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  1. #1

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    Default OFFICERS...questions for you

    What do you carry into a working fire (please specify which apparatus you ride)

    What do you think are qualities which are integral to being a "good officer"?

    How do you deal with "incapable" crew members?
    thanx


  2. #2
    MembersZone Subscriber ffmedcbk1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sfrtk911 View Post
    What do you carry into a working fire (please specify which apparatus you ride)

    What do you think are qualities which are integral to being a "good officer"?

    How do you deal with "incapable" crew members?
    thanx
    #1 question: I take a hook on the walk around and then meet with the attack crew at the front door. I usally am on the line as #2 of 3 on the attack, handling the TIC and directing the crew.

    #2 Knowing the job, Leading with fairness and integrity, Teaching either formally or informally everyday you show up at the firehouse

    #3 see #2
    Originally Posted by madden01
    "and everyone is encouraged to use Plain, Spelled Out English. I thought this was covered in NIMS training."

  3. #3
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    I'm an Engine Co. Officer

    On a working fire I carry the TIC, "A" tool, light. If we get assigned something other then a line then usually a hook and an axe or maul depending on construction.

    I agree, you must know the job, treat everyone the same, lead by example. As a Lieutenant I'm just a firefighter who gets yelled at more then the rest of the guys. know when it is time to lead and when your just one more member of the house.

    Guys who aren't quite up to the job have to be taught. You can't complain about them unless you have spent copuntless hours working with them without success.

  4. #4
    Forum Member TruckSixFF's Avatar
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    On our 9 trucks and 1 squad our officers carry ethier 1. halligan, and TIC or 2. officers tool, and TIC. (5 man truck, 5 man squad)

    On our 19 engines the officer takes TIC, and is 3rd on the line(4-5 man engine)

    trust, good reputation....there are tons of quailitys that make up a good and effective officer.
    Last edited by TruckSixFF; 03-19-2009 at 05:00 PM.
    FDNY 343 9/11/01 WILL Never Forget!

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  5. #5
    MembersZone Subscriber ffmedcbk1's Avatar
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    The USMC teaches the 14 leadership traits
    "JJDIDTIEBUCKLE"

    Justice, Judgement, Dependiability, Integrety, Decision Making, Tact, Initiative, Endurance, Bearing, Unselfishness, Courage, Knowledge, Loyalty, Enthusiasm

    Judgement
    The ability to weigh facts and possible solutions on which to base sound decisions.

    Justice
    Giving reward and punishment according to merits of the case in question. The ability to administer a system of rewards and punishments impartially and consistently.

    Dependability
    The certainty of proper performance of duty.

    Initiative
    Taking action in the absence of orders.

    Decisiveness
    Ability to make decisions promptly and to announce them in clear, forceful manner.

    Tact
    The ability to deal with others without creating offense.

    Integrity
    Uprightness of character and soundness of moral principles; includes the qualities of truthfulness and honesty.

    Endurance
    The mental and physical stamina measured by the ability to withstand pain, fatigue, stress and hardship.

    Bearing
    Creating a favorable impression in carriage, appearence and personal conduct at all times.

    Unselfishness

    Avoidance of providing for one's own comfort and personal advancement at the expense of others.

    Courage
    The mental quality that recognizes fear of danger or criticism, but enables a man to proceed in the face of it with calmness and firmness.

    Knowledge
    Understanding of a science or an art. The range of one's information, including professional knowledge and an understanding of your Marines.

    Loyalty
    The quality of faithfulness to country, the Corps, the unit, to one's seniors, subordinates and peers.

    Enthusiasm
    The display of sincere interest and exuberance in the performance of duty.

    Learned at Parris Island and I will carry that with me for the rest of my life.
    Originally Posted by madden01
    "and everyone is encouraged to use Plain, Spelled Out English. I thought this was covered in NIMS training."

  6. #6
    Forum Member MemphisE34a's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ffmedcbk1 View Post
    The USMC teaches the 14 leadership traits
    "JJDIDTIEBUCKLE"
    Yeah, but that wasn't the question.
    RK
    cell #901-494-9437

    Management is making sure things are done right. Leadership is doing the right thing. The fire service needs alot more leaders and a lot less managers.

    "Everyone goes home" is the mantra for the pussification of the modern, American fire service.


    Comments made are my own. They do not represent the official position or opinion of the Fire Department or the City for which I am employed. In fact, they are normally exactly the opposite.

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    Forum Member Bones42's Avatar
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    I can be either....

    Engine Company Personnel Assignments:

    Officer:

    Key Tasks:
    • Directs apparatus placement
    • Initial size-up and attack mode
    • Communicates fire conditions and location of fire to IC
    • Calls for the line to be charged
    • Controls the door to fire area
    • Communicates with OV, directs fire attack and hose-line advancement, monitors conditions

    Tools:
    • Radio
    • Thermal Imaging Camera
    • Officer’s Tool or haligan (if no Truck Company present)
    • Flashlight


    Truck Company Personnel Assignments:

    Officer:

    Key Tasks:
    • Leads search for fire and/or victims
    • Reports fire location and conditions to IC
    • Directs Engine Company to fire
    • Supervises and monitors team searching
    • Directs and supervises salvage/overhaul operations

    Tools:
    • Radio
    • Flashlight(s)
    • Thermal Imaging Camera
    • O-Tool, Chief’s axe or haligan
    • Rope Bag
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

  8. #8
    Forum Member Bones42's Avatar
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    Sorry, forgot the other 2 questions....

