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  1. #1
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    Default The Over-Achievers Club

    So, how many people have already signed and submitted their 1199?

    << we did today

    What can I do to prepare for the potential award? Should be start getting bids? So far we just have 1 price quote (they have agreed to come down to our $123,500 that we were reduced to). It is a 2009 4WD type III.


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    Quote Originally Posted by medstudent13 View Post
    So, how many people have already signed and submitted their 1199?

    << we did today

    What can I do to prepare for the potential award? Should be start getting bids? So far we just have 1 price quote (they have agreed to come down to our $123,500 that we were reduced to). It is a 2009 4WD type III.
    According to the guidance document, The bids you receive prior to the award date are not acceptable. My advice is to do what I have our committee doing. I have them discussing the wants and needs, have the list of options, and have it all typed up, ready to submit for bids. If you already have a bid, I would inform this dealer that he/she will need to resubmit it with an acceptable date that is after the award. Be sure to follow the procurement policy. Never hurts to have four or five bids to justify your purchase. By the way MED, Congratulations once again!! We told you the patience would pay off. Merry Christmas.

    Kelly

  3. #3
    Forum Member islandfire03's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by medstudent13 View Post
    So, how many people have already signed and submitted their 1199?

    << we did today

    What can I do to prepare for the potential award? Should be start getting bids? So far we just have 1 price quote (they have agreed to come down to our $123,500 that we were reduced to). It is a 2009 4WD type III.
    Medstudent: While I can understand your joy at getting the 1199 notice,
    The first thing I would do is to take a deep breath and relax. You DO NOT have an award yet!
    You have made it to the first step of the process that may or may not get you funded.

    You can begin by getting your specs together and writing an RFP ,so that when /if you are notified of being awarded you will be ready to go out to bid. You need to follow the AFG's requirements for an open bidding process, meaning you can't just buy what you want from your friendly vendor. You need to follow your local laws regarding open bidding . Bids dated before the date of the award are not valid.

    Just trying to bring you back to reality. Read the AFG rules while you are waiting.
    Until you have the award letter in your hands ,don't count your chickens.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by islandfire03 View Post
    Medstudent: While I can understand your joy at getting the 1199 notice,
    The first thing I would do is to take a deep breath and relax. You DO NOT have an award yet!
    You have made it to the first step of the process that may or may not get you funded.

    You can begin by getting your specs together and writing an RFP ,so that when /if you are notified of being awarded you will be ready to go out to bid. You need to follow the AFG's requirements for an open bidding process, meaning you can't just buy what you want from your friendly vendor. You need to follow your local laws regarding open bidding . Bids dated before the date of the award are not valid.

    Just trying to bring you back to reality. Read the AFG rules while you are waiting.
    Until you have the award letter in your hands ,don't count your chickens.
    As I said, I know this is a "potential award" but we want this to move quickly if we are awarded. We spent almost a month out of service last year due to mechanical failure. And, we are the only EMS service for nearly 20 miles. So, this is quite urgent.

    But, thank you for informing me that the actual bids need to be dated after the award. I looked at the grant management tutorial for more info, but it was talking about submitting payment requests etc. Is the info I'm looking for in the tutorial or the PG?

  5. #5
    MembersZone Subscriber ktb9780's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by medstudent13 View Post
    As I said, I know this is a "potential award" but we want this to move quickly if we are awarded. We spent almost a month out of service last year due to mechanical failure. And, we are the only EMS service for nearly 20 miles. So, this is quite urgent.

    But, thank you for informing me that the actual bids need to be dated after the award. I looked at the grant management tutorial for more info, but it was talking about submitting payment requests etc. Is the info I'm looking for in the tutorial or the PG?
    medstudent, listen to what they are telling you. This is years of experience and many, many awards from under their belts advising you.. The award package says you will follow your local procurement policy and. in the absence of a formalized procurment policy, you will follow AGF guidelines which state you must obtain, at minimum, 2 quotes.
    Kurt Bradley
    Public Safety Grants Consultant

    "Never Trade Skill for Luck"

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    Can't agree more with what the others are saying. The last two years we prepped our application by getting at least two quotes for everything we were requesting, and then averaging them to get the $$$ amount for our request. In BOTH cases, because of meticulous spec writing, and beating the bushes to get MULTIPLE bids from vendors, we had $7,000 + in unexpended funds left in the end, and were able to spend $5000 "extending" the initial purpose of the grant, amd the remaining on an approved fire prevention program.

