Thread: Petzl ID Belay

  1. #1

    Join Date
    Nov 2008

    Default Petzl ID Belay

    Can anyone tell me what section of NFPA 1006 or 1670 states the requirements on belay's?

    Specifically looking to find out if the Petzl ID satisfies the requirements for a belay device in replacement of Tandem Prussiks.

    Does anyone use anything other than the 540 or Tandem Prussiks in their dual line systems??

    Thanks in advance!!

    PS- also looking for where it states standards for weight of rescuer and required safety factors??

  2. #2
    MembersZone Subscriber

    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Pa USA


    1670 and 1006 doesn't have specifics about how to do the rescue. Just what you need to beable to do. It doesn't specify tandem triple wrapped prussics or rescue 540's. It simply stated belay you need to know how to set up and operate a belay system. Allot of the belay competancies come from the British Columbia Council on Technical Rescue (BCCTR). If your looking for specific weights and such check out NFPA 1983.

  3. #3
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    N. Ridgeville, Ohio


    They used to specify a person weighed 300# for loads. This has since been changed so that a smaller rescuer or victim does not have to on 1/2" rope. You can now use 7/16" rope if the safety factors are there. I also do not remember a specific safety factor that is mentioned. 15:1 is thrown out frequently, so it 10:1. I do not recall ever seeing it in writing though. I may be wrong.
    Jason Brooks
    IAFF Local 2388

  4. #4
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Jul 2001


    The 15:1 was derived from the fact that NFPA 1983 used to specify the MBS and the safe working load for life safety rope and auxilliary system components. For example, a 1/2" rope would have a MBS of 9100lbf with a SWL of 600lbs. This language has been removed from the current version. In fact a lot of the language that hinted at usage in anyway has been removed. This responsibility is on the manufacturer to let us know how to safely use their equipment. The 1983 standard now looks like what it was originally intended to be...a manufacturers standard. It was never intended to be used as a user standard but due to the language in it, it had been used in this manner for years and has caused a lot of confusion and heated debate.

    The 10:1 is typically used by mountain SAR teams and has been used in many parts of the world for quite some time, some of which use 10:1 of the knotted strength. Australia uses 8:1 of the knotted strength. Even the 15:1 used in the past by NFPA worked out to be about 10:1 after knotted strength was factored in. That same 1/2" rope with an MBS of 9100lbf would have roughly 6300lbf knotted breaking strength. A 600lb load is roughly 10:1.
    Sometimes, in order to make an operation idiot proof, you must remove the idiot!

  5. #5
    MembersZone Subscriber

    Join Date
    May 2000
    Wheaton IL


    As stated before 1670 or 1006 doesn't tell you how to do a particular evolution. The ID is General rated, so it can be used on a two person load. In playing with it, you can use it as a belay with a hauling system. The nice thing about it is once the load is on the belay lowering is very easy and you don't have to switch over to a rack or something else.
    The downside is, I have found that everyone doesn't know how the ID works and that has prevented us from using it on a regular basis.
    Also their is no required safety factor for a system. Rope as stated is 15:1 but your system is only as strong as it's weakest link.

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