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  1. #21
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    What is the builders name? that was quite a price difference, assuming the specs were the same.
    Any pics of this rig?


  2. #22
    Forum Member FWDbuff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by islandfire03 View Post
    Never said it was joe bagodonuts!
    This company had built over a hundred trucks that met the needs of rural departments in our area.
    Same compamy built us a 1000/1000 CAFS pumper in 2000 for 235k and the quality and engineering are superb. The truck has been problem free and gets the job done for us every time.
    Just because a regional builder is small doesnt mean they don't produce a top quality truck for a reasonable price. Add in the fact that they will build what the customer wants & how they want it and it's a win win situation for the customer ,US.

    If you want to pay too much for a truck that the big box builder wants to build go ahead and spend your hard fought dollars foolishly. We don't have the spare funds laying around to throw away for a nameplate.
    Sorry, I dont care WHO is building it. There is no way someone is going to build a thirty foot heavy rescue with a command module for under 300K. What I think here is there is a difference in your definition of a "Heavy Rescue" and my definition. My definition is the NFPA definition, and carrying enough equipment that the weight demands a tandem rear axle. Equipment carried includes everything from a socket set to train jacks, bottle jacks, hydraulic jacks, trench jacks and shoring, generators, dewatering equipment, pavement breakers, concrete saws, metal saws, every extrication tool you can think of, SCUBA/Dive gear, etc etc etc....

    THIS is a heavy rescue......
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  3. #23
    Forum Member islandfire03's Avatar
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    Talking might not meet big city specs but it works for us

    We don't have pavement breakers or trench rescue gear or the other shoring for skyscraper collapse rescue, But our tallest building is 4 stories and we only have 1 of them.
    We do have a 35kw hyd genset 350 ft electric reel 100 ft hydraulic reel 28 foot 4 head pneumatic light tower ,
    6 cold water/ice rescue suits and flotation gear ,life ring,10 rope bags from 50ft up to 350 ft, for ocean rescue,
    extrication cribbing & tools ,chain saws, rotary saws, saws-alls,skill saws, blocking & cribbing. floating stokes litter folding closet ladder, little giant ladder, 8 bottle 6000 psi cascade system with 3 chamber containment fill station capable of both scuba & scba filling.
    full assortment of hand and electric tools, 2 portable honda fire pumps and a big electric dewatering pump,
    full compliment of BLS & ALS equipment for large MCI's including cardiac AED/ monitor als bags ,backboards,keds,vac splints and just about all the equipment we carry on our type III als ambulance with the exception of the strecher.
    In the command module there is a radio bank , 6 bay charger with spare radios, full file drawer of documentation, ie map books ,preplans ,utility maps, niosh & oshsa manuals etc.
    It also has a 16 foot electric awning to provide coverage for the cascade operator and the emt's that run rehab station when you come to get a bottle change. there is a 16 bottle spare rack plus another 6 in wheel well holder tubes. There are foldup lawn chairs for rehab and even a folding handtruck for toting tools or the 20 full size cones it carries.
    Oh, almost forgot the microwave & coffee maker in the command cab which also has seating for 4 FF's with airpacks and lanterns for each.full sets of tools and irons are kept in a compartment. A 9000 lb winch is stored in the front bumper compartment with mounts on all 4 sides of the truck. The cab seats driver & officer with behind the seats storage instead of a bunk.
    I'm sure i've forgotton to list some equipment that stowed away but you get the idea.
    We did leave out a fridge as we ran out of compartment space and there's no Q's or other parade crap on it.

