there and poll the people? The only ones who want us out are the same people supporting Obama, that would be the radicals

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    Quote Originally Posted by ScareCrow57 View Post
    When did you go over there and poll the people? The only ones who want us out are the same people supporting Obama, that would be the radicals
    Then the majority of Iraqis must be radicals. The latest polls in the last year+ have all stated their desire we get out. As has the current Iraqi president. I guess he must be a radical as well.
    Politics is like driving. To go forward select "D", to go backward select "R."

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