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  1. #1

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    Default Overtime rotations

    Just wondering how your department runs their overtime list. This is for voluntary overtime.

    The department I work for pages out to the entire department any available overtime. We run a list. Once you take a 24 hour shift, your name goes to the bottom of the list. If you take a partial shift, your name does not move on the list. This allows a couple of people high on the list to cherry pick all of the partial shifts of OT. We are looking at finding an alternative way to make the OT possibilities more equal to everyone.

    Thanks for your responses in advance.

    -D


  2. #2
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    Real easy ... if you take ANY over time (even if its for a 24 and you are only clocked in for 1 minute) you move to the bottom of the list.

    If you get called and accept but do not end up clocking in it shouldn't be held against you.

    Good luck on changing it as those with the most to lose usually are friends with those who make the rule.

  3. #3
    Forum Member DeputyChiefGonzo's Avatar
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    Our overtime is based on hours.
    Work a tour: you get charged for the number of hours worked.
    Refuse: you get charged the number of hours you would have worked.

    Newly appointed firefighters assume the average high hours , with the exception of those who have specialty jobs within the FD ( public fire education, EVT, arson investigation, etc.)

    Firefighters who get promoted to the officers ranks carry their overtime hours to the next rank.

    Holdovers for incidents, moving personnel around or performing specific task get caheged only of the holdover goes over 4 hours.

    Recalls for incidents are not charged to the overtime hours

    Our OT setup is fair to everyone in all ranks.
    Last edited by CaptainGonzo; 12-03-2009 at 01:21 PM.
    ‎"The education of a firefighter and the continued education of a firefighter is what makes "real" firefighters. Continuous skill development is the core of progressive firefighting. We learn by doing and doing it again and again, both on the training ground and the fireground."
    Lt. Ray McCormack, FDNY

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainGonzo View Post
    Our overtime is based on hours.
    Work a tour: you get charged for the number of hours worked.
    Refuse: you get charged the number of hours you would have worked.

    Newly appointed firefighters assume the average high hours , with the exception of those who have specialty jobs within the FD ( public fire education, EVT, arson investigation, etc.)

    Firefighters who get promoted to the officers ranks carry their overtime hours to the next rank.

    Holdovers for incidents, moving personnel around or performing specific task get caheged only of the holdover goes over 4 hours.

    Recalls for incidents are not charged to the overtime hours

    Our OT setup is fair to everyone in all ranks.
    We do something similar.

    If you pass on overtime you are charged with the hours for the longest shift available.

    If a speciality (hazmat, TRT, paramedic, officer or arff) is need to fill the slot the firefighter with the lowest hours and meets the speciality will fill the slot.

    All OT including holdovers counts on our overtime list.

  5. #5
    Forum Member JayDudley's Avatar
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    Default Overtimes

    For those who work them they keep tract of the amount you work. Those with the least amount of works gets called first and if you decline they move down the list. My routine was to sign up for all days and let the system take care of itself. Nobody worked more overtimes then me...with a few exceptions. With that said that was a few years ago and I'm sure there are plenty to be had.
    Respectfully,
    Jay Dudley
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  6. #6
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    Any place I ever worked that offered overtime to blue collar workers in a Union it went by seniority.

    In Blue collar without a Union, it went by who the boss needed; these were small businesses.

    In white collar it went by the function needed and who had to perform the functions; due to the limited number of personnel available to do the job.

    In my current position it is done by who is available and we get comp time. No OT is ever paid out.

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    Everyone is paged and texted at the same time. Whoever calls in first is the one that gets it.

  8. #8
    Forum Member DeputyChiefGonzo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ScareCrow57 View Post
    Any place I ever worked that offered overtime to blue collar workers in a Union it went by seniority.

    In Blue collar without a Union, it went by who the boss needed; these were small businesses.

    In white collar it went by the function needed and who had to perform the functions; due to the limited number of personnel available to do the job.

    In my current position it is done by who is available and we get comp time. No OT is ever paid out.


    This thread is about FIREFIGHTER OVERTIME... something you know nothing, nil, zilch, zip, zero about.

    There's a murder of crows on the lower 40... go do your job and leave the intelligent conversation with those who know what they are talking about.
    Last edited by CaptainGonzo; 12-03-2009 at 01:54 PM.
    ‎"The education of a firefighter and the continued education of a firefighter is what makes "real" firefighters. Continuous skill development is the core of progressive firefighting. We learn by doing and doing it again and again, both on the training ground and the fireground."
    Lt. Ray McCormack, FDNY

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainGonzo View Post
    This thread is about FIREFIGHTER OVERTIME... something you know nothing, nil, zilch, zip, zero about.

    There's a murder of crows on the lower 40... go do your job and leave the intelligent conversation with those who know what they are talking about.
    I forgot, the rest of the world is all screwed up. What is wrong with giving OT based on seniority. If no one takes it and you are on the bottom of the least you automatically get it without choice. Hundreds of Unions operate this way.

    Now take that chip off you shoulder....

  10. #10
    Forum Member DeputyChiefGonzo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ScareCrow57 View Post
    I forgot, the rest of the world is all screwed up. What is wrong with giving OT based on seniority. If no one takes it and you are on the bottom of the least you automatically get it without choice. Hundreds of Unions operate this way.