    So start working on a good performance specification (NOT a product/manufacturer specific spec) and start putting together a list of five + qualified bidders. It doesn't cost you ANY more money to get six bids than it does three, but you will force the bidders to be more competitive if they know that they are up against other responsible bidders. I even send reminders to the qualified bidders reminding them of bid close dates, which has the names of the other recipients in the "TO" field. This way they KNOW who they are up against, and bid more competitively! And if one of them claims "regional distributer" status, and claims that they are the only one that can a product (Scott & Hurst have both tried this with us in the past), throw the BULLSH!+ FLAG, and tell them that you will write a spec that MSA & Survivair (or Holmotra & Lucas) can easily bid. They will come around and bid competitively.....
    "If everyone is thinking alike, then somebody isn't thinking."

    George S. Patton

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    Excellent point there by DFD, the specs cannot be specific toward one manufacturer as that would not allow a competitive process.

    When we were bidding our mini pumper, we had to have documentation on hand for the audit where we had ran request for bids in the local papers. We had to include this item in our closeout. Not an AFG requirement, but it was for another federal grant.

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    Thank you all for the advice. You are all much more knowledgeable about this than me, and I'm sure you are all part of the reason why our application made it so far. I sneaked around on here a lot while I was writing the narrative and got some really good tips.

    I'm slowly trying to understand and piece together all of the comments (some of the lingo kind of goes over my head on here though). So, I'm going to watch the entire tutorial and re-read the PG so I don't have to ask so many stupid questions (that is after I take about a week off..just finished my last final exam. Time to RELAX!!).

    So, I won't be posting for a while (that is, unless I get denied or awarded..then I'll let you know).

    Once again, thank you for all the help. This is an excellent resource and I'm surprised by how willing people are to share advice. Hopefully, we'll get an award and I'll have some advice to share next year. If any one is interested in seeing my narrative, let me know. I'm more than willing to share it. You can see my rejected one or the pending one this year (last year's will give you a good laugh...i had no clue what I was doing). Peer reviewers said my narrative was lacking in all 4 components..oops! Anyways, good luck to all of those still waiting for 1199s. I'll keep all the companies in my prayers that your communities get what they need.

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    Like has been said, make sure to slow down and take enough time to do it right. You don't want to jump into this thing and end up screwing the pooch because you didnt' follow procedures. You also don't want to jump into something trying to replace the truck and get something that's going to be junk in a couple of years.

    We're a small department that's purchased only two new apparatus, both coming from grants, so we went in unexperienced. What we did, and what seemed to work for us, was to start with a committee of members to make a list of items we wanted to see on those apparatus. We then prioritized those items.

    When we went to get bid specs, we established what we felt we had to have and what we would like, but could live without. When we sent the specs, they weren't what you see from a lot of larger departments where they had every minute detail, rather a basic description (what kind of chassis, type/size of engine, body style, pump requirements, etc). The items we wanted, but could live without, were listed out as options. From there we could choose the manufacturer based on that information.

    On both trucks we had to debate on what options were higher priorities and which had to be cut. In both cases we've had things we might do different if we were doing the same thing again today, but in both cases we have a truck we are proud of and is more than functional for how we operate.

    Without knowing how long you've been working EMS, resist the urge to think an ambulance is an ambulance. I worked a number of years on different ambulances and I can tell you there's a lot of differences when you really get to looking at them. Get literature from as many manufacturers as you're willing to look at. Get demo rigs down to look at. Figure out what layouts and options you like, what chassis set-ups you like, etc. Also, plan for the future. If you're a BLS agency that might become ALS in the future, plan accordingly (equipment storage, narc lock boxes, charging outlets for monitors and such). If you're looking at getting different or adding equipment in the future, plan accordingly (I know an ambulance that bought two new rigs and didn't plan on the AutoPulse units they bought a few months later and KNEW they were buying. They're stored behind the rear-facing jumpseat and keep falling).

    Bottom line, make sure you're going to get a rig that you're going to be able to use for years to come and that's going to last that duration. Take your time and do it right the first time.

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    Thumbs up First and Last

    I have learned one thing about purchases with grant funds. I'm not doing anything without checking here. First and last. Period. I think there is more experience here than anywhere else in my county and I want/need/demand that reassurance for myself.

