1. #26
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    Isn't a "cheater bar" a place to go have a few drinks and an affair without getting caught?

    Stupid idea, and definitely Darwinian.
    ‎"The education of a firefighter and the continued education of a firefighter is what makes "real" firefighters. Continuous skill development is the core of progressive firefighting. We learn by doing and doing it again and again, both on the training ground and the fireground."
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  2. #27
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    interesting concept, seems like it would only be marginally benefical to someone working on the roof, who may need to throw their mask on quickly while opening the hole.


    it has to create a horrible seal,seems like you'd lose more air than you save.

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    they can also work during overhaul. the ones that i have seen have a scuba mouthpiece or snorkel mouthpiece you fit into your mouth that hooked straight into the regulator.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Squad1LT View Post
    they can also work during overhaul. the ones that i have seen have a scuba mouthpiece or snorkel mouthpiece you fit into your mouth that hooked straight into the regulator.
    Thank you to all of the brothers that have responded. I knew there would be quite an uproar from the guys wearing the safety vests out there. My friend from Squad 1 here knows exactly what I am talking about. Thank you to the guys out there who gave me an answer that didnt have a danger story attached to it. I know everyone means well...just relax, thats all...like the one guy said- your heads can sometimes be burried in the sand- thats not always the best place to have them. Back to my Squad friend from a City I can only guess...hahaha...how do you make one? Any pictures? Let me know. Thanks!

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    Quote Originally Posted by jonnyirons2 View Post
    You must be a woman, cause I have never felt that a 'tone' was portrayed with words unless they said, 'give it to me, you flippin morons!' And that I have never read here.

    First you say that you "never felt that a 'tone' was portrayed with words".....then you say "UNLESS" the words say something else!!!!!!

    Please feel free to be more wishy-washy in the future
    Just someone trying to help! (And by the way....Thanks for YOUR help!)

    Aggressive does not have to equal stupid.

    ** "The comments made here are this person's views and possibly that of the organizations to which I am affiliated" **

  6. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by NoFireGeek View Post
    Thank you to all of the brothers that have responded. I knew there would be quite an uproar from the guys wearing the safety vests out there. My friend from Squad 1 here knows exactly what I am talking about. Thank you to the guys out there who gave me an answer that didnt have a danger story attached to it. I know everyone means well...just relax, thats all...like the one guy said- your heads can sometimes be burried in the sand- thats not always the best place to have them. Back to my Squad friend from a City I can only guess...hahaha...how do you make one? Any pictures? Let me know. Thanks!
    Hypothetical situation.

    A member wearing an SCBA with an unauthorized modification is involved in an LODD or LODI. A subsequent investigation (of which we all know there will be at least two or three) reveals that the SCBA was modified against FD regulations and is contrary to the FD's Respiratory Protection Plan.

    The possible results are a compromise of the benefits due the member or his family. It could also result in hefty sanctions against the FD for allowing or condoning this activity.

    Another possible result is the possibility of failure of the SCBA. Even if the failure was caused by something completely unrelated to the unauthorized modification, any claim against the manufacturer will be voided by the unauthorized modification. It probably also would void the warranty on the unit.

    As a fire officer, my primary job is to instill discipline in the members of the company and to enforce the FD's regulations. There are undoubtedly going to be provisions in the FD's regulations that people don't like. It really doesn't matter. It's still the fire officers job to enforce them ALL the time.

    For arguments sake, I'll concede that maybe there are some valid reasons for such a modification to the SCBA. If so, then three things should happen.

    1. The modification should be completed to all SCBA by a qualified technician
    2. All members should be trained on their use
    3. The FD Respiratory Protection should be amended to include the use of this item

    If you do not want to include them officially, that may be a very telling fact.
    PROUD, HONORED AND HUMBLED RECIPIENT OF THE PURPLE HYDRANT AWARD - 10/2007.

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    You are 1000% correct George. I wouldnt use one, I dont even like the fact that I have to breath diesel when we back in to quarters. The days of being the tough guy with no mask have been over for a long time. The guys that want to are just screwing themselves for the future. Call me a pussy cause I wear my mask till its totally clear, I want to soak the City for as long as I can upon my retirement.

  8. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by GeorgeWendtCFI View Post
    Hypothetical situation.

    A member wearing an SCBA with an unauthorized modification is involved in an LODD or LODI. A subsequent investigation (of which we all know there will be at least two or three) reveals that the SCBA was modified against FD regulations and is contrary to the FD's Respiratory Protection Plan.

    The possible results are a compromise of the benefits due the member or his family. It could also result in hefty sanctions against the FD for allowing or condoning this activity.

