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    Default Question to past Pumper/Tanker awardees

    When you received your vehicle, did you incur any surprise expenses that could have been addressed within the grant application?

    Such as transport/ freight to your location? Or fuel and travel expenses getting your new truck to its new home?

    Anything that caused your check writer to raise their eyebrows because you needed extra out of pocket funds to finish project?

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    Delivery was included with ours. We also included within the bid two trips to the plant, one for pre-build conference and the other for pre-paint. In hindsight, I would have included a final inspection, but it worked out there were no issues we found when we inspected it upon arrival.

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    Brush truck for us, but...
    1. Travel expense to pick up, 1800 mile round trip adds up. The 4 guys we sent out to Kansas sure could have used a night in a hotel during the trip--they really took one for the team to keep it tight.
    2. Legal/advertising fees. We had to advertise for bids per local procurement procedures. Even using two local papers, with the attorney's fees for drafting and bid opening we were over $1,500 for that.
    3. SCBA mounts--4 @ $125 each.

    Put it all together, "minor stuff" was over $4,000. We overspent by $7,000 or so on the truck so the total expense was $11,000--about the cost of a used Saturn so we can't complain too much!!

    earl

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    Quote Originally Posted by Greenacres2 View Post
    Brush truck for us, but...
    1. Travel expense to pick up, 1800 mile round trip adds up. The 4 guys we sent out to Kansas sure could have used a night in a hotel during the trip--they really took one for the team to keep it tight.
    2. Legal/advertising fees. We had to advertise for bids per local procurement procedures. Even using two local papers, with the attorney's fees for drafting and bid opening we were over $1,500 for that.
    3. SCBA mounts--4 @ $125 each.

    Put it all together, "minor stuff" was over $4,000. We overspent by $7,000 or so on the truck so the total expense was $11,000--about the cost of a used Saturn so we can't complain too much!!

    earl
    See, that's my entire years operating budget. I need to catch as many unkowns that pop up. I understand many manufacturers like to have the rigs picked up at the factory in case there are any issues, then it is easier for them to address them at the factory. Not have them delivered and then find problems at the customers location.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jam24u View Post
    See, that's my entire years operating budget. I need to catch as many unkowns that pop up. I understand many manufacturers like to have the rigs picked up at the factory in case there are any issues, then it is easier for them to address them at the factory. Not have them delivered and then find problems at the customers location.
    Every dealer we see down here delivers the unit. Like Catch, I would insist on three trips being included to the factory, meals and lodging inclusive. Prebuild, prepaint, and pre delivery.
    Don't skimp on these.

    We had two people go each trip. I did not do the pre-delivery, but will not fail to do it next time.

    Have them mount the SCBA holders too. We forgot them, but luckily had the ones we needed.

    Remember too - if you said equipped to NFPA standards, that includes an AED. Have them mount and wire the charger or holder.

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    Program trucks aren't typically going to have multiple plant trips.

    Most expensive method for install of such as AED, Radio, TI etc is to have factory install. Dealer install less so. Most economical is local radio vendor install them at your station or their shop.

    Take a hard look at cost of full coverage insurance on that new $400000 truck. That's a budget shock compared to buying replacement on a 25year old pumper and liability on everything else.

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    Quote Originally Posted by neiowa View Post
    Program trucks aren't typically going to have multiple plant trips.

    Most expensive method for install of such as AED, Radio, TI etc is to have factory install. Dealer install less so. Most economical is local radio vendor install them at your station or their shop.

    Take a hard look at cost of full coverage insurance on that new $400000 truck. That's a budget shock compared to buying replacement on a 25year old pumper and liability on everything else.
    While it is the most expensive avenue, I have been in the radio business for many years,
    and see the quality that some of the shops have. I would let the factory do it in 9 out of 10 instances. That said, I URGE you to supply the manufacturer of your vehicle with the antenna coax kits. Let them mount the antennas while the headliners are dropped, etc, and the can run the coax to where the radio will be. Saves all sorts of billable time for the radio shop. I do this will all my fire and EMS customers, give them the coax kit with base, my card stapled to it. Saved my customers a lot of money, never have the manufacturers charged an upcharge for it.

    For that matter, the extra wiring we had KME do for two radios in our engine we were not billed for - power wires, coax kits, and siren/PA radio rebroadcast.

    Of course, as you say in a program truck, then its all for naught.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LVFD301 View Post
    While it is the most expensive avenue, I have been in the radio business for many years,
    and see the quality that some of the shops have. I would let the factory do it in 9 out of 10 instances. That said, I URGE you to supply the manufacturer of your vehicle with the antenna coax kits. Let them mount the antennas while the headliners are dropped, etc, and the can run the coax to where the radio will be. Saves all sorts of billable time for the radio shop. I do this will all my fire and EMS customers, give them the coax kit with base, my card stapled to it. Saved my customers a lot of money, never have the manufacturers charged an upcharge for it.

    For that matter, the extra wiring we had KME do for two radios in our engine we were not billed for - power wires, coax kits, and siren/PA radio rebroadcast.

    Of course, as you say in a program truck, then its all for naught.
    Valid point for custom cab projects.

