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    Thumbs up 1950's M1 GARAND "GOES HOME"

    Long Shot: Man finds rifle his dad used in Korea

    Saturday, September 20, 2008

    (09-20) 19:06 PDT DAVISON TOWNSHIP, Mich. (AP) --

    As gifts go, Jim Richardson's choice for his father's 79th birthday was a long shot.

    Virgil Richardson fondly remembered the .30-caliber M1 Garand rifle he carried during his time as a soldier during the Korean War.

    He even still had the weapon's serial number.

    Using that number, Jim Richardson went online and found the firearm at a Kentucky gun broker.

    "I couldn't even talk when he gave it to me," Virgil Richardson told The Flint Journal. "It didn't even have to be the same gun to be important to me."

    About 7 million of the sturdy rifles were produced during the Korean War period, making the odds of finding the right one so long that the broker didn't believe the serial number matched, said Jim Richardson, 54, of Saginaw County's Frankenmuth, about 70 miles northwest of Detroit.

    "After the war, the soldiers couldn't bring the rifles back with them," Jim Richardson said. "They stayed in Korea (until the 1980s), when they were able to be imported back to the United States."

    He won't say exactly how much he spent, but some collectors have paid as much as $3,000. He gave the Garand to his father last week, although the elder Richardson's birthday isn't until next month.

    Virgil Richardson served from 1951-53 as an Army radio operator in the 25th Infantry Division. When he speaks of the war, the General Motors Corp. retiree often mentions the rifle's accuracy and dependability, as well as his own marksmanship.

    "My sister lives in the country, and it came up that you could shoot a deer right from the deck of her home," Jim Richardson said. "Dad made a comment that he could hit a silhouette target at 500 yards without a scope. Most people can't see that far without a scope."

    Virgil Richardson said he'll wait until his Oct. 26 birthday to shoot the weapon.

    "What shocked me the most is how very heavy it is," he said. "I have trouble now holding it up and aiming it. I guess they were made for 20- and 21-year-olds."

    Information from: The Flint Journal, www.mlive.com/flintjournal

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    I've been haunting every gun show that comes to Memphis and checking the Civilian Marksmanship Program website hoping to find the M1 Carbine that Dad carried while in Germany during Korea.
    So far,no dice but I have heard of a fella that was looking for the one his dad carried and when he found it,had to empty his checking account,go to his brother in law's for a loan only to return to the show smoking tires the whole way and see someone else filling out the 4473 for it.
    I bet he fell to his knes and screaming to the Heavens above:"NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!"

    BTW,every US issued rifle and carbine is the exact weight that it needs to be when it is issued to you.It is only in the intervening 20-30 years that the weapon gains weight on you.

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    The other day,I was checking out the shelves in my favorite gun store while awaiting a new background check(most recent one on the rifle I'm buying was 30 days ago) and what appeared to my wondering eys but a Colt 1917 in .45 ACP.
    I wasn't able to get anyone to let me handle it but it appears to be missing the end piece to the ejector rod .I don't know about other damaged and/or missing pieces/parts but it looked in excellent condition,no rust that I could see and the wood that I could see didn't have dent 1 in it.
    Kreegah!Tarzan want!
    When the gun store opens tomorrow,I am going to further annoy the TBI and lay down the asking price for it if it looks as good in my hand as it does behind glass.
    Lord God above,please let this be a shooter.Amen

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    It is only in the intervening 20-30 years that the weapon gains weight on you.
    Although I had not thought about it in exactly those words, the sentiment was certainly in my head when I read Richardson's comment. I initially trained to shoot the FNC1A1 that was on issue when I joined the service. I remember that puppy being heavy enough even as a 19 yr old. Couldn't shoot worth $hite with it, but I also knew that I could aim well enough that anyone down range would never know if I was just mess'n around, taking pot-shots or if I really could not hit the broad side of a barn. I qualified with it, but only barely. Then we moved on to the C7 and I can all but carve my name with that one.

    THIS SUCKS! Nobody has a decent picture of the FNC1. This was the best I could do. During our basic training we also had to qualify on the SMG. What a fun little toy that was!
    Attached Images Attached Images    

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    See Rick, I LOVE the old FN's. I started shooting the .22 variants as a 13yr old cadet, so by the time I got to the real thing, they were a breeze. I actually HATED the c7 when I first fired it. Too plasticy and "cheap" sounding. Of course that changed when I had to carry it on a 20km forced march.

