Why register? ...To Enhance Your Experience
+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 26
  1. #1
    Forum Member DaSharkie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2000
    Posts
    4,713

    Default Huh. No Wonder the Government Needs More Money

    I read this article on MSN last night. Half - fully HALF - of our citizenry pay NO FEDERAL INCOME TAX. No wonder I am bitter about my increasing taxes while others mooch the systems.

    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/36226444...sonal_finance/

    Half of Americans pay no federal income tax
    Credits for low- and middle-income families exempt many
    By Stephen Ohlemacher
    The Associated Press
    updated 5:36 p.m. ET, Wed., April 7, 2010
    WASHINGTON - Tax Day is a dreaded deadline for millions, but for nearly half of U.S. households it's simply somebody else's problem.

    About 47 percent will pay no federal income taxes at all for 2009. Either their incomes were too low, or they qualified for enough credits, deductions and exemptions to eliminate their liability. That's according to projections by the Tax Policy Center, a Washington research organization.

    Most people still are required to file returns by the April 15 deadline. The penalty for skipping it is limited to the amount of taxes owed, but it's still almost always better to file: That's the only way to get a refund of all the income taxes withheld by employers.

    In recent years, credits for low- and middle-income families have grown so much that a family of four making as much as $50,000 will owe no federal income tax for 2009, as long as there are two children younger than 17, according to a separate analysis by the consulting firm Deloitte Tax.

    Tax cuts enacted in the past decade have been generous to wealthy taxpayers, too, making them a target for President Barack Obama and Democrats in Congress. Less noticed were tax cuts for low- and middle-income families, which were expanded when Obama signed the massive economic recovery package last year.

    The result is a tax system that exempts almost half the country from paying for programs that benefit everyone, including national defense, public safety, infrastructure and education. It is a system in which the top 10 percent of earners — households making an average of $366,400 in 2006 — paid about 73 percent of the income taxes collected by the federal government.

    The bottom 40 percent, on average, make a profit from the federal income tax, meaning they get more money in tax credits than they would otherwise owe in taxes. For those people, the government sends them a payment.

    "We have 50 percent of people who are getting something for nothing," said Curtis Dubay, senior tax policy analyst at the Heritage Foundation.

    Tax aversion
    The vast majority of people who escape federal income taxes still pay other taxes, including federal payroll taxes that fund Social Security and Medicare, and excise taxes on gasoline, aviation, alcohol and cigarettes. Many also pay state or local taxes on sales, income and property.

    That helps explain the country's aversion to taxes, said Clint Stretch, a tax policy expert Deloitte Tax. He said many people simply look at the difference between their gross pay and their take-home pay and blame the government for the disparity.

    "It's not uncommon for people to think that their Social Security taxes, their 401(k) contributions, their share of employer health premiums, all of that stuff in their mind gets lumped into income taxes," Stretch said.

    The federal income tax is the government's largest source of revenue, raising more than $900 billion — or a little less than half of all government receipts — in the budget year that ended last Sept. 30. But with deductions and credits, especially for families with children, there have long been people who don't pay it, mainly lower-income families.

    The number of households that don't pay federal income taxes increased substantially in 2008, when the poor economy reduced incomes and Congress cut taxes in an attempt to help recovery.


    In 2007, about 38 percent of households paid no federal income tax, a figure that jumped to 49 percent in 2008, according to estimates by the Tax Policy Center.

    In 2008, President George W. Bush signed a law providing most families with rebate checks of $300 to $1,200. Last year, Obama signed the economic recovery law that expanded some tax credits and created others. Most targeted low- and middle-income families.

    Obama's Making Work Pay credit provides as much as $800 to couples and $400 to individuals. The expanded child tax credit provides $1,000 for each child under 17. The Earned Income Tax Credit provides up to $5,657 to low-income families with at least three children.

    Eliminating tax liability
    There are also tax credits for college expenses, buying a new home and upgrading an existing home with energy-efficient doors, windows, furnaces and other appliances. Many of the credits are refundable, meaning if the credits exceed the amount of income taxes owed, the taxpayer gets a payment from the government for the difference.

    "All these things are ways the government says, if you do this, we'll reduce your tax bill by some amount," said Roberton Williams, a senior fellow at the Tax Policy Center.

    The government could provide the same benefits through spending programs, with the same effect on the federal budget, Williams said. But it sounds better for politicians to say they cut taxes rather than they started a new spending program, he added.

