THIRD PARTY CULPABILITY AND THE LAW (if those are the right words?)

[MalahatTwo7]

I know that there has been a law in force for quite awhile about "hosts" being responsible for guests who have been drinking but I think this might be the first time its actually been called into play:

Golf course operators charged in drunken crash case

Served liquor to intoxicated person before three men died, Crown alleges

By Melissa Leong, Canwest News ServiceJanuary 13, 2009

Ontario Provincial Police have charged operators of a golf club and 16 people with 34 liquor licence violations after a car crash killed three Toronto men last summer.

Tyler Mulcahy, Cory Mintz, both 20, and 19-year-old Kourosh Totonchian died on July 3 after leaving the Lake Joseph Golf Club in the Muskoka region of southwestern Ontario, where they had spent the afternoon eating and drinking.

The Audi S4 they were riding in left a cottage country highway, flipped over, shearing the tops from pine trees, and landed on its roof in the Joseph River.

Mulcahy's 19-year-old girlfriend survived the crash with minor injuries.

ClubLink, the company that operates the Lake Joseph Club, its officers, directors and three seasonal employees face charges of permitting drunkenness on licensed premises and supplying liquor to an intoxicated person.

If found guilty, the corporation faces up to $250,000 in fines per charge; individuals are subject to as much as $100,000, said OPP Const. Maureen Tilson.

"If you are a licensed establishment and you are serving alcohol, then you need to be aware of the law because we are going to enforce that," Tilson said.

Scott Davidson, ClubLink's vice-president of corporate operations, said he could not comment on the charges as the matter is before the courts.

A court date has been scheduled for Jan. 27 in Bracebridge, Ont., about 200 kilometres north of Toronto.

Davidson, who has been with the company for more than 10 years, said the legal documents naming him and seven other officers, arrived at the company's head office.

The manager and two servers at The Water's Edge Bar and Grill, a restaurant at the club, also have been charged.

Tim Mulcahy, Tyler's father, told a Bracebridge-area newspaper last year that his son and three friends had 31 drinks over a three-hour period at the club.

Following his son's death, Mulcahy started a petition and took out a full-page newspaper ad to lobby Ontario Premier Dalton McGuinty to implement a zero-tolerance drinking policy for young drivers.

© Copyright (c) The Victoria Times Colonist

[BryanLoader]

Well Rick, I do agree with charging the owners and servers, but I also think that the matter of personal responsibility should bear some relevance to the award if any. These guys and girl were not force fed this booze.

[MalahatTwo7]

Well Rick, I do agree with charging the owners and servers, but I also think that the matter of personal responsibility should bear some relevance to the award if any. These guys and girl were not force fed this booze.

I agree Bryan. Ingestion of alcoholic substances is a voluntary activity. While it might be the Responsible Thing for a host to "advise you" when maybe too much has been inbibed, it is also the onus of the individual to act responsible too.

[nmfire]

About a year ago, a bunch of kids had a party in our town which obviously included a copious amount of booze. A car load of these kids left the party in a car, in which everyone including the driver was drunk. They didn't get very far before they crashed and rolled at a high rate of speed. One of the passengers, a local teenage girl, was killed in the crash.

The driver of the vehicle is serving out his 10 year prison term. The kid that hosted the party was sentanced to a multitude of jail, probation, community service, and other monetary fines. He's also facing a 4 million dollar civil suit.

[ScareCrow57]

4 people, 31 drinks, 3 hours, that is 8 drinks a piece, or roughly 3 per hour.

I do have a serious problem with these kinds of laws. A state trooper pulls you over and spends 20 minutes evaluating you and then uses a breathalyzer to measure your BAC. Keep in mind that these are inaccurate until about 30 minutes after you have had a drink. Your server gets about 20 seconds tops, and if it s busy, they don't even get that.

Does anyone think the server can really tell if the person buying is intoxicated? Perhaps the person buying was going to the bar and getting the drinks but not drinking themselves. And how does the server know these people were driving? How does he not know they have a DD? How does he know that they didn't call a cab? These laws are stupid and ridiculous.

[Bones42]

Does anyone think the server can really tell if the person buying is intoxicated?
- Maybe, Maybe they just appear it.

Perhaps the person buying was going to the bar and getting the drinks but not drinking themselves.
- 4 drinks for a table every 20 minutes, a responsible server should notice that.

And how does the server know these people were driving?
- how about simply asking?

How does he not know they have a DD?
- how about simply asking?

How does he know that they didn't call a cab?
- how about simply asking?

These laws are stupid and ridiculous.
- As are SOME people.