    Later I grew to appreciate the superiority of the c7 as a service rifle, particularly it's versatility and reliability, but I still like the ability of the old .308 to reach out and touch someone at 600 yards.

    If I had the choice of what to carry today in the varied terrain of Iraq or Afghanistan, I would love something like an HK 417. The weight, reliability, and action of a modern assault rifle, with the punch of .308.
    Never argue with an Idiot. They drag you down to their level, and then beat you with experience!

    IACOJ

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    Later I grew to appreciate the superiority of the c7 as a service rifle, particularly it's versatility and reliability, but I still like the ability of the old .308 to reach out and touch someone at 600 yards.
    Ya see, thats the delema I that I have. While I could not shoot that weapon (probably) to save my life, I also knew beyond all doubt that ANYTHING I hit with it was going down and gonna STAY down. But I found like you, on a forced march, with a full combat load, the C7 is much easier to pack around than a full load with the C1.
    ====

    For those who are not familiar with the FNC1A1:

    The Rifle, 7.62mm, FN, C1A1, is designed primarily as a personal weapon for the Canadian Forces. The C1A1 is a semi-automatic weapon which enables the operator to fire single shots at varying rates. The rifle can be fitted with a telescopic sight for sniping and long range fighting, and a bayonet for close combat.

    The Rifle, 7.62mm, FN, C1A1D, is equipped with a selector switch which enables the user to fire single shots or automatic bursts. It is in service aboard Canadian Forces ships.

    The Rifle, 7.62mm, FN, C1A1, and C1A1D, are air cooled, gas and spring operated weapons. Both feed from a magazine, have an adjustable gas regulator, and fire from a positive locked breech.

    The main components of the weapon can be disassembled and assembled by the user for cleaning purposes.

    IDENTIFICATION

    Manufacturer: Canadian Arsenals Limited

    Models: C1A1 and C1A1D

    TECHNICAL SPECIFICATIONS

    PHYSICAL DATA

    Weight: Normal butt, empty magazine 9 lb. 6 oz. Normal butt, full 20 rd magazine 10 lb. 15 oz. Length Normal butt 44.75 in

    ANCILLARY ITEMS

    Bayonet, Adapter, magazine charger, Telescope, sniper, C1, Mount, Telescope, C2, Attachment, blank firing apparatus

    OPERATING DATA

    System of operation: Spring and gas operated, magazine fed. GOD How we used to recite that in our sleep! LOL

    Safety feature: Mechanically locked dropped breech block.

    Muzzle velocity 2750 ± 40 fps.

    BARREL DATA: Length 21 in. Calibre 7.62 mm

    RIFLING PARTICULARS: Number of grooves 6 Pitch 1 turn in 12 in. Direction of twist right hand

    BUTT LENGTHS: Extra long butt 11.5 in. Long butt 11 in. Normal butt 10.25 in. Short butt
    9.75 in.

    AMMUNITION DATA

    Type 7.62 mm NATO STANDARD Size 7.62 mm

    Magazine capacity 20 rounds

    SIGHTING DATA

    Rear sight aperture Front sight blade Sight radius 21 in.

    RANGE OF ADJUSTMENT

    Ranging Rear sight is graduated from 200 to 600 yards in increments of 100 yards.

    Zeroing - Rear sight One revolution of the zeroing screws provides 5 minutes of angular or 9.52 inches latéral movement of the MPI at 200 yards.

    Zeroing - Front sight One revolution of the front sight blade provides 4 minutes of angular or 8.57 inches vertical movement of the MPI at 200 yards.
    =====
    C7 Carbine

    The 5.56 mm C7TM Rifle has a full length barrel for infantry and other arms requiring longer range capabilities. The C7TM meets all applicable military standards including: reliability in all environmental and operational conditions, accuracy, lethality, maintainability in field conditions and safety. The C7TM is the result of four generations of improvements to the most tested and battle proven rifle in the world.

    • Direct Gas System. The unique direct gas system eliminates the operating rod and keeps all of the firing forces in line with the bore for maximum accuracy and reliability.

    • Hammer Forged Barrel. The long-life chrome lined cold hammer forged barrel is the most advanced and durable barrel available. The integrally forged chamber ensures consistency and accuracy over the life of the barrel.