    Obama has pushed tax cuts for low- and middle-income families and tax increases for the wealthy, arguing that wealthier taxpayers fared well in the past decade, so it's time to pay up. The nation's wealthiest taxpayers did get big tax breaks under Bush, with the top marginal tax rate reduced from 39.6 percent to 35 percent, and the second-highest rate reduced from 36 percent to 33 percent.

    But income tax rates were lowered at every income level. The changes made it relatively easy for families of four making $50,000 to eliminate their income tax liability.

    Here's how they did it, according to Deloitte Tax:

    The family was entitled to a standard deduction of $11,400 and four personal exemptions of $3,650 apiece, leaving a taxable income of $24,000. The federal income tax on $24,000 is $2,769.

    With two children younger than 17, the family qualified for two $1,000 child tax credits. Its Making Work Pay credit was $800 because the parents were married filing jointly.

    The $2,800 in credits exceeds the $2,769 in taxes, so the family makes a $31 profit from the federal income tax. That ought to take the sting out of April 15.

    Copyright 2010 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.
    URL: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/36226444...sonal_finance/

    MSN Privacy . Legal
    © 2010 MSNBC.com
    "Too many people spend money they haven't earned, to buy things they don't want, to impress people they don't like." Will Rogers

    The borrower is slave to the lender. Proverbs 22:7 - Debt free since 10/5/2009.

    "No man's life, liberty, or property are safe while the legislature is in session." - New York Judge Gideon Tucker

    "As Americans we must always remember that we all have a common enemy, an enemy that is dangerous, powerful and relentless. I refer, of course, to the federal government." - Dave Barry

    www.daveramsey.com www.clarkhoward.com www.heritage.org


  2. #2
    MembersZone Subscriber
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    So of Can. / N. of Mexico
    Posts
    866

    Cool Redistribution of Wealth

    It's called redistribution of wealth, or socialism. Gee, I wonder who voted for Obama.
    New York State raised taxes higher on the wealthy and their tax receipts went down significantly the next year. People either left the state or got better at shielding their income.
    To use a quote often used by another forum contributor. “The problem with Socialism is that eventually you run out of other people’s money.” Margret Thatcher.

  3. #3
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    8,677

    Default

    It used to be a system for supporting the government. Now it has become a system of social engineering and wealth redistribution. Two functions government has no business being involved in. Interestingly, the article left out such benefits as HEAP, and Food stamps for those in a little lower income bracket. I know a single person who makes a little over $30K and qualifies for HEAP, about $800 worth. What we need to do is start moving towards a flat tax. Of course, the liberals don't care about fair, they care that by doing this nonsense so they can buy votes. What is really ridiculous is the penalty you pay for being single or choosing not to have children.

  4. #4
    Forum Member scfire86's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    HB
    Posts
    10,118

    Default

    Unemployment and welfare are about 3% of the budget.

    It isn't those recipients causing the problem.

    A convenient yet bad example.

    When you refer to those who mooch off the system, whom are you referencing?

    You do realize that your industry has about three times as much impact (almost 11%) on the federal budget?

    Are all those Medicare/Medicaid recipients moochers as well?
    Last edited by scfire86; 04-09-2010 at 01:07 AM.
    Politics is like driving. To go forward select "D", to go backward select "R."

  5. #5
    MembersZone Subscriber
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    So of Can. / N. of Mexico
    Posts
    866

    Default

    Medicare Is paid by taxing wage earners.

    The issue is half the people in the country are paying for the government supported services for the other 50% of the people who are not paying their fare share.

  6. #6
    Forum Member DaSharkie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2000
    Posts
    4,713

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by scfire86 View Post
    When you refer to those who mooch off the system, whom are you referencing?
    I am referencing people who get back more money than they paid in taxes. People who manipulate the system.

    There are many loopy and stupid tax breaks out there. You get a tax break for putting your kid in daycare? You get a "special" tax break because you are a teacher? You get to deduct union dues? Even this ridiculously stupid tax benefit for buying a house gives you $8,000.

    Why can't people just give the government a set amount of their income every year? People are going to be less likely to manipulate the systems in place if they do. Instead, you have a full half of the working/collecting population not paying a single penny in income taxes every year.

    Quote Originally Posted by scfire86 View Post
    You do realize that your industry has about three times as much impact (almost 11%) on the federal budget?
    And? This means what exactly?