    - What do you think are qualities which are integral to being a "good officer"?

    lead by example. open minded. respectful. ability to combine book knowledge with real world knowledge.

    - How do you deal with "incapable" crew members?

    train them.
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by sfrtk911 View Post
    What do you carry into a working fire (please specify which apparatus you ride)

    What do you think are qualities which are integral to being a "good officer"?

    How do you deal with "incapable" crew members?
    thanx
    Bones hit the nail on the head for the 2nd two questions.

    Right now we are only doing engine work until our new heavy rescue squad gets delivered. What I carry depends on how many I have with me, but in general I will grab the radio, light and TIC. May pick up a hand tool if needed, or drop the TIC if we are short handed and I will be on the line.

  10. #10
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    I'm on the engine. I carry a radio and my own light. Our firefighters bring the axe/tools, but I usually end up with it/them when it's necessary for them to flow water or perform other actions in which a tool is cumbersome. We hand the tools back and forth depending on what is needed at the moment.

    Leadership qualities?
    Too many to list, but here's a few in no particular order.
    honesty/integrity
    fairness
    respect what the other guys have to offer
    train harder and longer than the rest
    admit your screwups and avoid repeating them
    be approachable and listen
    know the SOP'S and follow them

    What to do about an incapable guy?
    hand him a transfer letter
    Really though, sometimes you have to train, sometimes you have to teach, sometimes you have to just chew some ***! But before you can do any of those, have or be in the process of developing the leadership qualities. I can't call a guy on the carpet for something I don't do myself!

    Just some thoughts from me.

  11. #11
    MembersZone Subscriber ffmedcbk1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MemphisE34a View Post
    Yeah, but that wasn't the question.
    just expounding from my post before that
    Originally Posted by madden01
    "and everyone is encouraged to use Plain, Spelled Out English. I thought this was covered in NIMS training."

  12. #12
    Forum Member Dave1983's Avatar
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    I had a radio in my pocket and a hand-light clipped on my coat. Other then that, I used to carry what we call a crash axe, not sure what the proper name is.

    Its a tool with a combination adze and axe head on one end with a fork-type pry end on the other. The pry end extends if you need more leverage. Extended its about 30" in length, about 20" as carried.

    Very handy little tool, easy to carry and lightweight.

    I moved to an admin position just before we got our TICs, but if was still on the road today I would carry that as well.
    Fire Marshal/Safety Officer

    IAAI-NFPA-IAFC/VCOS-Retired IAFF

    "No his mind is not for rent, to any god or government"
    RUSH-Tom Sawyer

    Success is when skill meets opportunity
    Failure is when fantasy meets reality

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by ffmedcbk1 View Post
    The USMC teaches the 14 leadership traits
    "JJDIDTIEBUCKLE"
    TOT (Totally Off Topic)

    Thanks ffmedcbk1, I'm making a copy of this and sending it to the "management team" at my place of employment...

  14. #14
    Forum Member Bones42's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave1983 View Post
    ...Its a tool with a combination adze and axe head on one end with a fork-type pry end on the other. The pry end extends if you need more leverage. Extended its about 30" in length, about 20" as carried.

    Very handy little tool, easy to carry and lightweight.
    ...
    Sounds like a Paratech Pry-Axe. My favorite tool as an officer...
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

  15. #15
    Forum Member len1582's Avatar
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    Engine company

    Handlight slung over shoulder...One hand holding a TIC, the other on my nozzlemans shoulder guiding and directing.

    In addition to training, advising, and mentoring a "good officer" makes sure his crew goes home at the end of the tour.

    Take the time not only to train hands on, but to teach. Tossing someone an SOP binder and saying learn it isn't doing squat. Talk with him and explain what's done and how to do it. Be fair but firm. It not something nice to know, it's what he must know.

    Don't yell at someone for not knowing something if you never took the time to teach them.

    I also agree with a lot of what was already said.

  16. #16
    Forum Member gunnyv's Avatar
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    Semper fi, Brother.

    The following fit into company officer characteristics too-just remove "Marine" and insert "Firefighter":

    Marine Corps Leadership Principles

    Know yourself and seek self-improvement.
    Be technically and tactically proficient.
    Develop a sense of responsibility among your subordinates.
    Make sound and timely decisions.
    Set the example.
    Know your Marines and look out for their welfare.
    Keep your Marines informed.
    Seek responsibility and take responsibility for your actions.
    Ensure assigned tasks are understood, supervised, and accomplished.
    Train your Marines as a team.
    Employ your command in accordance with its capabilities.