    • Flat Top. The upper receiver can be manufactured in the original Canadian Forces specification Weaver rail, or with a MIL-STD-1913 Picatinny rail.

    • Simplicity. The proven design ensures ease of operation and the ultimate in maintainability. The weapon is easy to operate and can be field stripped in seconds with no tools.

    • Durability. The high strength materials and precision manufacturing ensure durability and low life cycle costs. The C7TM has 97% parts commonality with all other models.

    The C7TM is available in two basic configurations:

    • The full length, fixed stock battle rifle C7A1TM ; and

    • The upgraded adjustable stock battle rifle C7A2TM.

    F e a t u r e s :

    1 - 51 cm (20 inch) cold hammer forged barrel
    2 - Flash suppressor
    3 - Bayonet lug
    4 - TRI-AD 1TM MIL-STD-1913 accessory mount
    5 - Coloured furniture to break up weapon outline
    6 - Improved chamber and gas system, plus Elastomeric Receiver Retainer
    7 - Accepts all STANAG magazines
    8 - Integrated sight rail (Weaver or Picatinny)
    9 - Optional ambidextrous controls
    10 - Single or double sided sling loop
    11 - Standard 4 position buttstock with no slip rubber butt pad (C7A2TM) or fixed buttstock (C7A1TM)
    12 - Battery stowage pistol grip insert
    Last edited by MalahatTwo7; 09-22-2008 at 04:54 PM.

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    To further exemplify the term "oxymoron",in my destroyer we were issued M14s,12 guage shotguns and 1911A1s for security alerts.
    The shotguns and pistols were good ideas in case we actually had to fight within the confines of steel bulkheads and decks but the M14?!
    As Vincent D'onofrio said in the movie"Seven point six two millimeter.Full Metal Jacket."
    I say they'd either punch through to the XO's stateroom as he was writing up the official command apology for whatever I'd gotten blamed for while actually being totally innocent this time and putting a stop to that effort or the bullets would richochet(sp,I know!)all around the compartment puncturing my handsome pink skin.
    Despite all I had to pack,I didn't mind my assignment as back up M60 gunner because of those hazards.I had to carry the M14,five magazines,2- 60 round bandoliers for myself and two 100 round belts for the 60.
    When given the assignment and issued the stuff for the first time,I asked "Chief?I gotta haul all this (stuff) and defend myself as well?"
    The Chief Gunner's Mate said"Sailor.I don't care of you defend yourself but you damned well better defend Petty Officer Jones' M60 and make sure he has enough ammo.If it comes to you two opening up from the O-4 level,we're in deep (doo-doo) for sure."
    My favorite firearm in my rack was an Springfield Armory M1A.I'd put in a BufferTech recoil reducer,ordered a fiberglass stock for it and had it shooting like it had eyes using surplus Austrian ammunition.
    Some nefarious rapscallion stole it and three other firearms from me back in 2005,though.I've been wishing that dude or dudes unknown have private parts rotting off with no medical explanation.
    Last edited by doughesson; 09-23-2008 at 01:14 PM.

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    Default .

    I like my grandfathers Colt 1911 that he had when he worked on the Manhatten Project. And my dads 30.6 German Maurser that is stamped Berlin 1918 that he bought when he was on Border Patrol in the early 60's.
    GFD748 First in... Last out.. Everyone goes home.... Do the best job you can and do it safely

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    Smile DCM dream gun !

    Years ago(Late 1970's) I joined a local gun club in order to qualify for the DCM Program. We had to shoot and be documented before we could enter the DCM Gun Program.
    I pulled in my brothers , my Commanding Officer(Fire Department) and best friend. We all shot and qualified.
    A few months later, we entered for our chance to buy a DCM M-1 Garand Rifle. One by one we all got one. They were nice and most vary well kept - at the time you paid $250.00 in a money order - up front and waited to see what you got - yes I said $250.00! Needless to say it was well worth it.

    In 1985 I read about a DCM lottery - you had to send in $650. and hope they pulled your name - I scraped together the money and sent it in. My wife ragged me for about a year -

    One day my wife called me at the fire house and said the "US Postal Service" dropped off a big box. She told me as much as she could about what the box looked like , how heavy it was and what was printed on the outside.