    Now take that chip off you shoulder....
    Take that stick out of your @$$ and begone!
    ‎"The education of a firefighter and the continued education of a firefighter is what makes "real" firefighters. Continuous skill development is the core of progressive firefighting. We learn by doing and doing it again and again, both on the training ground and the fireground."
    Lt. Ray McCormack, FDNY

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainGonzo View Post
    Take that stick out of your @$$ and begone!
    Fact is my friend that being a fire fighter is not some unique occupation where everything is unique. Believe it or not, you take many of the concepts and proven methods that work in other industries and apply them to the fire service.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by ScareCrow57 View Post
    What is wrong with giving OT based on seniority.
    1. In large FD's with lots of guys retiring each year, they'd eat up all the OT to boost their retirement. So little to no OT for anyone with over three years to retirement.

    2. Senior guys make more money coasting more in OT making the job look at ways to cut OT even more.

    3. Union's are about making sure all the members are used fairly. If senior guys are needed for the slot (acting up, chauffeurs, etc) then maybe it would work. But in general positions should be filled by rank of qualification using a fair system of "spreading the wealth".

    We use the rotating OT list. You accept or refuse a slot, you move to the bottom. You are unable to be contacted you remain in place. Slots are filled at 12 or less hour increments, so a 24 hr tour opening will result in two members getting 12 hr slots. OT is scheduled as it is needed. A 3 hrs slot for two weeks away gets scheduled and 10 minutes later a 12 hr slot for tomorrow opens up, oh well, it'll all come out in the wash. Any duty officers position is offered to the A/C's first (who are not on the Union list) and then Lt's.

  13. #13
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    Rotation basis:
    Less than 6 hours card of person working OT does not get moved
    Called in order:
    If you refuse goes to the back unless:
    2 days either side of Kelly day
    2 Days either side of annual leave
    Excused sick leave
    Taking an approved class
    If you accept your card goes to the back.
    If no contact is made you do not get moved.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainGonzo View Post
    Our overtime is based on hours.
    Work a tour: you get charged for the number of hours worked.
    Refuse: you get charged the number of hours you would have worked.

    Newly appointed firefighters assume the average high hours , with the exception of those who have specialty jobs within the FD ( public fire education, EVT, arson investigation, etc.)

    Firefighters who get promoted to the officers ranks carry their overtime hours to the next rank.

    Holdovers for incidents, moving personnel around or performing specific task get caheged only of the holdover goes over 4 hours.

    Recalls for incidents are not charged to the overtime hours

    Our OT setup is fair to everyone in all ranks.

    We must of taken a page out of your SOG's. We are about 99% the same.
    This space for rent

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by ScareCrow57 View Post
    Fact is my friend that being a fire fighter is not some unique occupation where everything is unique. Believe it or not, you take many of the concepts and proven methods that work in other industries and apply them to the fire service.
    What color is the sky in your world?

  16. #16
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    Cool How It Works for Us.....

    How our O.T. works is like this; When O.T. comes up it's offered to the most Senior person with the lease amount of hrs. for that position (rank for rank). If nobody accepts it for Engineer and Captain then it goes to the "Upgrade List" and is offered to the person on that list with the least amount of Upgrade Hrs.

    If nobody accepts the Upgrade (it doesn't really happen) then it goes to a "force." Our forces are done by the Least Senior with the least amount of forces.

    Late callouts are usually handled by the Guys on the Floor and covered as either an Upgrade or a Force depending on the hrs. Anything over 4 hrs. is considered a "force."

    Strike Team Coverage is covered the same as O.T. Relief Team Coverage (7 days in County, and 14 outta County) is usually covered by the Crews that would normallly be assigned to that Unit. Example: E-1 is assigned to a Type 1 S.T. The Crew coming-in for the Relief Day will be called and offered the coverage. If anybody from that Crew doesn't want to go then it's covered by the O.T. Roster.

    Dunno if this is the best way but it's how we do it and it works well for us.....
    "Be LOUD, Be PROUD..... It just might save your can someday when goin' through an intersection!!!!!"

    Life on the Truck (Quint) is good.....

    Eat til you're sleepy..... Sleep til you're hungry..... And repeat.....

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikeyboy View Post
    How our O.T. works is like this; When O.T. comes up it's offered to the most Senior person with the lease amount of hrs. for that position (rank for rank). If nobody accepts it for Engineer and Captain then it goes to the "Upgrade List" and is offered to the person on that list with the least amount of Upgrade Hrs.

    If nobody accepts the Upgrade (it doesn't really happen) then it goes to a "force." Our forces are done by the Least Senior with the least amount of forces.

    Late callouts are usually handled by the Guys on the Floor and covered as either an Upgrade or a Force depending on the hrs. Anything over 4 hrs. is considered a "force."

    Strike Team Coverage is covered the same as O.T. Relief Team Coverage (7 days in County, and 14 outta County) is usually covered by the Crews that would normallly be assigned to that Unit. Example: E-1 is assigned to a Type 1 S.T. The Crew coming-in for the Relief Day will be called and offered the coverage. If anybody from that Crew doesn't want to go then it's covered by the O.T. Roster.

    Dunno if this is the best way but it's how we do it and it works well for us.....
    Do you guys use Telstaff?
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  18. #18
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    Cool Our Program.....

    Nope, we use another Program but my previous Dept. did and it worked well for them.
    "Be LOUD, Be PROUD..... It just might save your can someday when goin' through an intersection!!!!!"

    Life on the Truck (Quint) is good.....

    Eat til you're sleepy..... Sleep til you're hungry..... And repeat.....

  19. #19
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    For voluntary overtime we go by seniority we start at the top of list and work our way to bottom. First to take it gets it. If no one takes it then goes to the person that's up for OT. if they work full shift they count it and the OT moves to next person in line. If they work less than full shift they can keep the OT on them until they work a full shift.
    Last edited by TAFD00367; 12-04-2009 at 01:55 PM.

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