Firefighter and Paramedic Cross Training

[mattb012]

For those departments w/ Fire based EMS....

Do any departments out there have a set cross training program for firefighter/paramedics? It's becoming more and more difficult for anybody to be a medic and ride a fire truck at the same time on our department. Just looking for some ideas as to what kind of cross training different departments have. I'm hoping to possibly get an idea of a program put together to propose to our administration and union.

Any input helps, Thanks!

[MemphisE34a]

Initial or ongoing training? All of our paramedics are cross trained and average a near 50-50 time on an ambulance or their assigned fire apparatus. They must meet state requirements for EMS licensure and NFPA FF I and II requirements within the alotted time frames.

What specifically do you want to know?

[trailboss2]

Where I work everyone has to be FFII/EMT-P. We do training for 2 hours at least every Wednsday night. 2 days of EMS training and the other 2 Wedsdays are fire training. We also do various other training and refresher classes like trench, water, and high angle rescue. We do 1 medic refresher class a year and various hazmat refresher classes a year.

[mattb012]

Sorry, I probably should'v been more specific :-)

Everyone on the job is FF/EMT and some go on to be medics. We all get enough on duty training to maintain our various licenses. I was wondering how the medics spend their time out in suppression. Right now, its pretty tough for a medic to spend time on his assigned fire truck. We are basically forced to be on the medic unit until we have over 10 years on. The majority of medics I have talked to would like to spend some time on the fire truck and some time on the med unit.

Memphis, it sounds like you guys already do what I would like to do. You said they are assigned to a fire truck, is anyone actually assigned to the med unit? Is there always one specific med unit each guy goes to, or do they have to run around to fill in vacancies? Is there a specific amount of time you spend on each rig?

I'm sure I've got a lot more questions, just can't think of them this early on a sunday morning!

[BoxAlarm187]

Our medics ride the ambulance 1 out of every three shifts. For example, at my current station, we run an engine and ambulance. There are three BLS providers and three ALS providers assigned to the shift. That way, unless someone takes off, no matter what your certification is, you only ride the ambulance 1/3 of the time.

This isn't unique to my station, it's how our department works, and the guys seem to enjoy it.

[MemphisE34a]

Memphis, it sounds like you guys already do what I would like to do. You said they are assigned to a fire truck, is anyone actually assigned to the med unit? Is there always one specific med unit each guy goes to, or do they have to run around to fill in vacancies? Is there a specific amount of time you spend on each rig?

Are people actually assigned the unit is kinda a loaded question. The answer is both yes and no. I will use my station as an example. My station houses an engine and a unit (ambulance). All the people at my station are assigned to the Engine. No personnel anywhere on the job is assigned to an ambulance, but detailed to it on a day by day basis. So, I have 7 guys assigned to my engine - myself, a driver, 2 firefighters, and 3 paramedic/ff's but I normally only ride with 4 everyday although I have ridden with as many as 6. The driver and myself are on the engine every day, everyone else rotates on various rotations.

Daily staffing normally has an average of over 50 people off a day on vacation plus whatever people are off on sick leave. When I have everyone at work, I will have 2 paramedics in the house that will do a 3 day set of 12/12 on the unit. I will have 1 firefighter in the house and one detailed out. And finally, the FF/EMT's (almost all of our FF's) rotate for a single 24 day on an ambulance. Some of them mutually agree to do 12/12, but for the most part most guys just ride their day and get it over with. That rotation is normally a battalion wide rotation so on average most FF's get stuck on the gut truck about 1 out of every 6-8 work days.

Hope that made a bit of sense.

[mattb012]

Thank you sir, that is exactly what i was looking for. How is it decided which of the 2 ff's and which of the 3 ff/p's ride with you on the engine, or go on your med unit, or get detailed out? is it a rotating thing or based on seniority? Do you always have to have a paramedic on the engine with you? Are there anythings about your system that you think could be done differently or better? Who is in charge of the 2 guys on the med unit? Does the person in charge of the med unit receive an additional pay incentive or do they just receive standard medic specialty pay?
The problem with us is we only have 2 assigned ff's per engine, and it doesnt matter if they are medics or not. Seniority is a HUGE thing on our department. For the most part the mentality of the more senior ff/p's is that "i've done my time, now leave me off of the med unit." Again, thanks so much this is a big help to me!