    When I got home I was shocked beyond belief - now at that time I was a Federally Licensed Gun Dealer. We all know about filling out the correct forms and how restrictive New York State is. Remember , this box was delivered by our every day postal guy - left on my sun porch !

    Well , I read the box and it had all the correct Government markings for the DCM. I carried it into the living room and got a cup of coffee.

    As I carefully cut the thread reinforced tape back I saw a plastic bag with dates and rifle info printed on it. Also other items and small boxes. One box was over a foot long and about 4" by 4" - I spread everything out on a clean bed sheet.

    There was a transport bag - military issue. A military cleaning kit and container. Manuals for cleaning , assembly and proper handling.

    I opened one small box and there was a round rubber cone/tube looking thing - it was about the size of a half dollar(opening at the small end) - the larger end was slanted and about the size of a silver dollar - I read the package and learned it was a "Eye Piece" for a scope!

    Well , I got impatient and started reading the big plastic bag - It stated when and where it was stored. It also had some thing like M1-D on it. I pulled out this rifle - it was a M-1 Garand - it was so clean I couldn't believe my eyes - it had a scope mount among the other items as well.

    After calling every gun person I knew and several book searches I learned I had received a U.S.Army Winchester M-1 Garand Sniper Rifle !!!!!!!!!!!!!

    This was the highlight of my collecting - I have never seen one - in the box before or sense.

    I can only imagine the joy you must have brought to your father - not only because of what you did to find that rifle - but the pride that you showed your father - for a son to go so far above and beyond to acknowledge his fathers sacrifices for our Country.

    God Bless you for doing that and sharing it with us.
    www.bfd-firedepartment.com
    23 years B.F.D. Local 282
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    U.S.Military - Joined.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bfdhoser1 View Post
    Years ago(Late 1970's) I joined a local gun club in order to qualify for the DCM Program. We had to shoot and be documented before we could enter the DCM Gun Program.
    I pulled in my brothers , my Commanding Officer(Fire Department) and best friend. We all shot and qualified.
    A few months later, we entered for our chance to buy a DCM M-1 Garand Rifle. One by one we all got one. They were nice and most vary well kept - at the time you paid $250.00 in a money order - up front and waited to see what you got - yes I said $250.00! Needless to say it was well worth it.

    In 1985 I read about a DCM lottery - you had to send in $650. and hope they pulled your name - I scraped together the money and sent it in. My wife ragged me for about a year -

    One day my wife called me at the fire house and said the "US Postal Service" dropped off a big box. She told me as much as she could about what the box looked like , how heavy it was and what was printed on the outside.

    When I got home I was shocked beyond belief - now at that time I was a Federally Licensed Gun Dealer. We all know about filling out the correct forms and how restrictive New York State is. Remember , this box was delivered by our every day postal guy - left on my sun porch !

    Well , I read the box and it had all the correct Government markings for the DCM. I carried it into the living room and got a cup of coffee.

    As I carefully cut the thread reinforced tape back I saw a plastic bag with dates and rifle info printed on it. Also other items and small boxes. One box was over a foot long and about 4" by 4" - I spread everything out on a clean bed sheet.

    There was a transport bag - military issue. A military cleaning kit and container. Manuals for cleaning , assembly and proper handling.

    I opened one small box and there was a round rubber cone/tube looking thing - it was about the size of a half dollar(opening at the small end) - the larger end was slanted and about the size of a silver dollar - I read the package and learned it was a "Eye Piece" for a scope!

    Well , I got impatient and started reading the big plastic bag - It stated when and where it was stored. It also had some thing like M1-D on it. I pulled out this rifle - it was a M-1 Garand - it was so clean I couldn't believe my eyes - it had a scope mount among the other items as well.

    After calling every gun person I knew and several book searches I learned I had received a U.S.Army Winchester M-1 Garand Sniper Rifle !!!!!!!!!!!!!

    This was the highlight of my collecting - I have never seen one - in the box before or sense.

    I can only imagine the joy you must have brought to your father - not only because of what you did to find that rifle - but the pride that you showed your father - for a son to go so far above and beyond to acknowledge his fathers sacrifices for our Country.

    God Bless you for doing that and sharing it with us.
    You lucky SOB!

    Got Pics?


