1. #1
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    Default Front-line vehicles per NFPA

    I have been looking for but am unable to find the recommended years of use a emergency vehicle can have before it is taken out of first-line response per NFPA. If you could help me out I would appreciate it.

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    I don't believe there is an NFPA standard.

    The rating service in LA allows a maximum of 15 years for an engine, and I also believe a truck as well, to still be counted.

    Tankers and service vehicles have no maximum lifespan.

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    Actually, we went through the same thing. There is no such thing. Ask the salesman pushing the BS to provide it. It doesn't exist.

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    Default Yes there is

    Although there is nothing in the main section of NFPA 1901 that deals with the age of front line apparatus there is in the Annex D section. Invest in a copy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tomwnh View Post
    Although there is nothing in the main section of NFPA 1901 that deals with the age of front line apparatus there is in the Annex D section. Invest in a copy.
    so instead of tying to pad you pocket by making another sale why don't you be nice and go ahead a quote that annex

    I've made my views on the NFPA very clear their crooks.... their a board of manufactures making standards that force departments to buy their products.
    ~Big O~

    Tankers have wheels and carry water, Tenders are breaded and served with BBQ sauce

    (if you don't believe me Google it)

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    When a maximum life span is mandatory, there will be alot of fire stations sitting idle with no trucks to respond.

    Some have tried to pursue this, but it is always rolled back when they realize there will be alot of fires that will not be fought.

    Bad Idea.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MoosemanKBB527 View Post
    so instead of tying to pad you pocket by making another sale why don't you be nice and go ahead a quote that annex

    I've made my views on the NFPA very clear their crooks.... their a board of manufactures making standards that force departments to buy their products.

    ugh you've proven yourself as a bit irrational and one whose quick stick your foot in your mouth, this time being no exception.

    A.) NFPA allows people to read the documents free of charge. Granted you have to register, but show me a site that doesn't any more.

    B.) The read only agreement includes a paragraph banning you from saving, reproducing, etc etc etc. simply you are asking someone to break the read only agreement because you are too lazy.

    C.) they're, their, and there are homonyms. please learn the appropriate usage of all three.

    Put in a little effort, NFPA 1901 Annex D has the information you seek and you can view it free of charge.


    While I'm not a fan of the NFPA and their standards, Annex D is very useful for departments trying to seek leverage in convincing city hall to allow them to buy a new truck.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MoosemanKBB527 View Post
    so instead of tying to pad you pocket by making another sale why don't you be nice and go ahead a quote that annex

    I've made my views on the NFPA very clear their crooks.... their a board of manufactures making standards that force departments to buy their products.
    Mooseman, I am not now nor have I ever been associated with NFPA. If anyone purchases a copy of any of their standards, joins or does business with them in any way my pocket does not get lined.

    When I made my post I didn't have time to look the standard up and then retype it here. I also thought by suggesting that he purchase a copy it would help to have the info in black and white when making a case for replacing older equipment.

    To jdstol, you can read the standard for FREE on the NFPA web site. You have to sign up and get a user name to do so but that is FREE also. Here is the link.

    http://www.nfpa.org/index.asp

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    You do get ISO points if all your apparatus (or maybe just pumpers) are less than ten years old.
    "Be polite, be professional, but have a plan to kill everybody you meet.
    --General James Mattis, USMC


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    The very notion that the NFPA can "recommend" the lifespan of a piece of apparatus is just utterly ridiculous. The only factors impacting a rigs ability to perform are the amount of work it does, and how well it's maintained while doing that work. Although it does seem as if even fire apparatus manufacturers have now jumped on the planned obsolesance train too... so it would not be at all suprising if an organization comprised mostly of those manufacturers would try to "encourage" a replacement standard.

    Anyone remember when our rigs and equipment were built to last longer than we did?

    Isn't it something that even with all the latest and greatest "improvements" that are now the "standard", a well maintained "antique" manages to get and keep water flowing as well if not better than the biggest, shiniest new computerized pumper/tanker/rescue/quint coming to an FD near you.

    I have to side with Mooseman here, it seems to me that the NFPA has become a self serving racket bent on sales over function.

    Cogs

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    Lightbulb Life Cycle

    I think there is one large piece of the puzzle some of you old timers are missing in the equation of a vehicle life cycle. A fire truck is not just a fire fighting tool anymore. It is an Emergency Response Vehicle and it's mission has changed at a large number of the departments. That's why many are called Fire - Rescue Departments. Thus the number of annual runs are much higher than say on a rig from 30 years ago. Many departments, including ours, run 80% medical calls with Paramedic engine companies.

    I have seen many fire trucks when I first came on 30 years ago that were 20 years old with less than 60,000 miles on them. Heck we put that much mileage on in 2-1/2 years.
    After five years we have 125,000 miles on the rig. It then goes into reserve for maybe another five years.

    Since the world is changing out there, I don't think it is out of line for NFPA to be recommending that a department be looking seriously at a life cycle replacement program. It's just good commom sense.

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    Quote Originally Posted by donethat View Post
    I think there is one large piece of the puzzle some of you old timers are missing in the equation of a vehicle life cycle. A fire truck is not just a fire fighting tool anymore. It is an Emergency Response Vehicle and it's mission has changed at a large number of the departments. That's why many are called Fire - Rescue Departments. Thus the number of annual runs are much higher than say on a rig from 30 years ago. Many departments, including ours, run 80% medical calls with Paramedic engine companies.

    I have seen many fire trucks when I first came on 30 years ago that were 20 years old with less than 60,000 miles on them. Heck we put that much mileage on in 2-1/2 years.
    After five years we have 125,000 miles on the rig. It then goes into reserve for maybe another five years.

    Since the world is changing out there, I don't think it is out of line for NFPA to be recommending that a department be looking seriously at a life cycle replacement program. It's just good commom sense.
    In the case of a department running as hard as you do vs a department running 500 calls a year there is a major difference in the life span of a engine. NFPA gives "suggestions" to make things safer for us. I agree that somethings they suggest is a little crazy at times, but they are trying to cover eeverything and everyone regardless of size and call volume. We do our best to follow NFPA but fall short because of the money involved in following NFPA. I think each department needs to figure out when to replace trucks and do so as they see fit.

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    Thumbs up Life Cycle Replacement

    rm1524:
    AGREE

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    As a rule of thumb we use 20 years as an expected service life. Many departments use differedt years based on useage.

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    That's the way we look at it 20-25 yrs life but then you gotta think about the number of hours on a busy dept.Of course we are a part paid,volunteer dept that runs about 350 a year.
    It's not that life is so short,it's cause you're dead for so long.

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