1. #551
    MembersZone Subscriber
    tajm611's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    2,071
    ‎"I was always taught..." Four words impacting fire service education in the most negative of ways. -Bill Carey

  2. #552
    Forum Member
    DeputyChiefGonzo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2000
    Location
    Somewhere between genius and insanity!
    Posts
    13,586

    Default

    Fracking "A"... that is a balls on accurate assessment!
    ‎"The education of a firefighter and the continued education of a firefighter is what makes "real" firefighters. Continuous skill development is the core of progressive firefighting. We learn by doing and doing it again and again, both on the training ground and the fireground."
    Lt. Ray McCormack, FDNY

  3. #553
    Truckie
    SPFDRum's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 1999
    Location
    St Paul, MN
    Posts
    2,516

    Default

    Oh my....that type of common sense blog will NOT get him invited to the "Safety Sally" holiday party.
    My posts reflect my views and opinions, not the organization I work for or my IAFF local. Some of which they may not agree. I.A.C.O.J. member
    "I ask, Sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people. To disarm the people is the best and most effectual way to enslave them."
    George Mason
    Co-author of the Second Amendment
    during Virginia's Convention to Ratify the Constitution, 1788
    Elevator Rescue Information

  4. #554
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    Bossier Parrish, Louisiana
    Posts
    10,677

    Default

    I agree with him, to a limted extent, in thoery.

    Yes, we need to be trained. Not once have I said that we should not be. What I have said is that we need to be trained to the level of firefighting the department wishes to perform. We need to be trained to conduct the operations our departments perform. And we need to be fully trained in operations that are relevant to buildings in hazards in the district utilizing ther equipment and apparatus the department operates.

    So yes, that means a very small department with a limited structurak stock ansd limited amount of equipemnt needs to be trained to that level. meaning if they never come within 2o miles of a hydrant, and there are many departments like that, they don't need hydrant ops. If they don;'t own a K12 gueess what .....

    Most of you disagree with me on that but the reality is that the vasy majority of the firefighters in this counrty are volunteers with a limited amount of time. And you all know where I'm headed with that ....

    As far as fitness, it would be wonderful if ecery FF in this country was a speciman.

    The fact is his post is unrealistic.

    I won't even discuss his macho "we're fireman" tone ......

  5. #555
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    Bossier Parrish, Louisiana
    Posts
    10,677

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by SPFDRum View Post
    Oh my....that type of common sense blog will NOT get him invited to the "Safety Sally" holiday party.
    I've been to the Safet Sallie Holiday party. It's not much fun.

    No dancing ... You might slip and fall.

    No appetizers on a toothpick ... Ya might take out an eye.

    No c o c ktail wennies or melon balls ... That's just a chocking incident waiting to happen.

    No loud bands .... May rupture an eardrum.

    And above all .... No smoothbores as we all know they suck (Back at ya FWD)
    Last edited by LaFireEducator; 01-05-2011 at 04:39 PM.

  6. #556
    Forum Member
    FWDbuff's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Location
    Pee-Ayy!
    Posts
    7,430

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    And above all .... No smoothbores as we all know they suck (Back at ya FWD)
    You wouldnt know a real nozzle if someone shoved it up your a s s and used it as an enigma.
    "Loyalty Above all Else. Except Honor."

  7. #557
    MembersZone Subscriber
    tajm611's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    2,071

    Default

    enigma=/= enema.
    ‎"I was always taught..." Four words impacting fire service education in the most negative of ways. -Bill Carey

  8. #558
    Forum Member
    pasobuff's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Loverly upstate NY
    Posts
    1,734

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ThNozzleman View Post
    I'm just worried to death about it.
    I'll be in his neck of the woods Sunday if you are that concerned.....

  9. #559
    Forum Member
    DeputyChiefGonzo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2000
    Location
    Somewhere between genius and insanity!
    Posts
    13,586

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    I agree with him, to a limted extent, in thoery.