    P.S. The CF also sold off a large number of the old Military Police FN's in the early 90's (semi-auto only). I was a young college kid with no money at the time, so I couldn't afford the 1200 bucks for one, but a freinds father who was a reservist officer bought one, and it was a spotless beauty. I guess those MP's didn't get much chance to train.
    Last edited by mcaldwell; 10-08-2008 at 08:05 PM.
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    DCM/CMP is now selling off M1 Carbines.The Rock-Ola built carbines are supposed to be in the current sales run.

    Quote Originally Posted by bfdhoser1 View Post
    Years ago(Late 1970's) I joined a local gun club in order to qualify for the DCM Program. We had to shoot and be documented before we could enter the DCM Gun Program.
    I pulled in my brothers , my Commanding Officer(Fire Department) and best friend. We all shot and qualified.
    A few months later, we entered for our chance to buy a DCM M-1 Garand Rifle. One by one we all got one. They were nice and most vary well kept - at the time you paid $250.00 in a money order - up front and waited to see what you got - yes I said $250.00! Needless to say it was well worth it.

    In 1985 I read about a DCM lottery - you had to send in $650. and hope they pulled your name - I scraped together the money and sent it in. My wife ragged me for about a year -

    One day my wife called me at the fire house and said the "US Postal Service" dropped off a big box. She told me as much as she could about what the box looked like , how heavy it was and what was printed on the outside.

    When I got home I was shocked beyond belief - now at that time I was a Federally Licensed Gun Dealer. We all know about filling out the correct forms and how restrictive New York State is. Remember , this box was delivered by our every day postal guy - left on my sun porch !

    Well , I read the box and it had all the correct Government markings for the DCM. I carried it into the living room and got a cup of coffee.

    As I carefully cut the thread reinforced tape back I saw a plastic bag with dates and rifle info printed on it. Also other items and small boxes. One box was over a foot long and about 4" by 4" - I spread everything out on a clean bed sheet.

    There was a transport bag - military issue. A military cleaning kit and container. Manuals for cleaning , assembly and proper handling.

    I opened one small box and there was a round rubber cone/tube looking thing - it was about the size of a half dollar(opening at the small end) - the larger end was slanted and about the size of a silver dollar - I read the package and learned it was a "Eye Piece" for a scope!

    Well , I got impatient and started reading the big plastic bag - It stated when and where it was stored. It also had some thing like M1-D on it. I pulled out this rifle - it was a M-1 Garand - it was so clean I couldn't believe my eyes - it had a scope mount among the other items as well.

    After calling every gun person I knew and several book searches I learned I had received a U.S.Army Winchester M-1 Garand Sniper Rifle !!!!!!!!!!!!!

    This was the highlight of my collecting - I have never seen one - in the box before or sense.

    I can only imagine the joy you must have brought to your father - not only because of what you did to find that rifle - but the pride that you showed your father - for a son to go so far above and beyond to acknowledge his fathers sacrifices for our Country.

    God Bless you for doing that and sharing it with us.

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    Question Not sure

    For more information about the Civilian Marksmanship program - click this link:http://www.odcmp.com/



    I sold it to a collector in Portland Maine.

    Because of the "Anti-gun Rights" Politicians in my area - I had to sell most of my collection to pay for lawyers. I no longer sell fire arms as a business - just buy & trade as a private collector and hunter.

    Believe me once these guys get on you they don't stop. It has affected my family life and career to this very day.

    Any way this thread was about a son's gift to his Dad - I can only hope some day my son will look upon our service in the Military as the guy did who started this thread.

    Once again , good job and never forget why your father carried that rifle.
    Last edited by bfdhoser1; 10-08-2008 at 08:51 PM.
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    23 years B.F.D. Local 282
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    U.S.Military - Joined.

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    Not to long ago I read about a "Old Breed" U.S. Marine. Pre WW2, and he served in WW2 as well. He remembered the serial # of the 03 Springfield he was issued in boot camp, or was it at Schofield Barracks in Hawaii. He still had the receipt. Somehow, I think through the DCM, his son got a hold of the weapon again. It had an arsenal rebuild, but it was still his piece. I may have some of the exact details off a bit, but the story, the receipt, and the photos of the man are there on the net for all to see. (If it is on the net, it must be true ) I will look for the link.

    Firearms have to be some of the most interesting history out there.

    Being kind of a lurker here, is there room for a gun section in this forum?

    Kindest regards, Craig
    The opinions are mine alone, and do not represent the department I am with, or any firefighters I work with.

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