    Quote Originally Posted by scfire86 View Post
    Are all those Medicare/Medicaid recipients moochers as well?
    Oh man. You ought to get out a bit more. There are a lot of folks mooching off the system - more Medicaid than Medicare. But again, you don't get out much. I routinely care for people who are collecting disability for rather ridiculous "disabilities" that qualify them for receiving Medicaid coverage. I have seen 20 years olds diagnosed with Fibromyalgia , depression, and numerous other disabilities that people deal with every day and are still actually hard working, contributing members of society.

    But then again, you - being a liberal sort of guy - have no problem with it.

    Don't confuse my bitterness and frustration with a lack of compassion. There are those that need assistance and cannot work, but there is an entire cottage industry in medicine and a large cadre of lawyers whose sole purpose in life is to get you disability for any of a number of perceived illnesses. I just get tired of the manipulation and those that defend it as being a fine thing to do.
    "Too many people spend money they haven't earned, to buy things they don't want, to impress people they don't like." Will Rogers

    The borrower is slave to the lender. Proverbs 22:7 - Debt free since 10/5/2009.

    "No man's life, liberty, or property are safe while the legislature is in session." - New York Judge Gideon Tucker

    "As Americans we must always remember that we all have a common enemy, an enemy that is dangerous, powerful and relentless. I refer, of course, to the federal government." - Dave Barry

    www.daveramsey.com www.clarkhoward.com www.heritage.org

  7. #7
    Forum Member DaSharkie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2000
    Posts
    4,713

    Default On the other hand......

    I read this one this morning. My own Senator, one John Forbes "Do you know who I am" Kerry is an advocate for additional taxation. Not cuts in spending mind you - but additional taxation and revenue for the Federal government. No, he does not want to cut spending to eliminate the deficit - and God knows that there are billions in programs and spending to cut - but he would like to add a "Value Added Tax" to things bought and sold in the United States. This would allow for the Federal government to hire untold thousands more to the IRS that would be needed to collect and police the new funds coming in. I guess actually leveling the taxation playing field and collecting taxes from the HALF of the country that does not pay them is just plain silly.

    http://www.bostonherald.com/business...ome&position=4

    U.S. eyes sales tax
    As deficits grow, Kerry says European-style fees may be fair

    By Jay Fitzgerald | Friday, April 9, 2010 | http://www.bostonherald.com | Business & Markets

    Photo by AP
    U.S. Sen. John Kerry said yesterday he favors exploring the possible implementation of a new nationwide sales tax similar to ones now imposed throughout Europe.

    The issue of a new “value added tax” in the United States emerged earlier this week when Paul Volcker, an economic adviser to President Obama, said the U.S. may need such a tax to close the nation’s long-term budget deficits.

    Yesterday, the Congressional Budget Office acknowledged it’s studying a value-added tax, also known as VAT, at the request of unidentified congressional staffers. No dollar amounts were mentioned.

    Kerry, a Massachusetts Democrat, stopped short of endorsing a value-added tax. But he made clear it should be on the table.

    “The tax code remains too long, too complicated and too chock full of wasteful subsidies and giveaways that don’t make economic sense,” Kerry said in a statement.

    “A big reform is overdue. We should simplify. You should look at and consider everything that would take some of the burden off of working people. We should definitely debate alternatives like the VAT, but the test of any idea should be fairness, progressivity and economic growth.”

    The idea of a value-added tax - which in Europe taxes products at almost every stage of their development and final delivery to stores - was immediately criticized by Sen. Orrin Hatch (R-Utah), who called it a “job killing” tax.

    “There doesn’t appear to be an end in sight to the massive tax hikes coming out of Washington,” he said.

    While some conservatives oppose any new taxes, others say they’d prefer a national sales tax over an income tax that many people can now avoid.

    But Jon Hurst, president of the Retailers Association of Massachusetts, said he fears a value-added tax would simply be used to fund new programs, such as the nearly $1 trillion health-care reform act approved last month by Congress.

    “We’ve just passed a socialist health-care program and now we’re going for a European tax system to pay for it,” said Hurst, complaining a VAT is “extremely regressive and unfair to consumers.”

    Article URL: http://www.bostonherald.com/business...icleid=1245809
    "Too many people spend money they haven't earned, to buy things they don't want, to impress people they don't like." Will Rogers

    The borrower is slave to the lender. Proverbs 22:7 - Debt free since 10/5/2009.