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    I agree also that the bid should include inspection trips and delivery of the vehicle. Don't forget to make sure training is included as well.

    It is best to have the manufacturer deliver the vehicle vs. doing it yourself. They are held responsible for any issues that may arise during the delivery. It will not be yours until you officially accept the vehicle.

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    Okay gang, need some hlp. I've been asked to help with a vehicle grant and have written one. Not sure what they want to go for. Their bruch truck is 1988 chevy pick up with a homemade all aluminun skid unit and the thing is grossly overweight.

    Option 2: A 1991 open canopy engine with half doors that are only secured with a rubber strap. They were thinking of a 4x4 quick attack with 750 - 1000 gallons of water.

    Avg. age of their fleet is 16 years old.
    I told them I have never done a vehicle grant so not well versed on them. Any thoughts or suggestions would be awsome. I know that they are several of you that are sharp as tacks with these.

    Thanks.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fortsutphen View Post
    Okay gang, need some hlp. I've been asked to help with a vehicle grant and have written one. Not sure what they want to go for. Their bruch truck is 1988 chevy pick up with a homemade all aluminun skid unit and the thing is grossly overweight.

    Option 2: A 1991 open canopy engine with half doors that are only secured with a rubber strap. They were thinking of a 4x4 quick attack with 750 - 1000 gallons of water.

    Avg. age of their fleet is 16 years old.
    I told them I have never done a vehicle grant so not well versed on them. Any thoughts or suggestions would be awsome. I know that they are several of you that are sharp as tacks with these.

    Thanks.
    Are these the only 2 apparatus that they have?

    What is their classification rural, suburban, or urban?

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    Quit worrying about it Stoner. We'll figure it out in Tampa at the bar.

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    Quote Originally Posted by onebugle View Post
    Are these the only 2 apparatus that they have?

    What is their classification rural, suburban, or urban?
    Rural department, significant increase in wildland fires. Total of 2 engines ones as described, 1 engine/tanker, 1 brush unit, and couple of ambulances.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SLY4420 View Post
    Quit worrying about it Stoner. We'll figure it out in Tampa at the bar.
    Well, I just wanted a little of a head start. I know how we get.

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    Listen, I can solve all the world's problems after a few drinks. We'll have your friends lined up with a new Quick Attack and we'll work on getting FEMA to allow a hovercraft while we're at it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SLY4420 View Post
    Listen, I can solve all the world's problems after a few drinks. We'll have your friends lined up with a new Quick Attack and we'll work on getting FEMA to allow a hovercraft while we're at it.
    Okay, I'm counting on you. But, we solve all the problems before we take a tour of the area and be-friend the street people. Deal ?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fortsutphen View Post
    Okay, I'm counting on you. But, we solve all the problems before we take a tour of the area and be-friend the street people. Deal ?
    Nothing good can come of this!

    Depending on the age of the engine/tanker could make it a mute point to try to replace the '91 engine. With an increase in wildland fires and a 22 year old brush truck I would go with replacing that with a new brush truck or quick attack. Higher probability of funding IMO.

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    Quote Originally Posted by onebugle View Post
    Nothing good can come of this!
    You doubting us? The troublemaker was morgancity. He's staying home this year so Dusty and I will be just fine. (At least the parts we will remember)

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    Quote Originally Posted by SLY4420 View Post
    (At least the parts we will remember)
    For some reason I don't think this is from a voice of reason.

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    Quote Originally Posted by onebugle View Post
    For some reason I don't think this is from a voice of reason.
    I'm bringing my digital camera and HD video camera for things just like this.

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    Quote Originally Posted by onebugle View Post
    For some reason I don't think this is from a voice of reason.
    For some reason I believe he has trouble believing we are going to be productive.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jam24u View Post
    I'm bringing my digital camera and HD video camera for things just like this.
    Come on JAM man, you know you wanna hang with us.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fortsutphen View Post
    Come on JAM man, you know you wanna hang with us.
    After hearing some of the Reno stories on the shuttle to the training center, I wanna have a record and post to youtube.

    Enquiring minds want to know. (and see)

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    Quote Originally Posted by onebugle View Post
    Nothing good can come of this!

    Depending on the age of the engine/tanker could make it a mute point to try to replace the '91 engine. With an increase in wildland fires and a 22 year old brush truck I would go with replacing that with a new brush truck or quick attack. Higher probability of funding IMO.
    Engine tanker is a 99. Okay now gonna sound a little dumb here, but when you refer to quick attack are talking 500 gallons or more, or almost, but not quite, a brush truck. In the land of Sutphens there are only engines, engine/tankers and tower-ladders. So as you can see the vehicle grant is kinda like writting my first Ops grant years ago.

    Thanks for your info, I know you won't lead me down the wrong path. Thanks Andy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jam24u View Post
    After hearing some of the Reno stories on the shuttle to the training center, I wanna have a record and post to youtube.

    Enquiring minds want to know. (and see)
    OMG, what ever you do, don't post anything on My Space. The wife believes these trips are totally educational and that there is no time for partaking of refreshments and scenic tours of the wrong side of the city. Since Mark (morgancity) won't be there you can take his place. See ya in a few.

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