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  1. #1
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    Default Newer Mack chassis....?

    Can anyone shed any light on this? How many where produced and when?



  2. #2
    Forum Member Jonnee's Avatar
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    I have heard they are making a fire chassis but this is the first I have seen one or a complete job. Very interesting I must say. Maxim is also building a chassic as well.

    Now if we could get Peter Pirsch back in the business!!!

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    That is a Sutphen. A few yrs ago they offered a Mack rolling chassis as an option. First one I've seen with Mack decoration on the grille. Not sure if they sold many.

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    It's Heidlersburg's 2001 Sutphen. They have a Mack history. Chassis by Sutphen, grille ornamentation by Mack.

  5. #5
    Forum Member Rescue101's Avatar
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    Hool,line and sinker. Hehe T.C.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by retiredtruckman View Post
    It's Heidlersburg's 2001 Sutphen. They have a Mack history. Chassis by Sutphen, grille ornamentation by Mack.
    Long, fascinating story on that engine. Story has it that Sutphen bought several Mack CH chassis with the idea of removing the cabs, rearranging the steering gear and replacing the CH (conventional) cabs with Sutphen cabs.
    There were only one or two of them actually built. It (or one of them) was shown at the Fire Expo in Harrisburg, Pa. that year. It was red then. It went unsold for several years.

    Early on in our search for what became our 2007 Toyne, we got the McSutphen in as a demo for several days. I think that's the one. I was hoping to get a better look at the pump panel so I could be sure. It has many features that were very attractive to us. First, with the exception of the transmission, the chassis is all Mack. It has a Mack engine, E9, 427 HP if I remember correctly. I know it would fly! It has a really nice stainless body.

    But there were a couple of drawbacks, depending on your point of view. At the time it had a 10-speed Roadranger AutoShift transmission, the version with a clutch pedal. We had one driver who could not deal with that. Lots more to that story, too much to put here. TC, catch up to me. You'll love it.

    And again, assuming that it's the same truck, the cab does not tilt. One day while the salesman and FWDbuff were out buffing in Phila., I went looking to see how I would service it. To this day I don't know how I would ever have changed fuel filters.

    I know that before the truck was sold (a year or two later), it got an Allison transmission.

    The truck I saw in Harrisburg had the Mack name on it as the picture shows. The demo we had did not. I had heard that Mack didn't approve of what Sutphen had done and demanded that their name be removed. What transpired after that, I don't know.

    All in all, I liked the truck. If we could have overcome the service issues and a couple of others, I'd have been happy to have it.

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    Found this also, looks like the same rig in red


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    Quote Originally Posted by dano313 View Post
    Found this also, looks like the same rig in red

    That does look like it as it came to us.

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  10. #10
    Forum Member FWDbuff's Avatar
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    DISCLAIMER: This is strictly hearsay.

    Folklore has it that sometime after Mack became aware that Sutphen had done this, that Mack advised Sutphen it would be in there best interests if they were to NOT do it again. I was also told that the MACK name and logos were supposed to have been removed from this truck, don't know what happened there.
    "Loyalty Above all Else. Except Honor."

  11. #11
    Forum Member FWDbuff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rescue101 View Post
    Hool,line and sinker. Hehe T.C.
    This fish is like the "Hydra" of ancient greek mythology......You cut off it's head and it keeps coming back!
    "Loyalty Above all Else. Except Honor."

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    FWDbuff,

    So Sutphen did this without the permission of Mack? Thats like a lawsuit waiting to happen if true. All they had to do was pay a license fee and Mack would be happy.

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    Sutphen sold that engine for $ 210,000, it was listed on there Sutphen East web site for about a year or more ! It would be great news if Mack trucks and someone else could get together and produce a apparatus like that green engine photo shown above !!
    Last edited by WoodbridgeFFII; 04-14-2010 at 07:11 PM.

  14. #14
    Forum Member FWDbuff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ledebuhr1 View Post
    FWDbuff,

    So Sutphen did this without the permission of Mack? Thats like a lawsuit waiting to happen if true. All they had to do was pay a license fee and Mack would be happy.
    Allegedly.
    "Loyalty Above all Else. Except Honor."

