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  1. #41
    Forum Member scfire86's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jasper45 View Post
    If I'm not mistaken, and Sc can speak for himself, but Sc has stated previously that he was drafted into the Vietnam era army.
    I think an apology is appropriate.
    Thanks Jasper. I don't need an apology from farmboy. His statements speak for themselves.
    Politics is like driving. To go forward select "D", to go backward select "R."


  2. #42
    Forum Member gamewell35's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by neiowa View Post
    OK peckerhead. What branch of the military (US military) did you serve, in what MOS, what unit, what slots? List them. If none, then STFU and move on to your/Dem Underground's other (non-military) talking points.
    Since when did you become the chief prosecutor of this forum? Last time i checked, this man is not on trial. If he served in the military and what he did is certainly none of anyone's business except his own. You were totally out of line on this one.
    "Did you check under the bed?" -- Judge Crater, 1930

  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by MarcusKspn View Post
    This is the mindset that just really floors me.

    What if his "marxist agenda" causes the economy to recover? Would you rather people suffer under an agenda that you can agree with, instead of having a country that is improving under a system that you disagree with?

    "Unemployment is up, the stock market is down, people are loosing the houses, but don't talk Marxist to me! I would rather be a broke capitalist instead of Marxist who can make a living!"

    Newsflash: OUR WAY causes a global financial meltdown! So whatever we do, lets not deviate from Capitalism
    According to Karl Mark, this socialism is the last step before communism. Now go back into the 70s and 80s and look at communist Russia. Those people had no fuel to keep their homes warm, food was scarce, Most Russians lived a meager existence with no freedoms. Capitalism improved the quality of life for all Russians.

    Our current society is 50 Capitalist, 50% socialism. Perhaps it was the infusion of socialism that caused the capitalism to fail, for without the burden of socialism, capitalism is free to grow.

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    Quote Originally Posted by scfire86 View Post
    George, I won't speak for Marcus but I believe he put marxist in quotes because he (like me) doesn't believe Obama is a marxist. Unless you have proof Obama is seizing corporate interests with the intent of keeping them under government control in perpetuity the M word is really nothing more than hyperbole and the typical fear mongering the conservative news media has become.
    Well he is pushing for 10 of 10 of the requirements as put fourth by Marx, if that is definitely Marxist.

  5. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by MalahatTwo7 View Post
    Regardless of personal feelings or opinions, name calling need not be applied here. Thanks.
    OMG!!!! You do realize he is referring to the master of name calling don't you?

  6. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by jasper45 View Post
    If I'm not mistaken, and Sc can speak for himself, but Sc has stated previously that he was drafted into the Vietnam era army.
    I think an apology is appropriate.
    SC says a lot of things that are incorrect or false, how do you know when to believe him? Better question. Was he on the North or the South?

  7. #47
    Forum Member scfire86's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ScareCrow57 View Post
    SC says a lot of things that are incorrect or false, how do you know when to believe him? Better question. Was he on the North or the South?
    We know a thing about you. You're not smart.
    Last edited by scfire86; 04-18-2009 at 01:06 AM.
    Politics is like driving. To go forward select "D", to go backward select "R."

  8. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by ScareCrow57 View Post
    Well he is pushing for 10 of 10 of the requirements as put fourth by Marx, if that is definitely Marxist.
    Can you tell me what the 10 requirements are? Or are you just repeating what you heard on "I-Hate-Obama" Radio this morning?

    At least go through the trouble of copy & pasting them and explaining to me what he is actually pushing for.
    "They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." -- Benjamin Franklin

  9. #49
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    Here, I saved you the trouble:

    1. Abolition of property in land and application of all rents of land to public purposes. - has not happened, nor will it happen. Actually the Bush era policy of deciding that government can use Eminent Domain to take your property and give it to Wal-Mart to make more money in taxes would be the closest thing to this that I can think of

    2. A heavy progressive or graduated income tax. - People always bitch about taxes, so they will probably say that this applies.

    3. Abolition of all right of inheritance. - Find me any source that can cite Obama on abolishing inheritance

    4. Confiscation of the property of all emigrants and rebels. - Actually the conservative desire to deport the illegals and take their property to pay for the costs associated with the illegals would be the closest thing to this requirement.