    "No man's life, liberty, or property are safe while the legislature is in session." - New York Judge Gideon Tucker

    "As Americans we must always remember that we all have a common enemy, an enemy that is dangerous, powerful and relentless. I refer, of course, to the federal government." - Dave Barry

    www.daveramsey.com www.clarkhoward.com www.heritage.org

  8. #8
    Forum Member scfire86's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    HB
    Posts
    10,118

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by DaSharkie View Post
    I am referencing people who get back more money than they paid in taxes. People who manipulate the system.
    Would that include SS and Medicare recipients? How about military pensioners? Their pension isn't a trust fund. It's paid right out of the general fund. Many collect far longer than they actually served.

    Quote Originally Posted by DaSharkie View Post
    Why can't people just give the government a set amount of their income every year? People are going to be less likely to manipulate the systems in place if they do. Instead, you have a full half of the working/collecting population not paying a single penny in income taxes every year.
    Because the very wealthy wouldn't benefit from that system.

    Quote Originally Posted by DaSharkie View Post
    And? This means what exactly?
    If I have to explain, it isn't worth trying.

    Quote Originally Posted by DaSharkie View Post
    Oh man. You ought to get out a bit more. There are a lot of folks mooching off the system - more Medicaid than Medicare. But again, you don't get out much. I routinely care for people who are collecting disability for rather ridiculous "disabilities" that qualify them for receiving Medicaid coverage. I have seen 20 years olds diagnosed with Fibromyalgia , depression, and numerous other disabilities that people deal with every day and are still actually hard working, contributing members of society.
    Anecdotal. I never said the system is perfect. There will always be someone looking for an angle. Welcome to humanity.

    Quote Originally Posted by DaSharkie View Post
    But then again, you - being a liberal sort of guy - have no problem with it.
    If you say so.

    Quote Originally Posted by DaSharkie View Post
    Don't confuse my bitterness and frustration with a lack of compassion. There are those that need assistance and cannot work, but there is an entire cottage industry in medicine and a large cadre of lawyers whose sole purpose in life is to get you disability for any of a number of perceived illnesses. I just get tired of the manipulation and those that defend it as being a fine thing to do.
    How do you know they are all perceived? Have you done a diagnosis on all of them?
    Politics is like driving. To go forward select "D", to go backward select "R."

  9. #9
    Forum Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Memphis Tn,USA-now
    Posts
    5,436

    Default

    If you get money back when you file your taxes,it means that you were overtaxed in the previous year,not necessarily that you gamed the system and won anything.
    If Wally World overcharged any of us,we'd be on tv over the caption "Enraged man claims overpayment,demands refund.Film at 11".
    From 1994 to 2000,I had to pay into the system because I only claim myself on the W-4 and appearently that means I didn't pay enough to the IRS.I didn't get a refund until George Bush got into office and realized that a surplus means that too much money is taken in by the government and refunded the overpayment.
    Because of an otj injury two years ago,I haven't been at my real job and thus haven't been paying into the system.I haven't been drawing on it,either,figuring that people who are really are unable to work should be on the dole,not me.Til I can find work,I am doing odd jobs and not expecting a handout from anyone.

  10. #10
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    8,677

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by scfire86 View Post
    Unemployment and welfare are about 3% of the budget.

    It isn't those recipients causing the problem.

    A convenient yet bad example.

    When you refer to those who mooch off the system, whom are you referencing?

    You do realize that your industry has about three times as much impact (almost 11%) on the federal budget?

    Are all those Medicare/Medicaid recipients moochers as well?
    Depends on how you define welfare. Health and Human services are 16% of the budget, SS is 20%. Once again our friend from the land of OZone is spreading lies and bad information.

  11. #11
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    8,677

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by DaSharkie View Post
    I am referencing people who get back more money than they paid in taxes. People who manipulate the system.

    There are many loopy and stupid tax breaks out there. You get a tax break for putting your kid in daycare? You get a "special" tax break because you are a teacher? You get to deduct union dues? Even this ridiculously stupid tax benefit for buying a house gives you $8,000.

