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  1. #1
    Forum Member MoosemanKBB527's Avatar
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    Default A Few Question about a new truck

    ok so we working on specing a new truck in my dept and i have a few things have come up

    1.) our current truck has only 300 GAL of water on it and I thought i remember seeing somewhere that the new minimum specs for a NFPA compliant Class A pumper is that you now need 500gal minimum (please correct me if Im wrong... also if someone has a copy of that spec i would greatly appreciate it)

    2.) also we currently are in a debt over whether or not to have foam on out new truck , a few of our members have said that foam eats your gear, has anyone else heard this , also is a foam system now mandatory for a class A pumper

    also any more information on foam (links pleas) would be greatly appreciated.
    ~Big O~

    Tankers have wheels and carry water, Tenders are breaded and served with BBQ sauce

    (if you don't believe me Google it)


  2. #2
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    one feature to spec, CAFS.

  3. #3
    Let's talk fire trucks! BoxAlarm187's Avatar
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    1. 300 gallons is minimum for Class A pumper. This was done so quints could meet the Class A pumper minimum specification.

    2. Foam does not eat your gear, however it does assist in fire extinguishment. You have to use common sense, though - just like you flush a foam system so it doesn't eat away the seals, I would rinse my gear off if I happen to get a bunch of foam all over it. Regardless, foam systems are NOT required by NFPA 1901.

    What are you specifically looking for as far as links for the foam?
    Career Fire Captain
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  4. #4
    Forum Member MoosemanKBB527's Avatar
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    well specifically there was one video that was posted on here a few months ago where the st a barn on fire then used one line to put most of it out ... its like 10min long... otherwise just some articles on pros and cons of foam


    we dont want CAFS ... to much for a dept that runs 3 or 4 structures a year plus then we have to buy all new nozzles and homes (i think)
    Last edited by MoosemanKBB527; 04-23-2009 at 10:20 PM.
    ~Big O~

    Tankers have wheels and carry water, Tenders are breaded and served with BBQ sauce

    (if you don't believe me Google it)

  5. #5
    MembersZone Subscriber ffmedcbk1's Avatar
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    moose, I don't see at truck in the atvar picture there... whick one of them has the aerial on it?

    the 300 vs 500 is a preference. you can have 300 as a minimum and that is ok if you are ok with it. I both run on a suburban and a rural department. they have 300 and 500 on the quints. now it is not likely to send them first due, but if they possibly ever will be 1st due, set them up with the 500 tank. imo.

    foam is good and cafs is great, however if you are having issues getting everyone training now in the department at drill nights, it will be hard to get all of them to understand the differnces in pump ops with cafs. hard but not impossible.

    the best option for a truck is manpower... it is a flashlight on a stick otherwise.
    Originally Posted by madden01
    "and everyone is encouraged to use Plain, Spelled Out English. I thought this was covered in NIMS training."

  6. #6
    Forum Member MoosemanKBB527's Avatar
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    this is the truck were replacing


    1000 gpm pump

    300 gal water

    we keep it light wight and short because of the place it needs to go which is also why we feel the need to put foam on it it essentially like put a 1000 gallons of plain water on it (assuming we get the 500 gallon tank on the new truck)
    ~Big O~

    Tankers have wheels and carry water, Tenders are breaded and served with BBQ sauce

    (if you don't believe me Google it)

  7. #7
    Let's talk fire trucks! BoxAlarm187's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MoosemanKBB527 View Post
    well specifically there was one video that was posted on here a few months ago where the st a barn on fire then used one line to put most of it out ... its like 10min long... otherwise just some articles on pros and cons of foam
    From your description, it sounds like you're describing this video. If this IS the one you're talking about, make note that they're using CAFS.

    Google is your friend. Because I'm a nice guy, I'll post a couple for you. The rest you can probably find on your own...

    Fire Chief Magazine: The finer points of foam.
    Fire Engineering Magazine: Class A 101 Webcast Q&A

    HTH....
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  8. #8
    Forum Member MoosemanKBB527's Avatar
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    i tried google ans all i got was a bunch of manufactures websites
    ~Big O~

    Tankers have wheels and carry water, Tenders are breaded and served with BBQ sauce

    (if you don't believe me Google it)

  9. #9
    Forum Member FIREMECH1's Avatar
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    Get a tank with 500 gals. Like the old adage, bigger is better.

    On foam. If you make it a choice, spec a "class A foam" system. It is easier on everything in the system. If you can, stay away from class B, unless you spec an eductor to flow it. Reason being is if you don't use B foam alot, it will corrode and/or eat up alot of valves, sensors, etc.

    FM1

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    Before you finish specs bring in some demos on Class A and CAF's we run a Medi with 250 gallons and CAF's the truck is smallish and 4x4 on a GMC 5500, we use it where we can't get our full size CAF's pumper.
    The foam is Soap so if you get covered rince it off it will help keep your gear cleaner.
    We were in the same boat with people not wanting to switch, But with a few good demos and seeing a local small (70 GPM-30 CFM) unit getting better knock downs then full-size units while not using anywhere near the water got everyone on board.
    If you can't get everyone to come to training's with the new Truck Skip the CAF's and just get Class A.
    Most of the problems with CAF's come from Lack of Proper training or improper installation.

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    The fitting in the bottom of our foam tank corroded and needed to be replaced. So when we got to the project we pumped out all we could, but about 1/2 gal ran down our arms and onto our t-shirts. We didn't have to use laundry soap for about a month. I just threw that t-shirt in the washing machine with my dirty clothes and it made plenty of suds.

  12. #12
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    Foam is good, CAFS is much, much better. Basically, you're injecting air into the foam, increasing the size of the bubbles. If you're looking at going with a small tank, I'd go CAFS.

    Don't know about replacing nozzles, it depends on what you've got now. If you're currently using smoothbores, you can keep those. Plus, when you're spec'ing out a new truck, what's the added cost of a few nozzles?

  13. #13
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    Read through this forum. There is a link to two good articles on CAFS and the studies done at a major city and what they learned.

    http://www.centralpafire.com/forum/s...highlight=CAFS

  14. #14
    Forum Member FyredUp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MoosemanKBB527 View Post
    ok so we working on specing a new truck in my dept and i have a few things have come up

    1.) our current truck has only 300 GAL of water on it and I thought i remember seeing somewhere that the new minimum specs for a NFPA compliant Class A pumper is that you now need 500gal minimum (please correct me if Im wrong... also if someone has a copy of that spec i would greatly appreciate it)

    If at all possible get the 500 gallons of water. The more water you can carry the better.

    2.) also we currently are in a debt over whether or not to have foam on out new truck , a few of our members have said that foam eats your gear, has anyone else heard this , also is a foam system now mandatory for a class A pumper

    I highly recommend you get class A foam. It makes the water far more effective.

    Class A foam will not eat your gear.

    No foam is not mandatory.


    also any more information on foam (links pleas) would be greatly appreciated.

    Good luck.

  15. #15
    Forum Member Fyrtrks's Avatar
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    Moose:

    Please send me a PM or email fyrtrks @ yahoo (.) com
    Fyrtrks

  16. #16
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    So what did you buy?

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