    Another possible result is the possibility of failure of the SCBA. Even if the failure was caused by something completely unrelated to the unauthorized modification, any claim against the manufacturer will be voided by the unauthorized modification. It probably also would void the warranty on the unit.

    As a fire officer, my primary job is to instill discipline in the members of the company and to enforce the FD's regulations. There are undoubtedly going to be provisions in the FD's regulations that people don't like. It really doesn't matter. It's still the fire officers job to enforce them ALL the time.

    For arguments sake, I'll concede that maybe there are some valid reasons for such a modification to the SCBA. If so, then three things should happen.

    1. The modification should be completed to all SCBA by a qualified technician
    2. All members should be trained on their use
    3. The FD Respiratory Protection should be amended to include the use of this item

    If you do not want to include them officially, that may be a very telling fact.
    Wow...thank you. I changed my mind about NEEDING INFORMATION FOR A RESEARCH PROJECT.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jonnyirons2 View Post
    You are 1000% correct George. I wouldnt use one, I dont even like the fact that I have to breath diesel when we back in to quarters. The days of being the tough guy with no mask have been over for a long time. The guys that want to are just screwing themselves for the future. Call me a pussy cause I wear my mask till its totally clear, I want to soak the City for as long as I can upon my retirement.

    Me,too.If I should ever hit the lottery,I intend to keep working on the grounds of I do not want to be screwed out of my retirement.

  10. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by laddercompany20 View Post
    Wow...thank you. I changed my mind about NEEDING INFORMATION FOR A RESEARCH PROJECT.
    Yep, research project. People have told you what they are and how they were used. WHY do you need to know how to make one if it is purely for a research project?

    It is dangerous, and obviously not sanctioned by a single SCBA manufacturer.

    So go ahead with your umm...research project, hopefully we won't read about you in some NIOSH report.

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    Quote Originally Posted by laddercompany20 View Post
    Wow...thank you. I changed my mind about NEEDING INFORMATION FOR A RESEARCH PROJECT.
    Skippy, you are full of crap. You were looking to make one of these. The most research you were doing was whether you could buy the materials at Home Depot or Lowe's.

    Respiratory Protection Plans, OSHA, LODD, and the role of the officer in the safety of his men are all valid topics if you were doing real research.
    PROUD, HONORED AND HUMBLED RECIPIENT OF THE PURPLE HYDRANT AWARD - 10/2007.

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    Forget it...thank you for expressing your concerns- Thank you to Squad1LT for having the understanding and answering my question without a lecture on safety. For those who I upset by posting this- report me to firefighterclosecalls.com...maybe Billy himself can drive over and slap the cool east coast mustache off of my face for asking such an insane question. Kepp burring those heads! The fire service doesnt have enough ostriches yet!

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    Quote Originally Posted by laddercompany20 View Post
    Wow...thank you. I changed my mind about NEEDING INFORMATION FOR A RESEARCH PROJECT.
    To clarify an earlier post
    1.) Put a 2"x2" piece of the "hook side" velcro on each of your 6 ear rings and a 1"x1" piece on each nose stud.
    2.) Glue a 1"x6" strip of the "fuzzy side" velcro inside of the rear edge of the facepiece and a 1"x3" piece inside top of the nose cup.

    Would be really fast to don. Additional bonus is if you use Scott SCBA (has detachable regulator) is that won't interfer with smoking your recreational materials of choice (assuming you have long roach clip).

    That biting on a stick is so low tech/legacy and it might well get caught on the tongue piercing which wouldn't be safe at all.

  14. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by laddercompany20 View Post
    Forget it...thank you for expressing your concerns- Thank you to Squad1LT for having the understanding and answering my question without a lecture on safety. For those who I upset by posting this- report me to firefighterclosecalls.com...maybe Billy himself can drive over and slap the cool east coast mustache off of my face for asking such an insane question. Kepp burring those heads! The fire service doesnt have enough ostriches yet!
    It is soooo painfully obvious that this is beyond a simple "research project." If it really were, you would have asked questions such as:
    -When were these devices first used?
    -What companies or departments used them?
    -Did any companies, departments or manufacturers support the use of these devices?
    -Did any mfr's produce these devices as accessories?
    -Are there any recorded LODD's or LODI's linked to these devices?

    Do tell us- what exactly is this "research project" for?

    Whats the difference between an ostrich with his head in the sand, and you with your head up your ***?
    Last edited by FWDbuff; 09-11-2008 at 08:20 AM.
    "Loyalty Above all Else. Except Honor."