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    Forum Member FWDbuff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WoodbridgeFFII View Post
    Sutphen sold that engine for $ 210,000, it was listed on there Sutphen East web site for about a year or more ! It would be great news if Mack trucks and someone else could get together and produce a apparatus like that green engine photo shown above !!
    I agree. Mack could just contract with a cab builder, plop them down on a complete chassis at the Macungie, Pennsylvania plant (where the trash packers, Visions and Granites are all built) and then ship them off to a body builder.........But Macungie is set up for mass production. We all know that there are three million fire bozos out there that would want customized this, customized that, dont want this tranny rather have that tranny, or a green one or a blue one, or yadda yadda yadda.....That would require a more custom oriented assembly line, which Mack is not interested in or able to do at this time........
    "Loyalty Above all Else. Except Honor."

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    Quote Originally Posted by FWDbuff View Post
    I agree. Mack could just contract with a cab builder, plop them down on a complete chassis at the Macungie, Pennsylvania plant (where the trash packers, Visions and Granites are all built) and then ship them off to a body builder.........But Macungie is set up for mass production. We all know that there are three million fire bozos out there that would want customized this, customized that, dont want this tranny rather have that tranny, or a green one or a blue one, or yadda yadda yadda.....That would require a more custom oriented assembly line, which Mack is not interested in or able to do at this time........
    There are a few companies around, Fontaine Modification Co. for one, that do just that. Most of the truck builders have one at or near their factories. Many of the modification companies have their facilities adjoining the factory. A purchaser wants something special that the factory doesn't do, or a onesey twosey that the production line can't accomodate. So the factory builds it standard or incomplete, it comes off the line and goes directly to Fontaine's (or whoever's) line. They do the special stuff. Nice part is, as long as the changes are factory approved, it maintains the factory warranty.

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    You would think that when a factory gets an order for a large number of identical vehicles, they would start them down the line one after another until the order was complete. But ten years ago I had the opportunity to visit the Mercedes-Benz truck factory in Worth, Germany, where my '71 Mercedes tractor had been built. I was amazed to watch and learn that in this day of computer and robotic control of production processes, it doesn't matter and it isn't done. They can build the trucks in any sequence at all, with any components that are requested and have been engineered in.

    Someone punches an order into a computer and the parts for that vehicle are automatically selected, picked and stage at the proper place on the assembly line, in the correct sequence. Bar codes are on every part. They're read and verified, then they go on the truck. Just-in-time deliveries of parts coming in from outside vendors are even loaded onto the delivery trucks in the correct sequence for use on the line.

    So if Mack, or anyone else really put their minds to it, they could do it. But for the stuff that can't be done in a production setting, there's always the Fontaines of the world.

  18. #18
    Forum Member FWDbuff's Avatar
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    True that. As much as I hate to admit it, I have walked the assembly line and have seen engines painted tan, red, and also a bright yellow color in the driveline rally area. I have also seen non-Mack transmissions......And Macungie is fully computerized. A potential buyer could very easily spec a full mack chassis **(with whatever engine/trans/drive combination they want) minus the cab, have it built and then shipped to a Fontaine-like outfit, have the cab plopped down, and then onto the body builder. I wonder if someone would want to engineer a fire cab to wrap around the new 600HP engine.....

    Hmmmmmm......"McToyne" sounds very nice!

    **(anyone who specs something other than a full Mack driveline should be bitch-slapped.)
    "Loyalty Above all Else. Except Honor."

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    Quote Originally Posted by WoodbridgeFFII View Post
    It would be great news if Mack trucks and someone else could get together and produce a apparatus like that green engine photo shown above !!
    Would it be? Someother company's truck with a Mack logo on it? No, that would be a discredit to the Mack name. I loved the Mack CF, and Mack/Baker Aerialscope, think they are among the best apparatus I ever rode. It would be like taking a Kia, and putting a BMW badge on it.

  20. #20
    Forum Member FiremanLyman's Avatar
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    http://www.hfd25.org/

    Go to thier apparatus page

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