    Why can't people just give the government a set amount of their income every year? People are going to be less likely to manipulate the systems in place if they do. Instead, you have a full half of the working/collecting population not paying a single penny in income taxes every year.
    I call those roaming tax breaks. I did the responsible thing years ago and replaced my windows with energy efficient windows. No tax break then but now there is. Why should I be penalized for acting responsibly? Our government programs are set up to reward those who do not plan or for those who act irresponsibly. Take higher education. If I save for my childs education when it comes to grant and funding time I will get none. However, the bum who partied it all away will get grants.

    Even the tax system is flawed. Why should a wage earner who is married or has children pay less? Larger families will use the services and funding more, they should pay more not less.

    Our systems need to stop punishing those who act responsibly.

  12. #12
    Forum Member DaSharkie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2000
    Posts
    4,713

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by scfire86 View Post
    Would that include SS and Medicare recipients?
    Was I speaking about them? Why don't you try to keep up with the ball game?

    Quote Originally Posted by scfire86 View Post
    How about military pensioners?
    What about them? They did their time. Get 50% at 20 years of service. It's a hard life with a lot of things that occur. I have no problem with it. But you THINK I was applying it to them - and I wasn't. You love to extrapolate things from what I post instead of taking it at face value. Or you are being hypocritical and asking for clarification, while deriding my same action.

    Quote Originally Posted by scfire86 View Post
    Their pension isn't a trust fund. It's paid right out of the general fund. Many collect far longer than they actually served.
    As do many public service employees. Your point?

    Quote Originally Posted by scfire86 View Post
    Because the very wealthy wouldn't benefit from that system.
    Nor would the other 50% of the population that pay no income taxes. Just did my taxes, paid the Feds A LOT of money last year.

    I don't have kids so I can't get a deduction. I am not a teacher so I can't get a deduction. I make too much money to be able to claim any money for the thousands I paid in student loan interest last year. I make too much money to contribute to a Roth. Too much to claim medical expenses. I did not buy a new car last year so I could not claim sales and registration fees on the taxes. I do not own a house so I don't get a mortgage interest deduction. I did not buy a house last year so I don't get a ridiculous $8,000 tax rebate simply for doing so.

    I have no problem paying my taxes, I wish that it was less money - but it does pay for needed things. But a full half of the population not paying a single penny in Federal taxes is disgusting.

    As the article pointed out: "It is a system in which the top 10 percent of earners — households making an average of $366,400 in 2006 — paid about 73 percent of the income taxes collected by the federal government."

    A full 73% of ALL income taxes are paid for by 10% of the population - yet the libs/progressives/Democrats want to RAISE those people's taxes. And you claim in your post that it is the wealthy that benefit from that tax system as it is? Are you f@cking high?

    Quote Originally Posted by scfire86 View Post
    If I have to explain, it isn't worth trying.
    Perhaps I am only asking so that I understand precisely what you are saying, because it could be taken many ways.

    Quote Originally Posted by scfire86 View Post
    Anecdotal. I never said the system is perfect. There will always be someone looking for an angle. Welcome to humanity.
    Yet we should continue to allow it?

    Quote Originally Posted by scfire86 View Post
    If you say so.
    So you are not a liberal? Wow, what happened? You no longer think that the government ought to be the one that supports everyone and gives multiple generations of a family money for doing nothing while contributing nothing to the system?

    Prove me wrong. You won't, but you could - until then my statement will stand.

    Quote Originally Posted by scfire86 View Post
    How do you know they are all perceived? Have you done a diagnosis on all of them?
    I have diagnosed many. I have seen the results of them. I see many of them on a daily basis. Alcoholics and drug addicts should not get SSI. You really ought to get out more and realize the what occurs in the real world - and not what you simply believe to be going.

    You ought to see the stuff that rolls into a doctor's office or an Emergency Department every day. Most medical practitioners can give you numerous anecdotal reports and stories. I can think of about a half dozen off the top of my sleep deprived head.

    Or the alcoholics that get SSI checks and sign them over to a local liquor store so they can have a revolving account for their booze. Or the people that ask me for a letter so they can go to the SS office so they can get disability.

    I have compassion for folks who need and deserve it. But if you are an able-bodied individual, then go work like the rest of us.

    Half of a nation paying no income taxes is unnacceptable and disturbing.
    "Too many people spend money they haven't earned, to buy things they don't want, to impress people they don't like." Will Rogers

    The borrower is slave to the lender. Proverbs 22:7 - Debt free since 10/5/2009.