    5. Centralisation of credit in the hands of the State, by means of a national bank with State capital and an exclusive monopoly. - People are crying that Obama is centralizing the banks. Other than opinion pieces I have not seen any proof. I'll give Obama 1/2 a point for this requirement

    6. Centralisation of the means of communication and transport in the hands of the State. -There are 2 landline, 6 cell phone, and lots of VoIP providers trying to get me to switch to their service, so there is no Centralized communication. I'll give him 0.5 points for maybe having to back the big 3 (or 2, Ford is trying)

    7. Extension of factories and instruments of production owned by the State; the bringing into cultivation of waste-lands, and the improvement of the soil generally in accordance with a common plan. - Not happening

    8. Equal liability of all to labour. Establishment of industrial armies, especially for agriculture. - Unions? they have been around long before Obama

    9. Combination of agriculture with manufacturing industries; gradual abolition of the distinction between town and country, by a more equal distribution of the population over the country. - Not happening, if anything more people are moving into towns looking for work

    10. Free education for all children in public schools. Abolition of children's factory labour in its present form. Combination of education with industrial production, &c., &c. - Been around forever, education vouchers that Bush proposed would be close to this as well.


    Looking from this Obama's policies cover 2 of the 10 requirements, and one of them is Taxes. People always bitch over taxes.

    Bush era policy would cover 2 as well, but different ones.

    But hey, the conservatives say that he is Marxist, so lets not do any research.

    After all these years, we are still scared of the communists.....
    "They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." -- Benjamin Franklin

  10. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by MarcusKspn View Post
    Can you tell me what the 10 requirements are? Or are you just repeating what you heard on "I-Hate-Obama" Radio this morning?

    At least go through the trouble of copy & pasting them and explaining to me what he is actually pushing for.
    Sure can, unlike our friend SC, I have sources facts and figures. I don't just read the Huffington Post and run with it.

    The Communist Manifesto

    10 Conditions For Transition To Communism

    1. Abolition of property in land and application of all rents of land to public purposes.
    2. A heavy progressive or graduated income tax.
    3. Abolition of all right of inheritance.
    4. Confiscation of the property of all emigrants and rebels.
    5. Centralisation of credit in the hands of the State, by means of a national bank with State capital and an exclusive monopoly.
    6. Centralisation of the means of communication and transport in the hands of the State.
    7. Extension of factories and instruments of production owned by the State; the bringing into cultivation of waste-lands, and the improvement of the soil generally in accordance with a common plan.
    8. Equal liability of all to labour. Establishment of industrial armies, especially for agriculture.
    9. Combination of agriculture with manufacturing industries; gradual abolition of the distinction between town and country, by a more equal distribution of the population over the country.
    10. Free education for all children in public schools. Abolition of children's factory labour in its present form. Combination of education with industrial production, &c., &c.[7]

  11. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by MarcusKspn View Post
    Here, I saved you the trouble:

    1. Abolition of property in land and application of all rents of land to public purposes. - has not happened, nor will it happen. Actually the Bush era policy of deciding that government can use Eminent Domain to take your property and give it to Wal-Mart to make more money in taxes would be the closest thing to this that I can think of

    2. A heavy progressive or graduated income tax. - People always bitch about taxes, so they will probably say that this applies.

    3. Abolition of all right of inheritance. - Find me any source that can cite Obama on abolishing inheritance

    4. Confiscation of the property of all emigrants and rebels. - Actually the conservative desire to deport the illegals and take their property to pay for the costs associated with the illegals would be the closest thing to this requirement.

    5. Centralisation of credit in the hands of the State, by means of a national bank with State capital and an exclusive monopoly. - People are crying that Obama is centralizing the banks. Other than opinion pieces I have not seen any proof. I'll give Obama 1/2 a point for this requirement

    6. Centralisation of the means of communication and transport in the hands of the State. -There are 2 landline, 6 cell phone, and lots of VoIP providers trying to get me to switch to their service, so there is no Centralized communication. I'll give him 0.5 points for maybe having to back the big 3 (or 2, Ford is trying)

    7. Extension of factories and instruments of production owned by the State; the bringing into cultivation of waste-lands, and the improvement of the soil generally in accordance with a common plan. - Not happening

    8. Equal liability of all to labour. Establishment of industrial armies, especially for agriculture. - Unions? they have been around long before Obama

    9. Combination of agriculture with manufacturing industries; gradual abolition of the distinction between town and country, by a more equal distribution of the population over the country. - Not happening, if anything more people are moving into towns looking for work

    10. Free education for all children in public schools. Abolition of children's factory labour in its present form. Combination of education with industrial production, &c., &c. - Been around forever, education vouchers that Bush proposed would be close to this as well.


    Looking from this Obama's policies cover 2 of the 10 requirements, and one of them is Taxes. People always bitch over taxes.

    Bush era policy would cover 2 as well, but different ones.

    But hey, the conservatives say that he is Marxist, so lets not do any research.

    After all these years, we are still scared of the communists.....
    Well you are correct in one thing, it has been eroding for 100 years.

