1. #26
    Forum Member
    Rescue101's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    Bridgton,Me USA
    Posts
    8,162

    Default

    MG,better take another look around. Loads of MM's both past and present.
    Rockland Me. is a MM.Ours is a MM.As SP indicates ALL of your major players offer a 100'MM. Now, if you favor a RM,nothing wrong with that either. In our area platforms are gaining popularity because of reduced staffing and lightweight construction. But there's still plenty of straight sticks floating around.Everybody has an opinion which is best;I find that they both have Pros and Cons. For us,the MM works better. For our neighbors,it's RM. So whatever fits your needs. T.C.

  2. #27
    MembersZone Subscriber

    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    Central NJ
    Posts
    1,214

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Rescue101 View Post
    MG,better take another look around. Loads of MM's both past and present.
    Rockland Me. is a MM.Ours is a MM.As SP indicates ALL of your major players offer a 100'MM. Now, if you favor a RM,nothing wrong with that either. In our area platforms are gaining popularity because of reduced staffing and lightweight construction. But there's still plenty of straight sticks floating around.Everybody has an opinion which is best;I find that they both have Pros and Cons. For us,the MM works better. For our neighbors,it's RM. So whatever fits your needs. T.C.
    I am referring to midmount AERIALS, not TOWERS. MM towers are a dime a dozen, its midmount AERIALS that I see very few of lately. Hope this clears it up for good

  3. #28
    MembersZone Subscriber

    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Kennett Square, PA USA
    Posts
    320

    Cool

    I think the best thing about the MM is the manueverability!
    Attached Images Attached Images   

  4. #29
    Forum Member
    Rescue101's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    Bridgton,Me USA
    Posts
    8,162

    Default

    Clear it up for good? Now that would take the sport out of it now wouldn't it.And I wouldn't have to do any more research. You SURE you wanna do this? Hehe T.C.

  5. #30
    Forum Member
    Rescue101's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    Bridgton,Me USA
    Posts
    8,162

    Default

    Ah,the Baron must have a spare minute.Tony,how come you're advertising brand X? Good picture though. T.C.

  6. #31
    MembersZone Subscriber

    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Kennett Square, PA USA
    Posts
    320

    Default

    Gotta help the Goombahs too!!!! Me thinks they turn corners like those other things from "Lose-ianna Swamp Lands" but if you must be low this is about the only way to do it, and yes we make some just like it.

  7. #32
    MembersZone Subscriber

    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Celina, TN USA
    Posts
    78

    Default Ladder Wish

    We operate a 100' RM Hahn with a single rear axle quad out riggers. It has a prepiped waterway and ample storage for us.

    Must haves are as follows:

    Large generator (diesel) ours is 10K.
    Multiple cord reels and lights (use electric pump on rescue tool)
    Variety of ground ladders and tools.

    Wish we had!

    Portable cascade
    Ladder mounted lights
    Absorbent Hopper

    Since we are a straight truck company, we do not have a pump, hose or tank. Prior experience tells me that you should pay close attention to the hose bed and how the hose deploys out of the bed. Also look at the height of the rig and access to the compartments. For what its worth, I do like a platform. I just can't afford it!

  8. #33
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    34

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by MG3610 View Post
    I am sorta wondering why....but anyway...my opinions follow.

    I've never spec'd a truck, but have operated with several of them over the years.

    What do you need it to do? Your 100' requirement essentially eliminates most midmounts and puts you into rearmount territory. ALF does make 100' midmount aerials.

    Is this going to be a ladder or tower?

    If its a ladder, specing one that has a monitor capable of operating above the axis of the aerial (see thread on new aerial monitors) for increased versatility.

    If its a tower, manually controlled tiller bar type monitor (Aerialscope style).

    An angled bucket sounds appealing after learning about their advantages.

    If its an aerial, skip all the lights, bells and gadgets on the tip, leave it clear so you can actually get it up next to things. Maybe one of those cheap 12v unity flood lights for some work light.

    What about a quad, drop the aerial and carry a ton of portable ladders. Fair Haven NJ just got a pierce quad. There is another one floating around somewhere I just recently saw but its escaping me.
    Is this the rig for Fair Haven you are mentioning?

    http://www.piercemfg.com/DeliveryDet...7-a9cc6f87ffd9

    It does look real nice.