    In rural America this truck qualifies as a heavy rescue.
    Oh we don't have train jacks either ,but the nearest railroad is 20 miles away back up on the mainland.
    Last edited by islandfire03; 06-03-2009 at 02:49 AM. Reason: added comments

  4. #24
    Forum Member FWDbuff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by islandfire03 View Post
    We don't have pavement breakers or trench rescue gear or the other shoring for skyscraper collapse rescue, But our tallest building is 4 stories and we only have 1 of them.
    We do have a 35kw hyd genset 350 ft electric reel 100 ft hydraulic reel 28 foot 4 head pneumatic light tower ,
    6 cold water/ice rescue suits and flotation gear ,life ring,10 rope bags from 50ft up to 350 ft, for ocean rescue,
    extrication cribbing & tools ,chain saws, rotary saws, saws-alls,skill saws, blocking & cribbing. floating stokes litter folding closet ladder, little giant ladder, 8 bottle 6000 psi cascade system with 3 chamber containment fill station capable of both scuba & scba filling.
    full assortment of hand and electric tools, 2 portable honda fire pumps and a big electric dewatering pump,
    full compliment of BLS & ALS equipment for large MCI's including cardiac AED/ monitor als bags ,backboards,keds,vac splints and just about all the equipment we carry on our type III als ambulance with the exception of the strecher.
    In the command module there is a radio bank , 6 bay charger with spare radios, full file drawer of documentation, ie map books ,preplans ,utility maps, niosh & oshsa manuals etc.
    It also has a 16 foot electric awning to provide coverage for the cascade operator and the emt's that run rehab station when you come to get a bottle change. there is a 16 bottle spare rack plus another 6 in wheel well holder tubes. There are foldup lawn chairs for rehab and even a folding handtruck for toting tools or the 20 full size cones it carries.
    Oh, almost forgot the microwave & coffee maker in the command cab which also has seating for 4 FF's with airpacks and lanterns for each.full sets of tools and irons are kept in a compartment. A 9000 lb winch is stored in the front bumper compartment with mounts on all 4 sides of the truck. The cab seats driver & officer with behind the seats storage instead of a bunk.
    I'm sure i've forgotton to list some equipment that stowed away but you get the idea.
    We did leave out a fridge as we ran out of compartment space and there's no Q's or other parade crap on it.

    In rural America this truck qualifies as a heavy rescue.
    Oh we don't have train jacks either ,but the nearest railroad is 20 miles away back up on the mainland.
    And is all this on a tandem rear axle or a single? If it's a single, if it's not overweight, I bet it's damn near close! And you still haven't given us the name of the Mfr. And I still don't believe you got all that for under 300K.
    "Loyalty Above all Else. Except Honor."

  5. #25
    Forum Member Rescue101's Avatar
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    Hello? This is MAINE not PeeA. Not a huge need for Train jacks around here.If you set your compartments right you can get that all on a single and still be within the State limits for axle weight. Mebbe you should make a journey North to the Piney woods,I'm QUITE sure we could introduce you to some novel pieces built to serve their communities unique needs. Like Reel trucks and a few others seldom seen in Pa.Ever been to the Islands? You be hard pressed to get around with the Behemouth you posted the picture of. NARROW roads,little bridges and narrow winding drives. T.C.

  6. #26
    Forum Member Rescue101's Avatar
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    Our 100' Smeal Midmount Platform came in at around $870,000.Plus 47k for loose equipment.
    Last edited by Rescue101; 06-04-2009 at 08:17 AM.

  7. #27
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    Talking

    Buff send me a pm with your e-mail & i'll send you some pictures. I know it's hard to believe that innovation in the fire service happens outside of PEE- ay.
    As tim said come on north and open your brain,you might learn something about building things with Yankee frugality. we don't waste time or money on unnecessisary things.

    What will it take to convince you copies of the cancelled checks ????
    Chassis cost us 30k for a brand new sitting on the truck dealers lot down in new haven Ct. lot 3 year old GMC T8500.
    Sticker was 47k originally . 330hp Cat with 6 speed manual, long frame .

    1st payment to builder on chassis delivery to them 60k
    second payment to builder at body completion ready to paint insp. 60k
    final payment on delivery to our station 80k.
    The way I was taught math that comes out to a grand total of:
    [drum roll please] $ 230,000.00 American green dollars. As far as the builder come to New England to see their trucks.

  8. #28
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    WHO IS THE BUILDER?

    So not an NFPA chassis.