    1. We have zoning, part way there and then there is that nasty property tax
    2. No brainer, been in existence since before I was a smile on daddy's face.
    3. Inheritance tax taxes everything over 600,000
    4. emigrants are different than illegal immigrants
    5. AIG, Citibank,Fannae Mae, Freddie Mac, Federal Reserve, need I say more
    6. Public transportation and they want to expand it.
    7. GM, Chrysler, Bailout Heaven, USDA.
    8. Minimum Wage, Now the capping of wages.
    9. On this one they have screwed up, they are trying to eliminate rural Americans
    10. LMAO!!!! I got a free high school education as does everyone in America. The elementary, junior high and senior high schools are controlled by the government. There are also many state run colleges that also give free or reduced fee educations.

    You have gotten yourself caught up in Partisan Politics. WAKE UP!@!!!!! It isn't just one party, both are screwing the American People, and apparently a lot of them enjoy it. Then again, I guess a lot of people like in the butt!!

  12. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by scfire86 View Post
    We know a thing about you. You're not smart.
    We know one thing about you to. Your vocabulary consist of idiotboy, Obama, moonbat, Obama, fever swamp, Obama, conservative, Obama, liberal, Obama, Bankruptcy, Pelosi, Not a citizen, Pelosi, and Marx.

    At least I am smart enough to post sources for my post. Since you fabricate everything and have no sources you cannot.

  13. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by ScareCrow57 View Post
    Well you are correct in one thing, it has been eroding for 100 years.

    1. We have zoning, part way there and then there is that nasty property tax zoning does not equal abolishing public land ownership, pre-Obama
    2. No brainer, been in existence since before I was a smile on daddy's face. so pre-Obama
    3. Inheritance tax taxes everything over 600,000 Paying taxes does not equal abolishing your inheritance - and pre-Obama
    4. emigrants are different than illegal immigrants not anything Obama is doing
    5. AIG, Citibank,Fannae Mae, Freddie Mac, Federal Reserve, need I say more Bailout = pre-Obama
    6. Public transportation and they want to expand it. Nothing happening with communication, still lots of different airline companies, cab companies, non-public transportation companies
    7. GM, Chrysler, Bailout Heaven, USDA. started under Bush; pre-Obama
    8. Minimum Wage, Now the capping of wages. minimum wage = pre-Obama; only capping wages of companies that took taxpayer money
    9. On this one they have screwed up, they are trying to eliminate rural Americans pre-obama
    10. LMAO!!!! I got a free high school education as does everyone in America. The elementary, junior high and senior high schools are controlled by the government. There are also many state run colleges that also give free or reduced fee educations. pre-Obama

    You have gotten yourself caught up in Partisan Politics. WAKE UP!@!!!!! It isn't just one party, both are screwing the American People, and apparently a lot of them enjoy it. Then again, I guess a lot of people like in the butt!!
    Quote Originally Posted by ScareCrow57 View Post
    Well he is pushing for 10 of 10 of the requirements as put fourth by Marx, if that is definitely Marxist.
    I got myself caught up in partisan politics? YOU said that Obama is establishing the 10 rules for marxism, then you turn around and list that this has been going on for a 100 years?

    Face it, you had no idea what the 10 rules were when you first talked about them, you were only repeating crap you heard on the radio/FoxNews/got in some e-mail. When I called you out you did a google search and posted your explanation. Except your explanation reinforces the point that this is not an orchestrated effort by Obama.
    "They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." -- Benjamin Franklin

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    Quote Originally Posted by MarcusKspn View Post
    I got myself caught up in partisan politics? YOU said that Obama is establishing the 10 rules for marxism, then you turn around and list that this has been going on for a 100 years?

    Face it, you had no idea what the 10 rules were when you first talked about them, you were only repeating crap you heard on the radio/FoxNews/got in some e-mail. When I called you out you did a google search and posted your explanation. Except your explanation reinforces the point that this is not an orchestrated effort by Obama.
    Yes I did, Obama is pushing us farther left than we are now. On a scale of -10 to +10, where -10 is socialism and +10 is capitalism we are around -5. Once we hit -10 we will be in full fledged communism. I first posted it on
    April-14-2009 At the link provided in response to something NozzleBrain had said.

    And I hate to disappoint you, bit I donít listen to conservative radio, I rarely watch Fox news, and the emails I get I verify (most of the time) Hence many of those never get repeated. I learned about Marx and the Communist Manifesto 35 years ago when our schools actually educated people.

    But you are obviously being partisan, with all of your deflecting blame from Obama and saying it is all Bushís fault.