    Yes, we need to be trained. Not once have I said that we should not be. What I have said is that we need to be trained to the level of firefighting the department wishes to perform.
    This only works if you can insure that a fire will conform to your level of training...

    We need to be trained to conduct the operations our departments perform. And we need to be fully trained in operations that are relevant to buildings in hazards in the district utilizing ther equipment and apparatus the department operates.
    A fire department needs to be trained to perform... period. You have to be able to anticipate what you can expect.. you cannot say "@#$! it, we're going back to quarters. You may not have a structure with more than 3 floors, but I'm sure that the refinery in your area of protection has a cracking tower.. which is a hell of a lot higher than 30 feet , using the 10 feet per floor rule of thumb.

    So yes, that means a very small department with a limited structurak stock ansd limited amount of equipemnt needs to be trained to that level. meaning if they never come within 2o miles of a hydrant, and there are many departments like that, they don't need hydrant ops. If they don;'t own a K12 gueess what ....
    .

    If you want us to believe that these poor rural brothers don't know how to use a chain saw or a rotary saw... it isn't going to happen.

    Axes don't need fuel, blades or oil. They always start.. they may take a litle longer, but they work. City jakes may never draft, yet they learn drafting and relay pumping.. and it doesn't take a rocket scientist or brain surgeon to figure out how to hook up to an open a hydrant...

    Most of you disagree with me on that but the reality is that the vasy majority of the firefighters in this counrty are volunteers with a limited amount of time. And you all know where I'm headed with that ....
    It's amazing what a firefighter can learn in an hour or two of time at a drill. It doesn't have to be fancy stuff.. just the basics.

    You are making up **** poor excuses again... but then, you are really good at it.

    As far as fitness, it would be wonderful if ecery FF in this country was a speciman.

    The fact is his post is unrealistic.

    I won't even discuss his macho "we're fireman" tone ......
    Actually.. everyone is a specimen.. the minute you put the gear on.. you are a specimen. I know some big guys who run rings around the kids, I know some big guys who huff and puff just hearing the tones. I know physically fit guys that still manage to get banged up at fires (most of them have the nick name "boo-boo" ) and guys that go an entire career without as much as a scratch. Once again... you are wrong. At least you're consistent.
    Last edited by DeputyChiefGonzo; 01-05-2011 at 06:24 PM.
    ‎"The education of a firefighter and the continued education of a firefighter is what makes "real" firefighters. Continuous skill development is the core of progressive firefighting. We learn by doing and doing it again and again, both on the training ground and the fireground."
    Lt. Ray McCormack, FDNY

  10. #560
    MembersZone Subscriber
    BULL321's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Western, NC
    Posts
    3,432

    Default

    Hell, even this guy makes LA look like a wussy, and he is a fracking politician.

    Mass. Lt. Gov. Pulls Kids From Burning Minivan
    The Associated Press

    Posted: Wed, 01/05/2011 - 10:42am
    Updated: Wed, 01/05/2011 - 10:47am
    Embedded Video:

    WORCESTER, Mass. --

    This wasn't part of the job description when Timothy Murray was voted lieutenant governor of Massachusetts.

    Murray is being hailed for pulling two children out of a burning minivan in Worcester, about 40 miles west of Boston.

    Murray was driving through his hometown at about 7 p.m. on Tuesday when he noticed smoke and flames coming from a parked minivan's tire.

    He stopped and called 911, then heard someone yell that there were children inside. Murray helped the children out of the van, and brought them to their grandmother, who had been driving. He tells The Telegram & Gazette she told him she was worried that he was trying to steal the car or the kids and was "about to punch him."

    Firefighters arrived seconds later to put out the fire, which they called minor.

    Copyright 2008 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.
    Stay Safe
    Bull


    “Guys if you get hurt, we’ll help you. If you get sick we’ll treat you. If you want to bitch and moan, then all I can tell you is to flick the sand out of your slit, suck it up or get the hell out!”
    - Capt. Marc Cox CFD

    Nothing in life is so exhilarating as to be shot at without result.
    -WINSTON CHURCHILL

  11. #561
    Forum Member
    ThNozzleman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    Jefferson City, TN
    Posts
    4,339

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    I won't even discuss his macho "we're fireman" tone ......
    Good idea.

