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  1. #1
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    Default What are the depts looking for at a CPAT?

    I was wondering on what the instructors are looking for when taking the CPAT exam. Are they looking at time? condition? or just completion?


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    I believe the official CPAT is strictly a Pass or Fail test. So as far as getting the card, it doesn't matter if you pass it with one second or five minutes to spare. Some depts may administer their own knock off version of the CPAT and at that point, it's up to them how they grade. Many depts rank the list strictly off the oral interview scores.

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    Forum Member pasobuff's Avatar
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    Yes - the CPAT (at least the one administered in NY by OFPC) is strictly a pass/fail test. The most important thing when taking it is to listen to the instructions given at the beginning of the test and FOLLOW THEM! Guys have been disqualified/failed for running, not keeping 2 hands on the rope when raising/lowering the ladder - stupid stuff.

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    Per iaff, ifca, and the eeoc (or what ever their initials are) it is a pass fail only. If they grade you by any other standard, especially after telling you multiple times its pass fail, they are looking at a serious law suit.

    See the govt must play fair because they represent those that are testing too as well as regular citizens.

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    Forum Member yjbrody's Avatar
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    Yes, it's pass/fail only. Check out the test online and see what the disqualifiers are for each station and memorize them. Some disqualifiers are so rediculous things that you would never think to do (like drop the ladder), but others are things that are very easy to do or are done on the firegrounds (lean on the barrel when you are dragging the dummy around it or grabbing the handrail on the stairs).

    Good luck!

  6. #6
    Forum Member pasobuff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by yjbrody64 View Post
    Yes, it's pass/fail only. Check out the test online and see what the disqualifiers are for each station and memorize them. Some disqualifiers are so rediculous things that you would never think to do (like drop the ladder), but others are things that are very easy to do or are done on the firegrounds (lean on the barrel when you are dragging the dummy around it or grabbing the handrail on the stairs).

    Good luck!
    Just found this - looks like pretty good and accurate info...

    http://www.tucsonaz.gov/fire/Trainin...pat_infor.html

  7. #7
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    We look at the pass/fail, but remember that we are watching
    EVERYTHING YOU DO!!!!

    From the moment you arrive (early?late?loud booming stereo?parked illegally?)
    To the warm up (social with others? pants on the ground? shaved?)
    To the test (struggled? barely squeaked by? crying?)
    To the ending (thanked instructors? shook hands? encouraged others?)

    Believe me, we watch every thing you do at the CPAT.
    I admin at a CPAT facility where we test for other depts as well, and believe me, we know all the different recruitment people; all it takes is one phone call or word here or there, and you will be done in the hiring process before you even knew it was going on.

    So wear a clean shirt, shave, pull your pants up, be on time, and be nice!!!

  8. #8
    Forum Member yjbrody's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by flipper123 View Post
    We look at the pass/fail, but remember that we are watching
    EVERYTHING YOU DO!!!!

    From the moment you arrive (early?late?loud booming stereo?parked illegally?)
    To the warm up (social with others? pants on the ground? shaved?)
    To the test (struggled? barely squeaked by? crying?)
    To the ending (thanked instructors? shook hands? encouraged others?)

    Believe me, we watch every thing you do at the CPAT.
    I admin at a CPAT facility where we test for other depts as well, and believe me, we know all the different recruitment people; all it takes is one phone call or word here or there, and you will be done in the hiring process before you even knew it was going on.

    So wear a clean shirt, shave, pull your pants up, be on time, and be nice!!!
    I can't agree with this more, but it counts doublely if you are taking the CPAT for the dept that you are testing with.

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    Quote Originally Posted by flipper123 View Post
    We look at the pass/fail, but remember that we are watching
    EVERYTHING YOU DO!!!!

    From the moment you arrive (early?late?loud booming stereo?parked illegally?)
    To the warm up (social with others? pants on the ground? shaved?)
    To the test (struggled? barely squeaked by? crying?)
    To the ending (thanked instructors? shook hands? encouraged others?)

    Believe me, we watch every thing you do at the CPAT.
    I admin at a CPAT facility where we test for other depts as well, and believe me, we know all the different recruitment people; all it takes is one phone call or word here or there, and you will be done in the hiring process before you even knew it was going on.

    So wear a clean shirt, shave, pull your pants up, be on time, and be nice!!!
    You better HOPE that nobody ever sues the dept/place you work for because you just signed up for a whole bunch of personal liability. Actually a double helping with the
    To the test (struggled? barely squeaked by? crying?
    part ... any low life lawyer (doesn't even have to be that good) will gut you in a depo IF they can trace back that statement to you. With that one statement you cast serious doubt over the integrity of the test and the graders.

    More specifically i am quite sure since it doesn't allow for you to judge such things as taught in the CPAT trainers manual (im guessing here because it was all developed to avoid law suits) your dept/agency will hang you out to dry and say you acted outside your scope of responsibilities. This of course will mean you will get sued personally as your dept will asked that they be left out of the suit.

    If you edit your post to be more of helpful guidance then law suit baiting i will also edit mine. You do give all good points but the part about making phone calls not a good idea.

