1/4 mile reverse lay
We had a fire a little while back that we had to do a 1200ft reverse hose lay to a hydrant water pressure wasnt great and the real fun is at the end of the night loading almost a 1/4 of mile of hose. I just wanted to hear any experiences were any one else has done that and how much do you usually carry. We are obviously in a rural area and our tanker was out of commission.
First a few questions: Was the case that it was in a relay with an engine at the hydrant and at the attack position? Or was that a single engine dropping a hose and attack packs and laying out to the hydrant?
I have done 5" in a split lay (relayed) from a hydrant. Then, that engine I was on carried almost 2000 feet. The current engine has 1200 feet of 5" on it now. Does packing it suck??? yep.
If you are on the hydrant and it has low pressure you can do things to maximize it such as the relay pumper hooking into all hydrant discharges with 5" and then sending into their pump (right next to the hydrant) and relaying down to the attack engine. Keep the source pumper at a 20 psi residual and pump as much as you can to the attack pumper... THOSE ENGINEERS MUST COMMUNICATE FREQUENTLY!!!! mainly about the pressures and flow requirements. If that flow doesn't suffice, you'd need to reverse out another engine to another source or operate via tanker shuttle to suppliment
If it makes you feel better on the loading, we've had two occassions where engines have dumped an entire load of 5" hose just driving down the road. One was a two-lane residential area where we dropped about 1,200'. The other time was about 1,800' on a four-lane highway. Imagine the fun they had dodging traffic while loading that much LDH. :eek:
all that loading without even the excitement of a fire, talk about a bad day
That's no kidding. I got the opportunity to be on the first one. Thank God I wasn't on the second. The reason they found out they lost the hose was because the dispatch for the department they were mutual aiding on a trench rescue got a call for a car that got stuck on a coupling. Thankfully she wasn't going highway-speed. she slowed way down to exit because she didn't want to cross the hose going fast.
Originally Posted by nameless
I think you are seeing the effort of loading the hose up too much over the benefit of laying the hose for the fire and what its capabilities are. it has been said that a hose relay can often provide superior water flow (sustained) over a tanker shuttle.
The engines where I work have split beds of 5" 1000/1000 on one and 1100/1100 on another. You could most likely establish a 4000' relay and have sustained water flow faster than it would take to set up a full scale tanker operation.
We carry 1700' on our truck. We have drive ways that range from 300' to 1almost 14 1500' long. Loading hose in the middle of the night is not fun but it has to be done...
We carry 1000ft of 5". Friday I picked up reloaded it by myself after a training drill. Took a little more than an hour as I recall. I don't see the big deal and all the bitching about how difficult it is to work with. The capability and performance certainly make it worthwhile.
Maybe get the womens auxillary to help out.
We had a fire about a year ago, just outside of town. We had three supply lines(5") running from hydrants in town. The first stretch was 1250' with no relay pumper. The second stretch was 1500' with our old parade truck('56 open cab international) that is still listed as in service(although this is the first time it has been used in years) relay pumping to it. The third stretch was 2000' going to a ladder truck with a relay pumper on it.
We had two engines with 2-500' 1.75" attack lines each strung out, one had a 2.5 attack line strung out while the other used the deck gun. The ladder had 400' of 1.75" line strung off(along with using the ladder).
I think out of the 7 1/2-8 hours we were on scene, 2 of them were spent loading hose. You wanna talk about pushing a body to the limit, whew, i was worn smooth out.
Originally Posted by wade888
How about a little more info - Was there a Pumper on the Hydrant? Was there a pumper on the Fireground?? What kind of Flow were you trying to get??.... With That Info a lot of folks on here could provide a lot of good information that would help you.
And, for what it's worth, we do not carry 5 inch. LDH interferes with our "Normal" Operations in that when you drop a LDH Line and charge it, that area is blocked for later Apparatus Placement. We use 3 inch Supply Line, which you can drive over if needed. With our Hydrant System and Apparatus , we can flow 10,000 gpm at Fires when it's needed, without requiring LDH. Our system is set up with multiple Feeder mains, and everything cross connected on a grid system. "Dead End" Mains are few and far between. Our station has a 12 inch main passing in front, with cross connections to 24 inch lines about a half mile either way. those 24's run off of a 96 (Yes 96) inch Feeder about 4 miles west of us. Water is the least of our worries.............
We carry 1200' of 4" on our two Engines. Our 2nd due carries a hydrant assist valve, which is sop, sog, highly recommended or the chief will slap you, (whatever...) to attach on the "make the hydrant" command. We can establish a initial working flow and then boost if needed, without interuption.
When we 1st started using LDH (1981), we kept 2000' on a hydraulically operated reel on the 2nd Engine. It was "the only way to go" at that time. Sending that truck out to have that reel removed was the happiest day I've experienced on the dept!
Lucky sob! Or was it sod? Maybe its' sol... :confused:
Originally Posted by hwoods
1,200 feet is not too far for 4". It all depends on how much you want to flow.
Assuming you give me a truck capable of pumping 1,000 GPM at 250 psi, and hose service tested to 300 psi, I could push 1,000 GPM over 1,200' easy.
Also, make sure you make the right hydrant connections. Use every port on the hydrant. I like to add 2½" gate valve to the extra ports, and add additional lines as the flow progresses.
Here's one example where using the additional lines gave us 480 more GPM's.
Also, if the flows are kept at 750 or below, you can go 2,000' without trying too hard, until it's time to get he hose up.
Originally Posted by pvfd27
What were the shortcommings of the reel?
My dept has 10,000' of 7¼" hose, but it's in a traditional flat load on large trailers. I'd really like to see it on reels, assuming they operate properly.