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  1. #1
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    Lightbulb Drawing the fire scene

    Hi,

    I have some papers from US (I'm in Europe and Brasil) about LODD, showing drawing of fire scenes, using the ABCD method for naming sides. I have also some fireground command sheets (eg some from Ferno company) on which the officier can "draw" the fire scene.

    My question is: when the first truck arrived on scene, eg with only 4 firefighters, does the "chief" use immediatly such a fireground command sheet? And if the answer is "yes", do you have special or predefined "icons" to draw the different tools, actions and so on? (eg an icon for the ladder, an other for the nozzle, the guys, victims and so on...)

    Thanks very much for your answer.
    Stay safe
    Pierre-Louis


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    The back of the Deputy Chief's car (Ours is desginated Car 2) has cabinet that holds all kinds of reference books, command vests and a command board that can be used to track fire company locations.

    It tends to be used at major incidents, when you will be there for a long time and using a lot of resources.

    I have used it twice since making Deputy Chief. For most of our "bread and butter" ops, it really isn't necessary... of course, there are those departments who won't do anything until all of the vests are filled and the board drawn to scale....
    ‎"The education of a firefighter and the continued education of a firefighter is what makes "real" firefighters. Continuous skill development is the core of progressive firefighting. We learn by doing and doing it again and again, both on the training ground and the fireground."
    Lt. Ray McCormack, FDNY

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    As Gonz said, the amount of detail and use of command sheets varies from department to department, incident to incident and person to person.

    For a small fire (room and contents), I will grab a piece of paper and jot down units arriving and note who was assigned to what task or division. I may sketch a drawing of the building if things get too confusing. That's not my first priority however. Immediately on scene, I'm sizing up, and assigning the first in units as necessary.

    For larger incidents, we have a board much like Gonz described. It doesn't tend to get used much.

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    Unit (engine, truck, rescue) level officers usually do not work off of pen and paper in our area; however the various battalion and volunteer chief officer vehicles may have dry erase boards installed for such a purpose, as shown below.
    Attached Images Attached Images    
    "If you put the fire out right in the first place, you won't have to jump out the window."
    Andy Fredericks,
    FDNY E.48, SQ.18
    Alexandria, VA F.D.

    Rest in Peace

  5. #5
    Forum Member MemphisE34a's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PlLAMBALLAIS View Post
    My question is: when the first truck arrived on scene, eg with only 4 firefighters, does the "chief" use immediatly such a fireground command sheet? And if the answer is "yes", do you have special or predefined "icons" to draw the different tools, actions and so on? (eg an icon for the ladder, an other for the nozzle, the guys, victims and so on...)
    The documents that you have or have seen sound like they are post incident reports to me.

    On scene operating command boards to not include diagrams and icons for various actions or event. The IC is not drawing victims on a floor plan where they were located.

    In your example, the first firefighting vehicle would be labeled to a geographic location of the building and a very brief description of their tactic. For example,

    "A" division - E34 - Attack.
    RK
    cell #901-494-9437

    Management is making sure things are done right. Leadership is doing the right thing. The fire service needs alot more leaders and a lot less managers.

    "Everyone goes home" is the mantra for the pussification of the modern, American fire service.


    Comments made are my own. They do not represent the official position or opinion of the Fire Department or the City for which I am employed. In fact, they are normally exactly the opposite.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by MemphisE34a View Post
    In your example, the first firefighting vehicle would be labeled to a geographic location of the building and a very brief description of their tactic. For example,

    "A" division - E34 - Attack.
    OK; What are you calling "E34"? A team?

    Actually what we think, is that on many cases, the "chief" don't really analyse the situation. And that in most cases, the fire act like a target on which everybody focus, without looking around.

    What we see, is that there is no system to "slow down" the process. Not of course to increase process decision time from 10 seconds to one hour, but just to have a little voice inside the chief's head, telling him "Just look the little smoke on this small window" or "Look at the wind".

    In fact, the goal can be as when you go to the supermarket to buy goods. You can count on your memory but even if you buy goods for years, you can always forget something. You can also use a little sheet of paper. It's longer to write than to think, and it's longer to read than to remenber. But this paper help you not to forget what to buy. And it had also another advantage: it "free" your mind.
    On the fire scene, having such a paper can (maybe) resolve 80% of the problem. Not 100%. But as it "free" your mind, you'll get 100% of brain, for dealing with the 20%.

    So paper, not paper, PDA, .... I don't know

    Regards
    Pierre-Louis

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    Quote Originally Posted by PlLAMBALLAIS View Post
    OK; What are you calling "E34"? A team?

    Actually what we think, is that on many cases, the "chief" don't really analyse the situation. And that in most cases, the fire act like a target on which everybody focus, without looking around.

    What we see, is that there is no system to "slow down" the process. Not of course to increase process decision time from 10 seconds to one hour, but just to have a little voice inside the chief's head, telling him "Just look the little smoke on this small window" or "Look at the wind".

    In fact, the goal can be as when you go to the supermarket to buy goods. You can count on your memory but even if you buy goods for years, you can always forget something. You can also use a little sheet of paper. It's longer to write than to think, and it's longer to read than to remenber. But this paper help you not to forget what to buy. And it had also another advantage: it "free" your mind.
    On the fire scene, having such a paper can (maybe) resolve 80% of the problem. Not 100%. But as it "free" your mind, you'll get 100% of brain, for dealing with the 20%.

    So paper, not paper, PDA, .... I don't know

    Regards
    Pierre-Louis
    We do have some command sheets with a checklist along 1 side. It covers things like utilities, fire marshall, electric co, red cross, fill in crew, etc.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eng34FF View Post
    We do have some command sheets with a checklist along 1 side. It covers things like utilities, fire marshall, electric co, red cross, fill in crew, etc.
    Good. Can you send me a link to such a file, or scan it and mail it to me? (pl.lamballais@flashover.fr)

    Thanks very much
    Pierre-Louis

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    We use what we call a "status board," which is a hand-held standard paper size board that has a space for drawing the fire scene/structure but also has a lot of other information on it to prompt the 1st arriving officer of all the things to consider. the back side also has six square blocks where the arriving officer can jot down certain actions in order that need to be performed for the incident. Next to each block is some velcro where we attach crews passports and write down their assignment.

    It is something we grab on every fire and more involved MVA scenes. The 1st arriving officer grabs the status board before exiting the apparatus and jots down notes and assigns his crew and next arriving crews work assignments while he does a 360 degree walk around the structure/scene. When done with the 360, the officer either decides to "establish" command at a designated post or goes right to work. If the officer joins his crew in going to work, he places the status board on the officer seat of the apparatus so the next incoming crew will always know where to find it and find out their assignment.

    Obviously, there's a lot of variations and gray areas because firefighting is never in black and white terms.

    If you want more information, check out Mark Emery's website on ITAC. We use his status boards and command boards and all of the tactics described above are from his teachings.

    go to this link to see the status board I'm talking about:

    http://www.imsalliance.com/display/i...1&theme=Boards

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