  12. #562
    Forum Member
    FyredUp's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 1999
    Location
    Rural Wisconsin, Retired from the burbs of Milwaukee
    Posts
    10,298

    Default

    This is beautiful and truer words were never spoken. TESTIFY BROTHER! TESTIFY!

    I am seriously considering adding this to my Power Point presentation for FFI.

    Thanks for posting this link.
    Crazy, but that's how it goes
    Millions of people living as foes
    Maybe it's not too late
    To learn how to love, and forget how to hate

  13. #563
    Forum Member
    Rescue101's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    Bridgton,Me USA
    Posts
    8,162

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by FWDbuff View Post
    You wouldnt know a real nozzle if someone shoved it up your a s s and used it as an enigma.
    Enema. He IS an enigma,T.C.

  14. #564
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    VT
    Posts
    360

    Default

    HEY!!! let's get back off-topic!

    RED or yellow??

  15. #565
    MembersZone Subscriber
    tajm611's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    2,071

    Default

    he see's red when some one whose belly isn't yellow does their job?
    is that good?
    ‎"I was always taught..." Four words impacting fire service education in the most negative of ways. -Bill Carey

  16. #566
    Forum Member
    FyredUp's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 1999
    Location
    Rural Wisconsin, Retired from the burbs of Milwaukee
    Posts
    10,298

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    I agree with him, to a limted extent, in thoery.

    Yes, we need to be trained. Not once have I said that we should not be. What I have said is that we need to be trained to the level of firefighting the department wishes to perform. We need to be trained to conduct the operations our departments perform. And we need to be fully trained in operations that are relevant to buildings in hazards in the district utilizing ther equipment and apparatus the department operates.

    So yes, that means a very small department with a limited structurak stock ansd limited amount of equipemnt needs to be trained to that level. meaning if they never come within 2o miles of a hydrant, and there are many departments like that, they don't need hydrant ops. If they don;'t own a K12 gueess what .....

    Most of you disagree with me on that but the reality is that the vasy majority of the firefighters in this counrty are volunteers with a limited amount of time. And you all know where I'm headed with that ....

    As far as fitness, it would be wonderful if ecery FF in this country was a speciman.

    The fact is his post is unrealistic.

    I won't even discuss his macho "we're fireman" tone ......
    Here is where we disagree. Basic fire ops such as: fire attack, search and rescue, water movement, ladders, ventilation, and forcible entry should ALWAYS be taught as part of a "Recruit" training program.

    The first fire department I was on was a small rural fire department that ran a 1950 500 gpm front mount pumper, a 1937 500 gpm mid mount pumper, and a 1949 2000 gallon tanker that was a converted fuel truck. Can you say your VFD has worse than that for apparatus? We had 4 SCBA, rubber coats, pull up boots, and MSA meltaway helmets. Guess what? We did interior fire attack and search and rescue. Perhaps not pushing as deep as we do today with much better PPE and SCBA. We worked over time, a little at a time to improve PPE, SCBA, equipment and apparatus. But we didn't allow ourselves to be handicapped and forego basic fireground ops because we were small and had less than stellar equipment.

    Of course the vast amount of firefighters in this country are volunteers. The difference between you and me is you see that as an excuse for substandard fire protection in some areas and I don't. If you are claiming to be a firefighter be a well trained firefighter no matter what level your FD is at. There is no excuse for being substandard in your personal skills as a firefighter other than laziness or apathy.

    Physical fitness is an interesting topic and another one of those things that seems to be tossed around and around. Volunteers say you can't control my life and career guys go the Union. My feel is we owe it to the citizens we protect to be in at least good enough physical condition to do the job. Whether career or volly being in fairly good shape also help guarantee your own survival. Seems prudent to me.

    His post is totally realistic for firefighters who want to do the job and unrealistic for those who prefer excuses over performance.