    However:

    1. Zoning is a step in the direction of abolishing ownership of property. Telling me what I can do with my property is headed in that direction.
    2. You are showing partisanship.
    3. Paying inheritance tax is the first step to abolishing inheritance, We start at 600,000 and leave it there, soon the economy catches up and it is gone.
    4. You are showing partisanship. Again
    5. You are showing partisanship. Again. However, Obama continued and fired the CEO of GM. WTF!!!!
    6. Apparently you havenít heard about the effort to extend broadband and cell service, Ever hear of the FCC.
    7. Started under Jimmy Carter. You got that one way wrong.
    8. Minimum Wage, I donít care when it started, its wrong. Capping wages and allowing governments to control business is socialism.
    9. You are showing partisanship. Again
    10. You are showing partisanship. Again


    Whether it is pre-Obama or not doesnít really matter. The country is going the wrong direction, and is being pushed farther in the wrong direction. Stop playing the blame game and start defending our capitalistic values and freedom.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ScareCrow57 View Post
    Whether it is pre-Obama or not doesnít really matter. The country is going the wrong direction, and is being pushed farther in the wrong direction. Stop playing the blame game and start defending our capitalistic values and freedom.
    But it does matter, because you said that Obama is the one that put the 10 values in place. You said that Obama is marxist because he put the 10 guidelines into place, then turn around and say that we were following the guidelines for the last 100 years. I am not defending Obama, I am just tired of this anti-Obama bull. How can you put all the blame on him, when you yourself are saying that this has been going on for ages before him?

    And I hate to disappoint you. But OUR capitalistic values are what got us into this mess. Capitalism, minimal regulation, and greed is what got us into this mess. If you think that capitalism, minimal regulation, and greed will get us out of that mess than you are drinking the cool-aid.
    "They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." -- Benjamin Franklin

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    Quote Originally Posted by MarcusKspn View Post
    But it does matter, because you said that Obama is the one that put the 10 values in place. You said that Obama is marxist because he put the 10 guidelines into place, then turn around and say that we were following the guidelines for the last 100 years. I am not defending Obama, I am just tired of this anti-Obama bull. How can you put all the blame on him, when you yourself are saying that this has been going on for ages before him?
    What I said was "Well he is pushing for 10 of 10 of the requirements as put fourth by Marx, that is definitely Marxist." Now, look at the 10 items and tell me which ones he is backing off on. That was all in response to some knucklehead. It is anti-Obama because he isnít fixing anything; he is simply accelerating us down the wrong road. Bush, Clinton, Bush, Reagan, Carter, Ford, Nixon, Johnson, Kennedy, Eisenhower, and Truman, kept taking us down the wrong road to socialism. FDR put us on that road. The people voted for change, but this isnít the change we want, we are simply getting more of the same!

    And I hate to disappoint you. But OUR capitalistic values are what got us into this mess. Capitalism, minimal regulation, and greed is what got us into this mess. If you think that capitalism, minimal regulation, and greed will get us out of that mess than you are drinking the cool-aid.

    You are probably right about that. Workers demanding better wages and working conditions, go figure. We should adopt the communist model. You will work and like it and you will like the conditions and you will like the pay. (Sarcasm off) Like it or not, unions and higher wages are a direct result of capitalism.

    Heck, even with this mess, our standard of living is still way above those of any communist/socialist country. So the alternative is not any better. The regulations you are so fond of actually encouraged crooked businessmen to take advantage of the regulations. Think about it. When someone invests money in a business or with a broker, they do so believing they are above board because the government is regulating them. Take away the government regulation and the investor takes a little more effort to make sure their investments are placed with good reputable companies.

  17. #57
    Forum Member scfire86's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by idiotboy
    Take away the government regulation and the investor takes a little more effort to make sure their investments are placed with good reputable companies.
    Really? You assume that companies will always be above board in providing truthful information to investors?

    No wonder you're making minimum wage.
    Politics is like driving. To go forward select "D", to go backward select "R."

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    Quote Originally Posted by scfire86 View Post
    Really? You assume that companies will always be above board in providing truthful information to investors?

    No wonder you're making minimum wage.

    And you assume the government will be truthful???? The government has repeatedly shown that it cannot be trusted. Hell government canít even run their own offices effectively or efficiently. Itís fun to listen to the state workers around here. Everyone one of them can tell you about multiple folks in their offices who come and do nothing all day long.

    When did they raise the minimum wage to $30 an hour + bonuses + stocks + benefits?

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    Quote Originally Posted by ScareCrow57 View Post
    Heck, even with this mess, our standard of living is still way above those of any communist/socialist country. So the alternative is not any better.
    Yup, because all of Europe (which are all varying degrees of socialist countries) is a 3rd world country.......
    "They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." -- Benjamin Franklin

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    Quote Originally Posted by ScareCrow57 View Post
    And you assume the government will be truthful???? The government has repeatedly shown that it cannot be trusted. Hell government canít even run their own offices effectively or efficiently.
    And all the banks, brokers, realtors have repeatedly shown that they cannot be trusted. If there is one thing this mess has shown us is that business cannot regulate themselves.

    Ever tried putting B-shift on an honor system??? It doesn't work
    "They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." -- Benjamin Franklin

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