    "No man's life, liberty, or property are safe while the legislature is in session." - New York Judge Gideon Tucker

    "As Americans we must always remember that we all have a common enemy, an enemy that is dangerous, powerful and relentless. I refer, of course, to the federal government." - Dave Barry

    www.daveramsey.com www.clarkhoward.com www.heritage.org

  13. #13
    Forum Member DaSharkie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2000
    Posts
    4,713

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ScareCrow57 View Post
    Take higher education. If I save for my childs education when it comes to grant and funding time I will get none. However, the bum who partied it all away will get grants.
    And don't forget the libs/progressives/Dems flat out LOVE for giving ILLEGAL immigrants in-state college tuition for classes. Nothing like rewarding criminal activity, huh?

    Quote Originally Posted by ScareCrow57 View Post
    Even the tax system is flawed. Why should a wage earner who is married or has children pay less? Larger families will use the services and funding more, they should pay more not less.

    Our systems need to stop punishing those who act responsibly.
    Of course it does. We owe no one anything. We have no debt. We pay our credit card off twice monthly. I pay all my taxes on time. We live off of half of my wife's income - saving everything else (so the interest on it can get taxed.) We live give generously to a variety of charities. Yet we are villified for working hard and making a good amount of money every year. But some guy that does nothing can just come walking on up and hold out their hand and people of the liberal persuasion just want to give it all away and take more of my money for a growing population of non-contributors to our general society.

    Let alone the libs desire to reward people for living wrecklessly in their financial lives, making banks reduce loan amounts that people agreed to pay in a LEGAL document. Bail out those who lived financially wreckless lives buying homes they could not afford and who default on their loans - while those who bust their arses to live well and provide well for their families get to see their tax burden go UP and their government p!ss and fritter away their money (because taxes collected are, after all, still our money.)

    Then again, to listen to the Libs I am just an angry, white, conservative, racist, and unaring man that lacks compassion for his fellow man.
    Last edited by DaSharkie; 04-09-2010 at 04:13 PM.
    "Too many people spend money they haven't earned, to buy things they don't want, to impress people they don't like." Will Rogers

    The borrower is slave to the lender. Proverbs 22:7 - Debt free since 10/5/2009.

    "No man's life, liberty, or property are safe while the legislature is in session." - New York Judge Gideon Tucker

    "As Americans we must always remember that we all have a common enemy, an enemy that is dangerous, powerful and relentless. I refer, of course, to the federal government." - Dave Barry

    www.daveramsey.com www.clarkhoward.com www.heritage.org

  14. #14
    Forum Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Catlettsburg, KY
    Posts
    378

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by doughesson View Post
    figuring that people who are really are unable to work should be on the dole,not me.Til I can find work,I am doing odd jobs and not expecting a handout from anyone.
    Amen!! I don't know you but I just gained tons of respect for you.

    I am what is called a brittle diabetic, I have diabetic retinopathy, I have had quintuple (That's 5) bypass surgery, and I have been told that I should be on disability by all of my doctors. I asked why and in then same sentenced said no!!. I can still breathe so I can still work. Even if I got laid off I think I would rather work sun up till sun down at MucDonalds before drawing welfare.

    Then we have those people that are now able to get disability because they suffer from whatever that disease is called due to lack of sunlight. I say Hey move to the equator where you get plenty of sunlight!!

    FYI...I am all for veterans getting their pension for the remainder of their or their spouses life. They served our country and they deserve it.

    As for Barrack Obama, he wasn't elected President because he was the best candidate for the job. He was elected because people thought that someone different would do a better job. And let's not forget Oprah who i beleive is a republican and Colin Powell who is a republican that also supported him. Why did they do that? It wasn't because Obama was republican. Forget experience and knowledge. Who needs that to be President? (Sarcasm). But we are stuck with him for at least 2.5 more years. Or at least until November. I consider myself an Independent but I believe it is going to be pretty much rep for me at the next election time.

    As for the crisis we are facing with extreme national debt. In ways it is not as bad as some perceive and ways it is a lot worse than some perceive. This all started back in 1980 with the deregulation of the banking system and subprime mortgage started almost immediately. This deregulations also started a trend to deregulate other industries. Electricity and airlines for example. We are way out of control on both. Economy looked good under Reagan at the beginning and it looked really good under Clinton. But all the time it was getting worse. That is where the "a lot worse" comes into play.