    You may not like the macho "we're firemen" tone but it is true. We are expected to go in and save people, we are expected to save people's property. People don't call us because things are going good. They call us to get them out of whatever mess they find themselves in. Being macho doesn't mean being suicidal, stupid, reckless, unskilled, or untrained. It means doing what has to be done, when it can be done. We all recognize there will be times we simply can't or shouldn't enter a burning building. The difference is merely the degree of when we can or should enter. Your standard is much stricter than mine. Yet after 33 years I am still here and relatively unscathed. Tell me how that can be...An aggressive firefighter, with 33 years of experience and relatively few minor injuries. In your world that should be impossible.
    Crazy, but that's how it goes
    Millions of people living as foes
    Maybe it's not too late
    To learn how to love, and forget how to hate

  17. #567
    MembersZone Subscriber
    tajm611's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    2,071

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by FyredUp View Post
    Tell me how that can be...An aggressive firefighter, with 33 years of experience and relatively few minor injuries. In your world that should be impossible.
    He's never seen a firefighter when he looks in the mirror, so to him, it could never happen or exist.
    ‎"I was always taught..." Four words impacting fire service education in the most negative of ways. -Bill Carey

  18. #568
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    Bossier Parrish, Louisiana
    Posts
    10,677

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by FyredUp View Post
    Here is where we disagree. Basic fire ops such as: fire attack, search and rescue, water movement, ladders, ventilation, and forcible entry should ALWAYS be taught as part of a "Recruit" training program.

    The first fire department I was on was a small rural fire department that ran a 1950 500 gpm front mount pumper, a 1937 500 gpm mid mount pumper, and a 1949 2000 gallon tanker that was a converted fuel truck. Can you say your VFD has worse than that for apparatus? We had 4 SCBA, rubber coats, pull up boots, and MSA meltaway helmets. Guess what? We did interior fire attack and search and rescue. Perhaps not pushing as deep as we do today with much better PPE and SCBA. We worked over time, a little at a time to improve PPE, SCBA, equipment and apparatus. But we didn't allow ourselves to be handicapped and forego basic fireground ops because we were small and had less than stellar equipment.

    Of course the vast amount of firefighters in this country are volunteers. The difference between you and me is you see that as an excuse for substandard fire protection in some areas and I don't. If you are claiming to be a firefighter be a well trained firefighter no matter what level your FD is at. There is no excuse for being substandard in your personal skills as a firefighter other than laziness or apathy.

    Physical fitness is an interesting topic and another one of those things that seems to be tossed around and around. Volunteers say you can't control my life and career guys go the Union. My feel is we owe it to the citizens we protect to be in at least good enough physical condition to do the job. Whether career or volly being in fairly good shape also help guarantee your own survival. Seems prudent to me.

    His post is totally realistic for firefighters who want to do the job and unrealistic for those who prefer excuses over performance.

    You may not like the macho "we're firemen" tone but it is true. We are expected to go in and save people, we are expected to save people's property. People don't call us because things are going good. They call us to get them out of whatever mess they find themselves in. Being macho doesn't mean being suicidal, stupid, reckless, unskilled, or untrained. It means doing what has to be done, when it can be done. We all recognize there will be times we simply can't or shouldn't enter a burning building. The difference is merely the degree of when we can or should enter. Your standard is much stricter than mine. Yet after 33 years I am still here and relatively unscathed. Tell me how that can be...An aggressive firefighter, with 33 years of experience and relatively few minor injuries. In your world that should be impossible.
    You view the job in your way, I view it in mine.

  19. #569
    Forum Member
    scfire86's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    HB
    Posts
    10,330

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    You view the job in your way, I view it in mine.
    Your view is only held by you. The rest of us viewed the job as a firefighter, not a fire spectator.
    Politics is like driving. To go forward select "D", to go backward select "R."

  20. #570
    Forum Member
    ThNozzleman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    Jefferson City, TN
    Posts
    4,339

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by BULL321 View Post
    Hell, even this guy makes LA look like a wussy, and he is a fracking politician.