    If you think i am wrong you can PM me or respond here but i doubt if this was shown to the CPAT ppl they would think you were following their guidebook.

    Cheers.

  10. #10
    MembersZone Subscriber ffbam24's Avatar
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    Actually, flipper's department is a great department that encourages all that he outlined there. And believe me, they are watching everything that you do, some of it even before you step onto their training grounds like he stated.

    Above all, they are all about teamwork and seeing how well you are trying to fit in to their department (i.e.; helping reset phases of the PA course, encouraging other candidates, your common courtesy and appearance in public).

    Did you guys go to the CPAT? Your original was a brute.

    Re OP question: Yes. They are looking at all of that, but legally under the guidelines, they are only qualifying you on successful completion under the time constraints (10:20). But it's not to say that all the other stuff isn't being noted. Remember; outside of the oral board, this is pretty much the only time department members may see how you interact on a natural level with other candidates and the proctors.

    Throughout the process and your career, you are being evaluated. Do the right thing and it'll be a cinch.
    Last edited by ffbam24; 02-18-2010 at 01:43 PM.

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    Cool What We Look For.....

    We look at everything that flipper123 stated.....
    "Be LOUD, Be PROUD..... It just might save your can someday when goin' through an intersection!!!!!"

    Life on the Truck (Quint) is good.....

    Eat til you're sleepy..... Sleep til you're hungry..... And repeat.....

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    Thanks guys, it was very helpful. I know they look at your condition because if you pause they would ask you "candidate do you wish to stop the test?" of course for health reasons. I don't know if they use that when it comes to the interview. You know, the notes they gather from the instructors. Because we don't know whos on the hiring panel and it might be some or if not all the instructors at the hiring board.
    one guy came in with earrings and not shaved. I didn't understand why he would dare to come in like that. Well, he got chewed out.
    I take my test this weekend, Feb 20th and I'm ready for it. I got a cold going on now so hopefully that won't affect my performance.

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    Forum Member pasobuff's Avatar
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    Good luck this weekend John.....I know the CPAT is being given in Syracuse, NY today (husband is there proctoring).....

    Oh - on a side note (and a warning to be carfeul!) - a while back in NYC a guy got 'stuck' in the maze......made it out, finished the CPAT (and passed) - afterwards he found out he had BROKEN his shoulder in the maze.....

    THAT is a guy I'd want on my team......

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    Quote Originally Posted by pasobuff View Post
    Good luck this weekend John.....I know the CPAT is being given in Syracuse, NY today (husband is there proctoring).....

    Oh - on a side note (and a warning to be carfeul!) - a while back in NYC a guy got 'stuck' in the maze......made it out, finished the CPAT (and passed) - afterwards he found out he had BROKEN his shoulder in the maze.....

    THAT is a guy I'd want on my team......
    Thanks. ooo, that must hurt. I had a dream that I popped my shoulder out but continued to pass. Funny you mentioned that.

  15. #15
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    YES, They look at everything you do.
    And OwenScott is right. IF they dont issue you a cert based on how you act... But as long as you pass the test you can get you little cert that says you passed. That doesnt mean that down the road a note wont be in your file with HR stating your attitude and how you acted. And no dept want to deal with problem children for a 20 year career. Plus you just saved them money, by showing your true colors before you got to an Oral Board or any other interaction with you.

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    Yup, I found out that they look at everything. I took my test and passed it. Amazing that lots of people didn't trained hard enough they gave up on the first event. Which I believe its the one that makes you or breaks you. But there was this guy and he act as if his S**t don't stink and one of the Lieutenants got a little ****ed off at him because he didn't want to sit down to hear the rules of the test. I said to myself "he's done" because how can you act like that and not knowing that he might be on the hiring panel. Well, there were cool people there and made some friends along the way.
    But its all true, they look at everything you do and say. So, just when you think they're not looking at you get busted on something. So, be careful and be at your best.

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    Quote Originally Posted by owenscott View Post
    If you edit your post to be more of helpful guidance then law suit baiting i will also edit mine. You do give all good points but the part about making phone calls not a good idea.

    If you think i am wrong you can PM me or respond here but i doubt if this was shown to the CPAT ppl they would think you were following their guidebook.
    Cheers.
    You have no idea what you're talking about.
    Candidates are continually evaluated at every step of the hiring process.
    This includes penmanship on their application, background checks, interactions with Dept personnel and the public, and frankly anything else that the Dept wants to look at.
    So if someone is crying, or an *******, or wears a Big Johnson T-Shirt, it will be noted.



    I am editing this to be more polite. It's a new thing for me, but I'm trying.
    My perception is that you are incorrect.
    Our hiring process evaluates the candidate as a whole; any information gathered about a candidate is utilized.
    If you feel that (1) this is illegal or
    (2) this is never done, then you are (1a) mistaken and (2a) very mistaken.
    Thanks.
    Last edited by flipper123; 02-23-2010 at 12:11 PM.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by ffbam24 View Post
    Did you guys go to the CPAT? Your original was a brute.
    Still doing the hard one, proud to say!
    I'll keep ya updated on when we hire of this list or we start a new one.

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