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    I need to double check the bank info with the secretary in the morning and I'm ready to submit!

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    Has anyone ever dealt with SCBA's were you are not replacing the SCBA but just adding additional SCBA's with the grant funds. How do you get bids so that you don't end up with say 1/2 Scott and 1/2 another brand? Or are you just SOL and stuck with running your trucks with two different types of SCBA's?

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    Quote Originally Posted by FFMVFD View Post
    Has anyone ever dealt with SCBA's were you are not replacing the SCBA but just adding additional SCBA's with the grant funds. How do you get bids so that you don't end up with say 1/2 Scott and 1/2 another brand? Or are you just SOL and stuck with running your trucks with two different types of SCBA's?
    You do NOT have to take the lowest bid that is offered. You DO have to get multiple bids. There are many reasons why a FD wouldn't take the lowest bid. For example, you may take a higher bid because the company who services your equipment is 5 miles from you, while the lower bid is 500.... another valid reason for not taking the lowest bid is for consistency in your SCBA, like you mentioned. You do need to justify it when you are audited, but that is a valid justification.

    What I've done in similar situations is get more than 1 Scott dealer to offer a bid, along with the others.....

  14. #14
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    Thumbs up similar situation with our 2008 AFG

    Quote Originally Posted by FFMVFD View Post
    Has anyone ever dealt with SCBA's were you are not replacing the SCBA but just adding additional SCBA's with the grant funds. How do you get bids so that you don't end up with say 1/2 Scott and 1/2 another brand? Or are you just SOL and stuck with running your trucks with two different types of SCBA's?
    We had a similar situation this year. We had 2 stations with Nederman exhaust systems. We were awarded a grant for the other 3 stations. Check with your municipality's purchasing policy. There should be something like that in there. Then request the purchase through your city council approve it. You really need to follow your own purchasing policy.

    Here is what our policy says regarding single source purchase:

    c) The procurement is for a product that is a part of a system in which selection of an alternative brand would alter the ability of the using department to operate and/or maintain the system. Examples of this type of single source are the self contained breathing apparatus used by the Fire Department, electrical equipment, pumps, fittings and meters used by the Water & Sewer Department, safety equipment and firearms used by the Police Department, and computer and phone system equipment.

    John Lyman, Waterford Fire Department, MI
    email: jlyman@twp.waterford.mi.us
    Last edited by jhl81791123; 12-19-2009 at 12:53 PM. Reason: addition of text

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    We advertise for the bidding with a generic bid notice, i.e. "FD XYZ accepting bids on 24 SCBAs", nothing specific. Once we are contacted for information on the bidding we document who is requesting to bid, and then send the RFP. The RFP contains all of the mandatory specs we have plus an additional statement saying if brands cannot be met then please bid with equivalent brand or better. Some people go ahead and bid and others just forget about it. Either way we get the bidding covered. As for the RFP we have used the same contract for several years which states that our FD is not required to accept the lowest or any bid and has the right to reject any or all of the bids without notice. Its worked out so far.

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    Default I'm back!

    Hi all,
    Could someone post an example of an "Invitation to Bid" for a vehicle? I know we don't have the award yet, but I have 2 weeks off from school. I would like to get something ready to go, while I'm home and can talk to people in our department. Thanks a bunch!

  17. #17
    Forum Member islandfire03's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by medstudent13 View Post
    Hi all,
    Could someone post an example of an "Invitation to Bid" for a vehicle? I know we don't have the award yet, but I have 2 weeks off from school. I would like to get something ready to go, while I'm home and can talk to people in our department. Thanks a bunch!
    I'll send you a copy of our RFP later tonight if you send me a PM with your e-mail address.
    It is for a 2009 type III ALS ambulance.
    Last edited by islandfire03; 12-22-2009 at 02:17 PM. Reason: added additional sentence

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    Quote Originally Posted by islandfire03 View Post
    I'll send you a copy of our RFP later tonight if you send me a PM with your e-mail address.
    It is for a 2009 type III ALS ambulance.
    That would be great! We applied for a type III ambulance too. I sent you a PM.

  19. #19
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    island any chance i can get a copy too?
    thx mm

  20. #20
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    Has anybody who faxed thier 1199A to AFG heard back from them confirming thay have received it? I know they were out yesterday but I haven't gotten anything back yet.

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