    As far as tools, halligan, personal light, radio, and TIC as the Engine CO. Not to mention pushing/pulling line (3 man Eng Co)

    For incapable crew members, document the problems, look for underlying causes (substance abuse, personal or medical issues) that can be addressed, provide the mentoring and remedial training they need, and if they do not respond, hold them accountable via the dept's disciplinary policy.

    Quote Originally Posted by ffmedcbk1 View Post
    The USMC teaches the 14 leadership traits
    "JJDIDTIEBUCKLE"

    Justice, Judgement, Dependiability, Integrety, Decision Making, Tact, Initiative, Endurance, Bearing, Unselfishness, Courage, Knowledge, Loyalty, Enthusiasm

    Judgement
    The ability to weigh facts and possible solutions on which to base sound decisions.

    Justice
    Giving reward and punishment according to merits of the case in question. The ability to administer a system of rewards and punishments impartially and consistently.

    Dependability
    The certainty of proper performance of duty.

    Initiative
    Taking action in the absence of orders.

    Decisiveness
    Ability to make decisions promptly and to announce them in clear, forceful manner.

    Tact
    The ability to deal with others without creating offense.

    Integrity
    Uprightness of character and soundness of moral principles; includes the qualities of truthfulness and honesty.

    Endurance
    The mental and physical stamina measured by the ability to withstand pain, fatigue, stress and hardship.

    Bearing
    Creating a favorable impression in carriage, appearence and personal conduct at all times.

    Unselfishness

    Avoidance of providing for one's own comfort and personal advancement at the expense of others.

    Courage
    The mental quality that recognizes fear of danger or criticism, but enables a man to proceed in the face of it with calmness and firmness.

    Knowledge
    Understanding of a science or an art. The range of one's information, including professional knowledge and an understanding of your Marines.

    Loyalty
    The quality of faithfulness to country, the Corps, the unit, to one's seniors, subordinates and peers.

    Enthusiasm
    The display of sincere interest and exuberance in the performance of duty.

    Learned at Parris Island and I will carry that with me for the rest of my life.

  17. #17
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    Default Questions?

    I am a Truck Officer and every so often I am punished and sent to the Engine, but on both pieces I step off with a haligan, TIC, and light. this allows me to move fast and help with the first stretch if necessary.

    Some qualities that are integral with being a good Officer is the ability to listen to your crew, take what they say under advisement, be able to admit your shortcomings, know your equipment, know your job, lead by example, be honest, be fair, defend your guys, praise them in public, reprimand them in private, always give the credit for good things to your guys, take the blame when things go wrong, be trustworthy, and do more for your guys than you would expect them to do for you. If you're a good leader, you'll never have to ask anyone to follow you because they will always be there.

    If I had a crwew member who was incapable I would first try to find out if he/she is incapable because of lack of knowledge, lack of training, lack of skill, or lack of caring, or just lack of motivation. If it is lack of motivation, skills, training, or knowledge then the blame falls on me and I would correct that by training the member in such a way that is not demeaning or embarassing. I would even appoint another member as a mentor. Until the member is brought up to speed, I would learn his/her strengths and put them in a position where we could all benefit. Now, if it is a lack of caring(bad attitude, disgruntled, etc...) I would investigte further and see if this is normal for the member or if something in life has just got in the way recently. We would talk about it privately and I would tell the member, "if you don't care, OK. that's fine, than you should transfer, quit, or fake it as best you can in order to keep the rest of us safe."
    Last edited by AbduNur; 05-09-2009 at 08:24 PM.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by sfrtk911 View Post
    What do you carry into a working fire (please specify which apparatus you ride)

    What do you think are qualities which are integral to being a "good officer"?

    How do you deal with "incapable" crew members?
    thanx
    I usually ride on the engine so I have a radio in my radio pocket. The only tool(s) is a combination of a TNT and a Halogen strapped together.

    A good office is someone that has been on a department on for a few years and has seen some action. Has to be stern when need and open to critisim at the same time.

    Train them.

  19. #19
    Back In Black ChiefKN's Avatar
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    Back when....

    Radio
    Handlight
    Halligan
    I am now a past chief and the views, opinions, and comments are mine and mine alone. I do not speak for any department or in any official capacity. Although, they would be smart to listen to me.

    "The last thing I want to do is hurt you. But it's still on the list."

    "When tempted to fight fire with fire, remember that the Fire Department usually uses water."

  20. #20
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    If I am not going to join the initial attack but will be the IC, I just carry my radio while doing a 360 degree survey of scene. If I am in the attack, I will have my radio and pick axe or tool, and a flashlight.

    I think an important quality for an officer is his/her own self esteem. A person who does not feel good about himself/herself can not act/speak with confidence and, in turn, can not inspire confidence in his/her leadership. I try to smile as much as I can. When I need to address a group in a meeting, I stand up and speaking confidently.

    Finally, in the case of the rural volunteer department for which I am an officer, everyone has a role they fill. Some don't respond to very many calls but are first to help with fundraising and other jobs. Others are among the same group that responds to every call. In that scenario, no one member is an imcompetent firefighter. When, however, I have to give constructive criticism or capitalize on a teaching moment, I use the qualities above to help my communication. I smile, I speak confidently, and I try to inspire.

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