    If we cannot get real jobs back into this country and all people pay their fair share then we are in for a hurtin'. They only good thing we have going for us is the entire worlds economy is based on the United States. Yeah sure China is growing but they are infantile compared to the economy of the US. Think, if we stop buying what happens to China, Korea, Japan, Mexico, Etc. Etc. Etc..

    Flat Tax of 9-11% of Gross for everyone and every company period!!

    I could go on and on but now I am rambling.

  15. #15
    Forum Member scfire86's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    HB
    Posts
    10,118

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by DaSharkie View Post
    Was I speaking about them? Why don't you try to keep up with the ball game?

    What about them? They did their time. Get 50% at 20 years of service. It's a hard life with a lot of things that occur. I have no problem with it. But you THINK I was applying it to them - and I wasn't. You love to extrapolate things from what I post instead of taking it at face value. Or you are being hypocritical and asking for clarification, while deriding my same action.

    As do many public service employees. Your point?

    Nor would the other 50% of the population that pay no income taxes. Just did my taxes, paid the Feds A LOT of money last year.

    I don't have kids so I can't get a deduction. I am not a teacher so I can't get a deduction. I make too much money to be able to claim any money for the thousands I paid in student loan interest last year. I make too much money to contribute to a Roth. Too much to claim medical expenses. I did not buy a new car last year so I could not claim sales and registration fees on the taxes. I do not own a house so I don't get a mortgage interest deduction. I did not buy a house last year so I don't get a ridiculous $8,000 tax rebate simply for doing so.

    I have no problem paying my taxes, I wish that it was less money - but it does pay for needed things. But a full half of the population not paying a single penny in Federal taxes is disgusting.

    As the article pointed out: "It is a system in which the top 10 percent of earners — households making an average of $366,400 in 2006 — paid about 73 percent of the income taxes collected by the federal government."

    A full 73% of ALL income taxes are paid for by 10% of the population - yet the libs/progressives/Democrats want to RAISE those people's taxes. And you claim in your post that it is the wealthy that benefit from that tax system as it is? Are you f@cking high?



    Perhaps I am only asking so that I understand precisely what you are saying, because it could be taken many ways.



    Yet we should continue to allow it?



    So you are not a liberal? Wow, what happened? You no longer think that the government ought to be the one that supports everyone and gives multiple generations of a family money for doing nothing while contributing nothing to the system?

    Prove me wrong. You won't, but you could - until then my statement will stand.



    I have diagnosed many. I have seen the results of them. I see many of them on a daily basis. Alcoholics and drug addicts should not get SSI. You really ought to get out more and realize the what occurs in the real world - and not what you simply believe to be going.

    You ought to see the stuff that rolls into a doctor's office or an Emergency Department every day. Most medical practitioners can give you numerous anecdotal reports and stories. I can think of about a half dozen off the top of my sleep deprived head.

    Or the alcoholics that get SSI checks and sign them over to a local liquor store so they can have a revolving account for their booze. Or the people that ask me for a letter so they can go to the SS office so they can get disability.

    I have compassion for folks who need and deserve it. But if you are an able-bodied individual, then go work like the rest of us.

    Half of a nation paying no income taxes is unnacceptable and disturbing.
    You're blasting away at a group that consumes a whopping 3% of the budget. Keep looking away from the man behind the curtain. You remind me of the punchline about the man everyone thought was stealing sand, but was actually stealing wheelbarrows.
    Politics is like driving. To go forward select "D", to go backward select "R."

  16. #16
    Forum Member scfire86's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    HB
    Posts
    10,118

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by DaSharkie View Post
    Of course it does. We owe no one anything. We have no debt. We pay our credit card off twice monthly. I pay all my taxes on time. We live off of half of my wife's income - saving everything else (so the interest on it can get taxed.) We live give generously to a variety of charities. Yet we are villified for working hard and making a good amount of money every year. But some guy that does nothing can just come walking on up and hold out their hand and people of the liberal persuasion just want to give it all away and take more of my money for a growing population of non-contributors to our general society.

    Let alone the libs desire to reward people for living wrecklessly in their financial lives, making banks reduce loan amounts that people agreed to pay in a LEGAL document. Bail out those who lived financially wreckless lives buying homes they could not afford and who default on their loans - while those who bust their arses to live well and provide well for their families get to see their tax burden go UP and their government p!ss and fritter away their money (because taxes collected are, after all, still our money.)