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    Quote Originally Posted by FWDbuff View Post
    It is soooo painfully obvious that this is beyond a simple "research project." If it really were, you would have asked questions such as:
    -When were these devices first used?
    -What companies or departments used them?
    -Did any companies, departments or manufacturers support the use of these devices?
    -Did any mfr's produce these devices as accessories?
    -Are there any recorded LODD's or LODI's linked to these devices?

    Do tell us- what exactly is this "research project" for?

    Whats the difference between an ostrich with his head in the sand, and you with your head up your ***?
    laddercompany20 just got punched in the mouth!
    Logic and proportion have fallen sloppy dead.

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    Quote Originally Posted by laddercompany20 View Post
    Forget it...thank you for expressing your concerns- Thank you to Squad1LT for having the understanding and answering my question without a lecture on safety. For those who I upset by posting this- report me to firefighterclosecalls.com...maybe Billy himself can drive over and slap the cool east coast mustache off of my face for asking such an insane question. Kepp burring those heads! The fire service doesnt have enough ostriches yet!
    This post proves one thing...you are an arrogant, ignorant slob.
    PROUD, HONORED AND HUMBLED RECIPIENT OF THE PURPLE HYDRANT AWARD - 10/2007.

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    Quote Originally Posted by FWDbuff View Post
    It is soooo painfully obvious that this is beyond a simple "research project." If it really were, you would have asked questions such as:
    -When were these devices first used?
    -What companies or departments used them?
    -Did any companies, departments or manufacturers support the use of these devices?
    -Did any mfr's produce these devices as accessories?
    -Are there any recorded LODD's or LODI's linked to these devices?

    Do tell us- what exactly is this "research project" for?

    Whats the difference between an ostrich with his head in the sand, and you with your head up your ***?
    Funny thing is, I know the answers to these questions as I have found in my prior RESEARCH...it is just such a taboo item in the fire service, that no one is able to produce pictures of one, or tell me how it is made- OR who is still using them. I am not slow. I have NO intention on making one of these devices or using it- this is a research project on Fire Service Product Liability Claims. My subtopic is SCBA mfg. lawsuits. It is for a Masters Degree course in Public Administration. Guess I'm not as dumb as a few of the last posts described. I am sorry I didnt explain all of that jibrish in the beginning- quite frankly, I didnt think I had to. All I wanted was little information. I guess Firehouse Forums are not a place to get unbiassed, unemotionally charged replys to legitimate questions. I'm spent. (Thanks, though to all the "Brothers" out there who were quick to judge and personally attcked me. Such a tight group of guys in the service, right? At least thats what your cool T-shirts say)

  18. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by laddercompany20 View Post
    Funny thing is, I know the answers to these questions as I have found in my prior RESEARCH...it is just such a taboo item in the fire service, that no one is able to produce pictures of one, or tell me how it is made- OR who is still using them. I am not slow. I have NO intention on making one of these devices or using it- this is a research project on Fire Service Product Liability Claims. My subtopic is SCBA mfg. lawsuits. It is for a Masters Degree course in Public Administration. Guess I'm not as dumb as a few of the last posts described. I am sorry I didnt explain all of that jibrish in the beginning- quite frankly, I didnt think I had to. All I wanted was little information. I guess Firehouse Forums are not a place to get unbiassed, unemotionally charged replys to legitimate questions. I'm spent. (Thanks, though to all the "Brothers" out there who were quick to judge and personally attcked me. Such a tight group of guys in the service, right? At least thats what your cool T-shirts say)
    As I said earlier...

    This post proves one thing...you are an arrogant, ignorant slob.
    PROUD, HONORED AND HUMBLED RECIPIENT OF THE PURPLE HYDRANT AWARD - 10/2007.

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    Quote Originally Posted by laddercompany20 View Post
    Funny thing is, I know the answers to these questions as I have found in my prior RESEARCH...it is just such a taboo item in the fire service, that no one is able to produce pictures of one, or tell me how it is made- OR who is still using them. I am not slow. I have NO intention on making one of these devices or using it- this is a research project on Fire Service Product Liability Claims. My subtopic is SCBA mfg. lawsuits. It is for a Masters Degree course in Public Administration. Guess I'm not as dumb as a few of the last posts described. I am sorry I didnt explain all of that jibrish in the beginning- quite frankly, I didnt think I had to. All I wanted was little information. I guess Firehouse Forums are not a place to get unbiassed, unemotionally charged replys to legitimate questions. I'm spent. (Thanks, though to all the "Brothers" out there who were quick to judge and personally attcked me. Such a tight group of guys in the service, right? At least thats what your cool T-shirts say)

    For such a "smart" guy you seem to lack basic knowledge of how an internet forum works.