    What length is the body? 16-18' sounds about max for that chassis.

  9. #29
    Forum Member FWDbuff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by neiowa View Post
    WHO IS THE BUILDER?

    So not an NFPA chassis.

    What length is the body? 16-18' sounds about max for that chassis.
    Not only that, but if they have all the equipment mentioned, plus the command module, PLUS an 8-bottle cascase as mentioned, I bet a steak dinner that it's overweight!
    "Loyalty Above all Else. Except Honor."

  10. #30
    Forum Member FyredUp's Avatar
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    And we were told by Pirce, Seagrave, Custom Fire, Darley and Toyne we couldn't get built what we wanted for the money we had. Yet we did and more from a well known name in the business. (Nope not ALF)

  11. #31
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    it's formed aluminum, aluminum foil formed around a sheet of plywood for the body.


    Sorry!, i'll be quiet now.

  12. #32
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    Post Rescue/pumper ?

    Can a custom cab 6-man, 1500 gpm, small block motor, hyd gen, stainless body ,21k front axle, 28k rear ,be built for under ( $ 350,000 ) in todays economy ? Most new pumpers in our area are going for about $ 500k with " big block motors " and all the parade stuff !

  13. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by WoodbridgeFFII View Post
    Can a custom cab 6-man, 1500 gpm, small block motor, hyd gen, stainless body ,21k front axle, 28k rear ,be built for under ( $ 350,000 ) in todays economy ? Most new pumpers in our area are going for about $ 500k with " big block motors " and all the parade stuff !
    Parades don't put out fires. So why waste the money, all that does is brag about how much money you are getting to build the trucks for show and not work.

  14. #34
    Forum Member islandfire03's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FWDbuff View Post
    Not only that, but if they have all the equipment mentioned, plus the command module, PLUS an 8-bottle cascase as mentioned, I bet a steak dinner that it's overweight!
    I prefer london broil medium well.
    With Maine lobster for an apetizer!
    Whats an nfpa?? An over priced custom cab assembled by one of three companies from parts they bought from someone else?? Why does a commercial truck chassis built by a large american truck corporation not meet your standards.
    We don't care if it looks like a "real " firetruck , it does the job we needed it to fill.
    Why is it you can't think outside the box??
    IAFF disease on the brain ????
    Everyone can't use an overgrown tandem axel monstosity. the truck you sent aphoto of would not fit down many of our roads and would need to be driven for several miles to find somewhere large enough to turn it around.
    When our truck was built it met ALL current nfpa requirements including ground lighting and everything else required by 1901. It is not overweight and actually has a reserve capacity of around 4,800 lbs additional payload. been on the certified scales multiple times during production and after delivery to make sure we got the weight balance correct when loading equipment.
    When your father takes you on a road trip north, stop in and we'll even let you sit in it . :-}

  15. #35
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    Who was the "local" builder that you speak of? There's a select handful in New England that would attempt it.
    Quote Originally Posted by ThNozzleMan
    Why? Because we are firemen. We are decent human beings. We would be compelled by the overwhelming impulse to save an innocent child from a tragic, painful death because in the end, we are MEN.

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    Honorary Disclaimer: While I am a manufacturer representative, I am not here to sell my product. Any advice or knowledge shared is for informational purposes only. I do not use Firehouse.Com for promotional purposes.