    Then again, to listen to the Libs I am just an angry, white, conservative, racist, and unaring man that lacks compassion for his fellow man.
    You realize you're talking about financial responsibility to a person who went BK because of his credit cards, do you?
    Politics is like driving. To go forward select "D", to go backward select "R."

  17. #17
    Forum Member DaSharkie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2000
    Posts
    4,713

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by scfire86 View Post
    You realize you're talking about financial responsibility to a person who went BK because of his credit cards, do you?
    And he made a mistake. I thought liberals were supposed to be forgiving of others. Or is it you are just forgiving of other liberals that make mistakes?

    One learns from their mistakes. While I have not had to declare bankruptcy - I have made stupid financial choices. Does that mean that I should not learn from them?
    "Too many people spend money they haven't earned, to buy things they don't want, to impress people they don't like." Will Rogers

    The borrower is slave to the lender. Proverbs 22:7 - Debt free since 10/5/2009.

    "No man's life, liberty, or property are safe while the legislature is in session." - New York Judge Gideon Tucker

    "As Americans we must always remember that we all have a common enemy, an enemy that is dangerous, powerful and relentless. I refer, of course, to the federal government." - Dave Barry

    www.daveramsey.com www.clarkhoward.com www.heritage.org

  18. #18
    Forum Member DaSharkie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2000
    Posts
    4,713

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by scfire86 View Post
    You're blasting away at a group that consumes a whopping 3% of the budget. Keep looking away from the man behind the curtain. You remind me of the punchline about the man everyone thought was stealing sand, but was actually stealing wheelbarrows.
    So how much of the budget should waste, fraud, and abuse be before I can "blast away" with your approval?

    There is no man behind the curtain for me. I am distrustful of my government, and distrustful of politicians in general. They allow for this, hence I can criticize them.

    Apparently fraud and waste with your tax dollars is OK. Well, for a lot of people in this nation it is not an acceptable thing.
    "Too many people spend money they haven't earned, to buy things they don't want, to impress people they don't like." Will Rogers

    The borrower is slave to the lender. Proverbs 22:7 - Debt free since 10/5/2009.

    "No man's life, liberty, or property are safe while the legislature is in session." - New York Judge Gideon Tucker

    "As Americans we must always remember that we all have a common enemy, an enemy that is dangerous, powerful and relentless. I refer, of course, to the federal government." - Dave Barry

    www.daveramsey.com www.clarkhoward.com www.heritage.org

  19. #19
    Forum Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Location
    Mostly in the dog house
    Posts
    25

    Default

    So, if I read this correctly, If I quit my job (self downsize) not only do I not have to pay taxes, but the government will give me money?

    WOW!!!!
    Along with all of the other stuff the Pres is pushing through, I can use that money to buy a house that I won't have to pay for (will I still get my $8,000.00?), I can use the ER for my gas pains, recieve food stamps, and still buy a big screen and new furniture with the disability check I'll get from my hemmorrhiods!

    I'm going to have it made while all of YOU suckers do the work!

    I've earned my own money since I was 9 years old, and the entire time I've always wondered one thing:

    When will I be able to keep some of it!!!!!

  20. #20
    Forum Member scfire86's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    HB
    Posts
    10,118

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by DaSharkie View Post
    So how much of the budget should waste, fraud, and abuse be before I can "blast away" with your approval?

    There is no man behind the curtain for me. I am distrustful of my government, and distrustful of politicians in general. They allow for this, hence I can criticize them.

    Apparently fraud and waste with your tax dollars is OK. Well, for a lot of people in this nation it is not an acceptable thing.
    Blast away all you want.
    Politics is like driving. To go forward select "D", to go backward select "R."

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. Did you respond to WTC???
    By E40FDNYL35 in forum Firefighters Forum
    Replies: 197
    Last Post: 04-21-2011, 07:28 PM
  2. IAFF Issues Book
    By ehs7554 in forum Firefighters Forum
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 03-03-2007, 07:06 PM
  3. Its about time someone finally said this. (Gotta read!)
    By CALFFBOU in forum Firefighters Forum
    Replies: 105
    Last Post: 03-14-2003, 10:09 PM
  4. A Resolution worth sharing
    By karolin in forum Firefighters Forum
    Replies: 46
    Last Post: 02-21-2002, 02:46 AM
  5. Bush Recommends Cutting FIRE Act; Project Impact
    By webteam in forum Firefighters Forum
    Replies: 383
    Last Post: 03-31-2001, 05:53 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts