1. #1
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    Default Call volume & automatic aid...what to do?

    As y'all recall from app season, the app specifies "Please indicate the number of times your department provides or receives mutual aid. Do not include first-due responses claimed above."

    We have an automatic aid agreement with another FD for tankers. If I'm honest, this requirement eliminates all my structure fires that should be listed at the top, because we either gave or received mutual aid on all of them after the agreement was implemented in April.

    Two questions:
    1. Is that the honest way to handle it?
    2. Is the low number of structure fires screwing me up on computer scoring, or does their presence on MA figures count equally?
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    Quote Originally Posted by EastKyFF View Post
    As y'all recall from app season, the app specifies "Please indicate the number of times your department provides or receives mutual aid. Do not include first-due responses claimed above."

    We have an automatic aid agreement with another FD for tankers. If I'm honest, this requirement eliminates all my structure fires that should be listed at the top, because we either gave or received mutual aid on all of them after the agreement was implemented in April.

    Two questions:
    1. Is that the honest way to handle it?
    2. Is the low number of structure fires screwing me up on computer scoring, or does their presence on MA figures count equally?
    Although you are quoting the statement in the application correctly, I beleive the intent of that question was to be sure that you did not count a "gave mutual aid call" as a first due call for yourself. In other words not to give double credit for call volume. As written I agree it seems to want to include "received mutual aid" which is really asinine since you are the first due on the call for any "received mutual aid". I think AFG needs to re-examine that particular question and rephrase it. I will bring that up to them when next we speak.

    To answer your other question low call colume can certainly be a factor in a denial.
    Kurt Bradley
    Fire/EMS/EMA Grant Consultant
    " Never Trade Skill for Luck"

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    I knew low call volume could be a killer. I was just hoping that the MA responses might count equally.

    PLEASE mention this to any FEMA staff you can find, Kurt!

    Maybe a subheading deal would work better, for example...

    Total structure fires ____
    With mutual aid received ____
    With mutual aid given ____
    With no mutual aid ____

    HAVING AUTOMATIC AND MUTUAL AID AGREEMENTS SHOULD HELP, NOT HURT!!
    I am more than just a serious basketball fan. I am a life-long addict. I was addicted from birth, in fact, because I was born in Kentucky.
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    The way it's supposed to be is:

    If the fire was in your district and you invited someone to come, it counts as both your structure fire and a mutual aid received call (two spots)

    If you went to their structure fire it only counts as mutual aid given.

    Otherwise, you're right, if you received mutual aid on every call then by the strict worded you'd have no first due calls, just mutual aid. Clarification was issued on that somewhere in either the PPT or PG. Or the tutorial, can't remember which, but it was put out there although not as well as it could have been.

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    I agee, 100% of our structure fires are rec. and provide mutual aid, I did it in a way to benefit me for scoring and explained it in the narrative, that what the help desk recommended. Kurt what do you think, PS bought airline tickek for SF/CA yesterday looking forward to your seminar?

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    Quote Originally Posted by firebill911 View Post
    I agee, 100% of our structure fires are rec. and provide mutual aid, I did it in a way to benefit me for scoring and explained it in the narrative, that what the help desk recommended. Kurt what do you think, PS bought airline tickek for SF/CA yesterday looking forward to your seminar?
    Your on target guy. See you in SF.
    Kurt Bradley
    Fire/EMS/EMA Grant Consultant
    " Never Trade Skill for Luck"

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    TFIRS tells me that if I respond to another's fire without being asked then it is automatic aid and I count it as a house fire and an automatic aid given. If they respond to me without being invited then it counts as an automatic aid received and a fire. If I am asked to respond then I am giving mutual aid and I can not count it as a fire, but if I ask for someone to come help - that is mutual aid and I count my fire and my receiving mutual aid. I am sure that all the fires reproted to FEMA thru grants are thousands times more than the actual fires in our country, lol, many guys count the same fire to get their stats up - I'm not brave enough to do that - one check with your NFIRS records and you have lied on the FEMA app - its not like marriage - what's your is hers - their fire is their fire and your fire is your fire - it should not go through the system twice - right?

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    TXFIRS is in line with the DHS method, if it wasn't in our district we count it as an M/A response only. Otherwise it asks for damage reports, cause, etc, etc. Not our district, such stats don't matter since the insurance company wants a report from the first-due.

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    [QUOTE=JimT57;989469]TFIRS tells me that if I respond to another's fire without being asked then it is automatic aid and I count it as a house fire and an automatic aid given....

    I really should have worded this differently - In our county if a neighboring department gets a page then we automatically respond and we are asked to count it as automatic aid. If we are not an automatic responder and another department requests us to repond to a particular incident - then we must count it as mutual aid, and vice-versa.

    Brian - hope things are going well for you...Tuck

    Oh yeah - I haven't heard a WORD on my apparatus grant - you think that is good?

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    Going good, thanks Jim. And good sign on no word yet, no gnews is good gnews.
    Last edited by BC79er; 09-17-2008 at 02:09 PM.

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