  16. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by islandfire03 View Post
    I prefer london broil medium well.
    With Maine lobster for an apetizer!
    Whats an nfpa?? An over priced custom cab assembled by one of three companies from parts they bought from someone else?? Why does a commercial truck chassis built by a large american truck corporation not meet your standards. Show me in my posts where I made that claim
    We don't care if it looks like a "real " firetruck , it does the job we needed it to fill. Show me in my posts where I made that claim
    Why is it you can't think outside the box?? You are certainly the first person ever to accuse me of this. Many on here know that I am quite capable of thinking outside the box.
    IAFF disease on the brain ???? Want to play silly games? Ok, fine. I am what you pretend to be.
    Everyone can't use an overgrown tandem axel monstosity. the truck you sent aphoto of would not fit down many of our roads and would need to be driven for several miles to find somewhere large enough to turn it around.And a commercial chassis with a 30-foot box would? When our truck was built it met ALL current nfpa requirements including ground lighting and everything else required by 1901. But does it meet the minimum standard to be designated a "HEAVY RESCUE"?? It is not overweight and actually has a reserve capacity of around 4,800 lbs additional payload. been on the certified scales multiple times during production and after delivery to make sure we got the weight balance correct when loading equipment. A T8500 GMC, with a 30-foot box, carrying ALL of the equipment that has been previously mentioned, in addition to an 8-bottle cascade unit, and a command module, on a single screw is not overweight? Remember when you mentioned "would it take seeing the canceled checks? Well now I want to see a CAT scale ticket for gross and axle weights, because I simply don't believe that the unit is not overweight. According to GMC's website, the max GVWR for a T8500 (single screw) is 34-39000K. Not a lot of room to play with there after you drop a 30 foot box on it plus all of the other amenities mentioned before.
    When your father takes you on a road trip north, stop in and we'll even let you sit in it . Sorry no road trips up north for me, I have limited vacation days and activities planned with my family for those days. :-}
    Why did you choose to call this unit a "UTILITY" in your private message to me? Is that because it is indeed a "UTILITY" and not a "HEAVY RESCUE?" And whats the hold-up in naming the builder?

    I am beginning to form a picture in my mind here of a re-chassied beverage delivery truck that was modified to have a command box and an 8-bottle cascade on it. There is certainly nothing wrong with this, it works for many, has been proven multiple times over (as long as it is not overweight!) .....But when you play word games and say that "Our HEAVY RESCUE came in under $300K equipped" makes me want to drop the bull$hit flag.
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    Last edited by FWDbuff; 06-04-2009 at 07:23 AM.
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  17. #37
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    Localized thinking.What you posted a picture of AGAIN won't work on the islands.Since you won't ,if you're REAL nice, mebbee Sam will get you some photos.Of the RIG AND the Island roads.A Cushman Golf cart hardly fits there,hehe T.C

  18. #38
    Forum Member FWDbuff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rescue101 View Post
    Localized thinking.What you posted a picture of AGAIN won't work on the islands.Since you won't ,if you're REAL nice, mebbee Sam will get you some photos.Of the RIG AND the Island roads.A Cushman Golf cart hardly fits there,hehe T.C
    The soda truck above TC??? How will that not work as opposed to a commerical chassis with a 30 foot box????

    The whole point of this excercise was stated in the last paragraph of my last post- I threw down the bull$hit gauntlet at someone who said their HEAVY RESCUE came in under $300K, equipped.

    Now it appears that the pieces of the puzzle are slowly coming together, as Mr. Island sent me a private message calling it a "Utility." Had he said that in his original posting I.E. "our utility came in equipped under 300K," I would have kept reading. It's not apples and apples here, it's definitely apples and oranges.
    "Loyalty Above all Else. Except Honor."

  19. #39
    Forum Member islandfire03's Avatar
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    You can call it a pumpkin if you want. Up here we call ambulances ,rescue-1 so to avoid confusion with dispatch we called it U-2 in honor of the bosses favorite musical group.
    It is not a recycled beer truck it was purpose built from our design by a custom fabricator. It was built by EVM in freeport.

    Pictures are on the way today to the cheese whizz capital of america.
    The nearest cat scale is 70 miles away so shat out of luck on that.
    You can keep up the flag waving.

  20. #40
    Forum Member Rescue101's Avatar
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    But there's some in Blue Surburbans who will GLADLY weigh you.After all,it IS Trucker SAFETY week(read in fill the coffers week).
    Buff,Apples and qranges;Add a little sushi and you've got a meal. You want your blood pressure meds now? I haven't seen the rig so I'm not gonna be a huge help with that.EVM has built some interesting vehicles over their short life span.My neighbore have a Mack tanker built by them,it's worked well. T.C.

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