  9. #34
    MembersZone Subscriber
    ffmedcbk1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    781

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    For my money you can't beat a Stuphen tower.
    give me two things.....

    a hammer and some of "your money". i'll drive to station one and show you how to beat a Sutphen!!!!


    We call it a "special little bitter citrus fruit", small like a lime but more yellow.
    Last edited by ffmedcbk1; 10-17-2008 at 08:41 PM.

  10. #35
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Aug 2001
    Posts
    86

    Default

    Laddertruck,
    When it comes to what your looking at, my #1 comment is 'you can't have it all." If you really want to be able to operate as an engine and have that versatility with a 100'+ aerial, personally I'd be looking at a RM straight stick with your pump/tank of choice. With some manufacturers/models you can do that within your 11'6" OAH. As examples, E-One 110 or HM100 with 500 GWT and a narrow jack spread. Current FD operates a 105' Pierce RM with no pump/tank and we have a very tight 19th century village as part of the district. I drive the truck often and I can get it though the village, it's tight, but doable. Anything any bigger and it would be a problem. If you are willing to go bigger and give up some versatility/maneuverability, than that opens you up to a wider range of options including the MM platforms/straight sticks that would meet your OAH limit.

  11. #36
    MembersZone Subscriber

    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    Central NJ
    Posts
    1,214

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by MMFireBuff View Post
    Is this the rig for Fair Haven you are mentioning?

    http://www.piercemfg.com/DeliveryDet...7-a9cc6f87ffd9

    It does look real nice.
    Thats it.

    http://www.f-ss.com/deliveries/print/may08/20045.pdf

  12. #37
    Forum Member
    MTKROUSH's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Hernando MS USA
    Posts
    558

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Bones42 View Post
    Sounds like us.

    We went with a rear mount for the added compartment space. The ability to back in to a scene and get the full 100' reach was another factor, you lose a little bit with a mid mount. The midmount demo we had did not have the maneuverability the rear mount had, with the large rear end swing.
    That is us. We got lucky though. We were able to do our homework and find a refurbed Simon Duplex LTI 110' Rear mount quint that is working out just lovely for us. The chief was wanting to go 75' and a group of us found a refurb dealer in our State that had the right truck for the right price. We run it as an engine on occasion, a truck most of the time, and even as a second due Rescue company if that becomes necessary.
    To err is human, To forgive divine and at times I am as much of both as you will ever find

  13. #38
    Forum Member
    Bones42's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Location
    Pt. Beach, NJ
    Posts
    10,690

    Default

    Is this the rig for Fair Haven you are mentioning?
    That Fair Haven engine is the LONGEST engine I have seen in my life.

    It even fits on MOST of their streets.
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

  14. #39
    Forum Member
    islandfire03's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Posts
    2,590

    Talking

    It's only 38 feet long according to the drawing. :-} just slightly shorter than an amtrack commuter train.
    I'm guessing around 525K as it's a custom body with a lot of bling.
    455 hp ?????? Whats with that. other than out doing the neighbors. It's only got to move 500 gallons of water.

  15. #40
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Oct 1999
    Location
    Louisville, KY
    Posts
    60

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Bones42 View Post
    That Fair Haven engine is the LONGEST engine I have seen in my life.

    It even fits on MOST of their streets.
    You're forgetting, it's not an engine it's a Quad! If you look at the drawings they need the length to allow for storage of the long ladders. Quads are not very common today but they used to be in the past when manpower was such an issue.

  16. #41
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Posts
    31

    Default

    The longest ladder on there is a 40' 3 section Bangor.

  17. #42
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    629

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by salvage View Post
    The longest ladder on there is a 40' 3 section Bangor.
    The 18' roof ladder is the longest when they are in storage.

  18. #43
    Forum Member
    Bones42's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Location
    Pt. Beach, NJ
    Posts
    10,690

    Default

    Bulldog, I don't need to look at the drawings. I looked at the rig itself.

    The drawings don't do it justice, as far as it's actual size. They are accurate, but seeing it on paper and seeing it live can be shocking to some people.
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

  19. #44
    MembersZone Subscriber

    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Northeast Coast
    Posts
    3,863

    Default

    I'd buy another MM tower in a heartbeat! We had some concern about the maneuverability and so we demoed numerous brands and found that our concerns were pretty much unfounded. Obviously street/road conditions play a role here, but we found that the new MM's were fairly easy to get around. After running our purchase about town with no mishaps and never missing a spot we wanted, I'd not be concerned with the trucks size. Our's is 46'6".