    Mass. Lt. Gov. Pulls Kids From Burning Minivan
    The Associated Press

    Posted: Wed, 01/05/2011 - 10:42am
    Updated: Wed, 01/05/2011 - 10:47am
    Embedded Video:

    WORCESTER, Mass. --

    This wasn't part of the job description when Timothy Murray was voted lieutenant governor of Massachusetts.

    Murray is being hailed for pulling two children out of a burning minivan in Worcester, about 40 miles west of Boston.

    Murray was driving through his hometown at about 7 p.m. on Tuesday when he noticed smoke and flames coming from a parked minivan's tire.

    He stopped and called 911, then heard someone yell that there were children inside. Murray helped the children out of the van, and brought them to their grandmother, who had been driving. He tells The Telegram & Gazette she told him she was worried that he was trying to steal the car or the kids and was "about to punch him."

    Firefighters arrived seconds later to put out the fire, which they called minor.

    Copyright 2008 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.
    Good grief! Even a democratic politician in a suit from (gasp!) Massachusetts can get the job done! I hope he didn't get a booboo in the process!

  21. #571
    MembersZone Subscriber

    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Posts
    394

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by FyredUp View Post
    Here is where we disagree. Basic fire ops such as: fire attack, search and rescue, water movement, ladders, ventilation, and forcible entry should ALWAYS be taught as part of a "Recruit" training program.
    And it shouldn't end just at the recruit training program! A lot of training relies on the basics and yet that is what most people forget and don't want to train on.

  22. #572
    MembersZone Subscriber
    BULL321's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Western, NC
    Posts
    3,432

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ThNozzleman View Post
    Good grief! Even a democratic politician in a suit from (gasp!) Massachusetts can get the job done! I hope he didn't get a booboo in the process!

    I guess Real men no matter what their job, are willing to risk a lot to save others, without any thought to their own safety. Its just sad that the yard breathing safety sallies, who are suppose to be "Masters of their craft" are unwilling or just unable to do the same and they call themselves FF. The day I will let a politician show me up will be a cold day in hell.
    Stay Safe
    Bull


    “Guys if you get hurt, we’ll help you. If you get sick we’ll treat you. If you want to bitch and moan, then all I can tell you is to flick the sand out of your slit, suck it up or get the hell out!”
    - Capt. Marc Cox CFD

    Nothing in life is so exhilarating as to be shot at without result.
    -WINSTON CHURCHILL

  23. #573
    Forum Member
    snowball's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2000
    Location
    Just North of South Central
    Posts
    2,740

    Default

    I run around in circles waving my arms frantically and screaming like a girl, if that is my assignment for the tour.
    IAFF

  24. #574
    MembersZone Subscriber
    tajm611's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    2,071

    Default

    i check my firehouse forum in every fire.
    thats a fully involved abandoned structure.
    ‎"I was always taught..." Four words impacting fire service education in the most negative of ways. -Bill Carey

  25. #575
    Forum Member
    FiremanLyman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    948

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by snowball View Post
    I run around in circles waving my arms frantically and screaming like a girl, if that is my assignment for the tour.
    Strange. Were you watching me today?
    ~Drew
    Firefighter/EMT/Technical Rescue
    USAR TF Rescue Specialist

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. SOP's for Volunteer FD
    By rumlfire in forum Volunteer Forum
    Replies: 14
    Last Post: 08-01-2006, 11:35 PM
  2. AFFF or FFFP
    By Lallo in forum Firefighters Forum
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 03-18-2002, 09:34 PM
  3. The NEW YORK TIMES
    By E40FDNYL35 in forum Firefighters Forum
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: 01-15-2002, 12:06 AM
  4. Thermal Imaging SOG's
    By wtfd92 in forum Firefighters Forum
    Replies: 23
    Last Post: 06-27-2001, 09:41 PM
  5. Thermal Cameras and the like
    By Diane in forum Meet and Greet
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 08-30-1999, 10:13 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts

Log in

Click here to log in or register