    Perhaps after a few more posts you will realize that when you post something for everyone to read, you might actually find that not everyone agrees with you. It is alot like the firehouse kitchen table.

    Now you can act like an internet tough guy and sling insults, or you can accept that fact and actually contribute something without beating your chest.

    Up to you.

    Good luck with your "research".

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    Whats with all the hysteria? The guy asked a simple question and the next thing you know you guys are comparing him to a mad bomber... Dynamite? anfo bomb? Are you serious??? What a bunch of drama queens.
    I am a complacent liability to the fire service

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    Quote Originally Posted by ChicagoFF View Post
    Whats with all the hysteria? The guy asked a simple question and the next thing you know you guys are comparing him to a mad bomber... Dynamite? anfo bomb? Are you serious??? What a bunch of drama queens.
    Read the posts carefully. People are not that upset with what he was asking. They are upset about his arrogant ignorant and condescending attitude about the people who provided the information. He is ****ed because it wasn't what he wanted to hear so he called people out. That is what the issue is.
    PROUD, HONORED AND HUMBLED RECIPIENT OF THE PURPLE HYDRANT AWARD - 10/2007.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ChicagoFF View Post
    Whats with all the hysteria? The guy asked a simple question and the next thing you know you guys are comparing him to a mad bomber... Dynamite? anfo bomb? Are you serious??? What a bunch of drama queens.
    Finally...someone in my corner. Boy the fire service sure has changed over the past decade or so. Thanks- a shot out to my Chicago guys out there! So much emotion...drama everywhere. Good lord help us.

  23. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by GeorgeWendtCFI View Post
    Hypothetical situation.

    A member wearing an SCBA with an unauthorized modification is involved in an LODD or LODI. A subsequent investigation (of which we all know there will be at least two or three) reveals that the SCBA was modified against FD regulations and is contrary to the FD's Respiratory Protection Plan.

    The possible results are a compromise of the benefits due the member or his family. It could also result in hefty sanctions against the FD for allowing or condoning this activity.

    Another possible result is the possibility of failure of the SCBA. Even if the failure was caused by something completely unrelated to the unauthorized modification, any claim against the manufacturer will be voided by the unauthorized modification. It probably also would void the warranty on the unit.

    As a fire officer, my primary job is to instill discipline in the members of the company and to enforce the FD's regulations. There are undoubtedly going to be provisions in the FD's regulations that people don't like. It really doesn't matter. It's still the fire officers job to enforce them ALL the time.

    For arguments sake, I'll concede that maybe there are some valid reasons for such a modification to the SCBA. If so, then three things should happen.

    1. The modification should be completed to all SCBA by a qualified technician
    2. All members should be trained on their use
    3. The FD Respiratory Protection should be amended to include the use of this item

    If you do not want to include them officially, that may be a very telling fact.
    Does this mean every guy that gets killed in a tanker rollover while not wearing his seat-belt gets denied LODD benefits?

  24. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Geinandputitout View Post
    Does this mean every guy that gets killed in a tanker rollover while not wearing his seat-belt gets denied LODD benefits?
    OK. How in the world would you get that from my post?

    Would not wearing a seat belt in a tanker rollover be an unauthorized modification of the unit? Would not wearing a seat belt void the tanker warranty?

    I realize that you are one of those who enjoy trying to fight on every one of my posts, but this is absurd.
    PROUD, HONORED AND HUMBLED RECIPIENT OF THE PURPLE HYDRANT AWARD - 10/2007.

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    Quote Originally Posted by laddercompany20 View Post
    Funny thing is, I know the answers to these questions as I have found in my prior RESEARCH...it is just such a taboo item in the fire service, that no one is able to produce pictures of one, or tell me how it is made- OR who is still using them. I am not slow. I have NO intention on making one of these devices or using it- this is a research project on Fire Service Product Liability Claims. My subtopic is SCBA mfg. lawsuits. It is for a Masters Degree course in Public Administration. Guess I'm not as dumb as a few of the last posts described. I am sorry I didnt explain all of that jibrish in the beginning- quite frankly, I didnt think I had to. All I wanted was little information. I guess Firehouse Forums are not a place to get unbiassed, unemotionally charged replys to legitimate questions. I'm spent. (Thanks, though to all the "Brothers" out there who were quick to judge and personally attcked me. Such a tight group of guys in the service, right? At least thats what your cool T-shirts say)

    Here's a clue - post the answers that you have to those questions and maybe, just maybe, people might take you seriously. Its a valid concern and I am sure many here would be interested in the answers to the above questions.

    Otherwise - it sounds like you want to make one and need an instruction manual.

    For the record - I didn't know these things existed before this thread.

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