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  1. #61
    Forum Member nyckftbl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bones42 View Post
    It appears as though it's Ok to "assume" there are other issues involved, but not Ok to "assume" a driver made an error.

    Interesting.

    Yeah. thats whats happening here.

    Most of the posts that you seem to think were "assuming" other issues, were in response to these types of posts:

    Quote Originally Posted by ScareCrow57 View Post
    Looks like the guy pulling out from the left failed to use do regard.
    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    What I saw on the video:

    .......

    Hell even my current and lasst podunk FDs has/had a very clear intersection management policy for apparatus/apparatus right of way.

    I guess I'm not afraid to sugarcoat this bull**** and say right out that someone was wrong and someone needs to be suspended without pay or fired for voliating the law, or at the least, a likley department policy.
    Quote Originally Posted by ScareCrow57 View Post
    ....



    So let's see. There was a traffic signal. Both trucks blew the intersection. Then either both had a green light or someone failed to follow policy and law.

    The problem is the whole thing is senseless, could and should have been avoided just by following policy, and at least six (maybe 7) innocent victims were injured.
    You seriously see no fault in these posts? REALLY?
    Last edited by nyckftbl; 10-20-2008 at 12:49 PM.
    Proud East Coast Traditionalist.


  2. #62
    the 4-1-4 Jasper 45's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bones42 View Post
    It appears as though it's Ok to "assume" there are other issues involved, but not Ok to "assume" a driver made an error.

    Interesting.

    Go back and please read what I posted and show me where I made or endorsed any assumptions, I dare you to.

    There is nothing interesting about this entire thread, other than it is easy to find out where people stand on jumping to conclusions.
    It baffles me even more as to why people do not understand why some of us are getting ****ed about posts made by scarecrow, and those by Lafireeducater.

    We see a short snippet of video from a security camera, from a single viewpoint, with no interviews of drivers or crew, with no other pertinent FACTUAL information.
    Based on that one, small piece of evidence, people are somehow able to draw the "complete picture", and determine that at least one of the drivers should lose their job.
    All of this "speculation" started and took place while most of those injured were still in the hospital. Real good compassion, real good.


    If you would like to come back with the police report, and then talk about the police report contents, have at it.
    We're not at that point yet.

  3. #63
    MembersZone Subscriber fieldseng2's Avatar
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    Here is video from the newscast last night. You can see what the 2 companies saw as they were approaching the intersection.....


    http://www.ksdk.com/news/local/story...157922&catid=3

  4. #64
    Forum Member HeavyRescueTech's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jasper45 View Post
    We see a short snippet of video from a security camera, from a single viewpoint, with no interviews of drivers or crew, with no other pertinent FACTUAL information.
    with all due respect, we have been given the only unbiased view of what happened. it is the only FACT that I am aware of. it is a fact that this happened. as for why? that's an opinion. interviews with the drivers or crew? their opinion of what happened. who saw what? whose fault it was? that's all opinion.

    You saw on the video what happened. you can make your judgements as a witness of the accident (since you are seeing the accident exactly as it appeared on youtube).

    now, if there was an unusual occurrence (mechanical failure, driver suffered a medical emergency, etc), then I think everyone here, who said it was one of the driver's error, will gladly admit they were incorrect.

    But I'm betting one (or both) of the drivers made a mistake, and it resulted in him and 7 of his brothers going ot the hospital, as well as the destruction of a fire engine, and it was a preventable crash.

    and if I am wrong, and it was one of those unusual occurrences, then I will be the first to apologize for jumping to inaccurate conclusions.
    If my basic HazMat training has taught me nothing else, it's that if you see a glowing green monkey running away from something, follow that monkey!

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  5. #65
    Forum Member nyckftbl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrParasite View Post
    with all due respect, we have been given the only unbiased view of what happened. it is the only FACT that I am aware of. it is a fact that this happened. as for why? that's an opinion. interviews with the drivers or crew? their opinion of what happened. who saw what? whose fault it was? that's all opinion.

    You saw on the video what happened. you can make your judgements as a witness of the accident (since you are seeing the accident exactly as it appeared on youtube).

    now, if there was an unusual occurrence (mechanical failure, driver suffered a medical emergency, etc), then I think everyone here, who said it was one of the driver's error, will gladly admit they were incorrect.

    But I'm betting one (or both) of the drivers made a mistake, and it resulted in him and 7 of his brothers going ot the hospital, as well as the destruction of a fire engine, and it was a preventable crash.

    and if I am wrong, and it was one of those unusual occurrences, then I will be the first to apologize for jumping to inaccurate conclusions.
    How about instead of jumping to ANY conclusions, we let this play out, instead of playing judge and jury on a public website. BMA.
    Proud East Coast Traditionalist.

  6. #66
    Forum Member Bones42's Avatar
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    Actually, if you read my posts, I have not offered any opinion on what happened.

    And there are plenty of "what ifs" being thrown all around.


    Me, I'm waiting for the details.
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

  7. #67
    MembersZone Subscriber SFDredhat126's Avatar
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    I just noticed the guy in the white shirt on the corner (the one furthest from the camera) appears to be pointing out to 122 that 10 is about to cross the intersection. I just don't understand the part where he casually walks away right after it.

  8. #68
    the 4-1-4 Jasper 45's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nyckftbl View Post
    How about instead of jumping to ANY conclusions, we let this play out, instead of playing judge and jury on a public website. BMA.

    This needed to be posted again.



    Why is it that people are faster to punish a guy without an investigation, than they are to wish them well following an accident? I just don't get it, and it keeps happening every single time there is some kind of an incident.
    The first noose was tied on this thread after about five posts. Were the guys even to the hospital yet?

  9. #69
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    It's on CNN as well. At least the Chief is smart enough to use this as a training exercise. But the guy that speaks early on says it all. If this doesn't make you think when driving one of these trucks.....

  10. #70
    Permanently Removed CALFFBOU's Avatar
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  11. #71
    Forum Member MassFireGuy's Avatar
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    A term that is being used way to often these days. To bad it is true.

    BMA

  12. #72
    Forum Member snowball's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fieldseng2 View Post
    Here is video from the newscast last night. You can see what the 2 companies saw as they were approaching the intersection.....


    http://www.ksdk.com/news/local/story...157922&catid=3
    Glad to hear the brothers are going to be ok.!

    And as far as I'm concerned you're the ONLY one on here qualified to comment or speculate on this accident.
    The rest of you need to

    IAFF

  13. #73
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    So it sounds like 7 of the firefighters made it out with minor injuries and the 8th suffered a concussion. Good to hear nothing more serious happened. You can't really speculate what happened here. There are so many angles to take...just good to hear they all made it out ok. Glad the pedestrian on the bottom right had the smarts to get out of the way too.

  14. #74
    Forum Member MIKEYLIKESIT's Avatar
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    Best wishes to the Brothers from St. Louis.
    IAFF-IACOJ PROUD

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