    We chose the MM for the aerial versatility. It had to be able to put the bucket on the sidewalk in our downtown district which is fairly narrow, so 4 or 5 sections was a must. It must have a flat cab roof to maximize scrub area going forward. The bucket as MG noted must have angled corners to make more sets for entry/egress. We also went with one tiller bar gun for the reasons already noted.

    If you really feel speed of set up is a large factor (immediate arrival rescues), then a two outrigger stick usually is quicker than any tower. But that extra 30-60 seconds seem to disappear with mastering the system. If we had an immediate rescue for the tower, another FF would assist the operator in set up and then go to the bucket.

    If you want it all: pump, crosslays and ground ladders a MM probably won't work out well. We carry over 200 ft of ground ladders b/c we have no tank blocking them. Maybe a side stack of ground ladders like the Boston MM Peirce's could work, but that cuts down on compartment space.

    We went to the tower vs. the aerial stick as we felt that it would give our personnel the best protection given that almost all new construction uses truss es and the aerial MS work is much safer and more accurate with a FF in the bucket aiming the stream.

    Lastly, 100 ft minimum? We aimed for that at the start but did not want to limit ourselves that much for the extra 5 to 7 feet. As TC notes the horizontal reach of his Smeal is 99ft! Our 93' is only 87.5', so there are many factors there that change the end use. Heck the E-One jack spread will allow you to be 3 feet closer to the building than others which quickly eats up the difference between 95 and 100 feet.

  20. #45
    MembersZone Subscriber

    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Posts
    246

    Default

    93' Tower... ALF/LTI I presume?

    Sounds like a good - true account for a rig like that.
    FTM-PTB DTRT

    Everything I state on here is to support and aid my fellow firefighters. Everything I post is my opinion only, and in no way should be taken as an official opinion of any Company, Department, or Municipality I represent... oh and this includes Pierce Mfg, as so their legal department has advised me; since they apparently also invented the right to control "Free Speech".

  21. #46
    Forum Member
    Rescue101's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    Bridgton,Me USA
    Posts
    8,162

    Default

    I've seen the rig,it's VERY well laid out.And damn near perfect for it's operational area.We also have over 200' ft of ground ladders AND have a pump and tank.We "stole"a few ideas from Adam's rig to use on ours.Not to mention his white paper to get it in the first place. T.C.

  22. #47
    MembersZone Subscriber

    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Posts
    246

    Default

    Any chance you can forward me the white paper? Anything to help build our case would be much appreciated.
    FTM-PTB DTRT

    Everything I state on here is to support and aid my fellow firefighters. Everything I post is my opinion only, and in no way should be taken as an official opinion of any Company, Department, or Municipality I represent... oh and this includes Pierce Mfg, as so their legal department has advised me; since they apparently also invented the right to control "Free Speech".

  23. #48
    Forum Member
    Rescue101's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    Bridgton,Me USA
    Posts
    8,162

    Default

    Sean,It's in my OLD computer(I think).I'll see what I can do but you might get it quicker by asking Adam(RFDACM02).I think he's got it in electronic format. T.C.

  24. #49
    MembersZone Subscriber

    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Northeast Coast
    Posts
    3,863

    Default

    Anyone can send me a PM and I'll send them the justification papers. I might reformat it as there are three or four papers we used to spoon feed our local politicians rather than overwhelm them at once and have them toss them in the trash. Something worked in the end since I saw the truck sitting on the floor this morning again.

  25. #50
    Forum Member
    Rescue101's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    Bridgton,Me USA
    Posts
    8,162

    Default

    Seems as though Adam is going for his purple hydrant.For those seeking the Tower project white paper,E-mail him and he'll get it out for you.Or E-mail/PM me for contact info. T.C.

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. Hypothetical question:
    By FiremedicSpud in forum The Off Duty Forums
    Replies: 20
    Last Post: 03-27-2007, 06:29 PM
  2. Hypothetical Help Please...
    By Captnnc in forum Firefighters Forum
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 08-27-2004, 01:08 PM
  3. Hypothetical: Firefighter freaks out, trys to leave house fire
    By Jedimike007 in forum Firefighters Forum
    Replies: 23
    Last Post: 11-07-2002, 11:03 PM
  4. Hypothetical Situation
    By Hot6815 in forum Fire Explorer & Jr. Firefighting
    Replies: 19
    Last Post: 04-10-2002, 02:27 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts

Log in

Click here to log in or register