1. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by ATFDFF View Post
    As I stated earlier, I have no problem with the BSA trying to shove their ethical principals on explorers of any type, but as it stands simply being involved in an Explorer program does NOT make you a Scout.
    By defiinition, yes, it does. Unfortunately, it apparently doesn't always make very good ones. Some just don't get it.

    What about the hundreds of female fire explorers across the nation?
    What about them? Scouting has had coed programs since the '70s.
    "Nemo Plus Voluptatis Quam Nos Habant"

    The Code is more what you'd call "guidelines" than actual rules.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DeputyMarshal View Post
    By defiinition, yes, it does. Unfortunately, it apparently doesn't always make very good ones. Some just don't get it.



    What about them? Scouting has had coed programs since the '70s.
    What do you mean not very good one....One day your going to open your mouth around the wrong person and they WILL put you in your place.

  3. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by ttexplorer48 View Post
    What do you mean not very good one....One day your going to open your mouth around the wrong person and they WILL put you in your place.
    Someone may try but it won't be some know-it-all kid with a poor attitude...
    "Nemo Plus Voluptatis Quam Nos Habant"

    The Code is more what you'd call "guidelines" than actual rules.

  4. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by ttexplorer48 View Post
    What do you mean not very good one....One day your going to open your mouth around the wrong person and they WILL put you in your place.
    With that poor attitude it will not be you. Shooting off your mouth at a MAN that has forgotten more about fire fighting that you will ever know. Way to good Jr.
    Stay Safe
    Bull


    Guys if you get hurt, well help you. If you get sick well treat you. If you want to bitch and moan, then all I can tell you is to flick the sand out of your slit, suck it up or get the hell out!
    - Capt. Marc Cox CFD

    Nothing in life is so exhilarating as to be shot at without result.
    -WINSTON CHURCHILL

  5. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeputyMarshal View Post
    Someone may try but it won't be some know-it-all kid with a poor attitude...
    DeputyMarshal, could you post a bit about your career? When you started, how long you've been in the fire service, what you're doing in the fire service now? Give him an idea of who he's talking to? Perhaps help him realize he should listen?

    ttexplorer48, learn from what he posts. I'm guessing he's been in the fire service longer than you've know what the fire service was. If he says you have allot to learn about something, you probably do. You'd be wise to listen - its the best way to make yourself more likely to get hired in the future.

    Just to give you an idea, the initial impression you've made on here is something along the lines of:
    -Cares more about how he looks while in the fire service than what he's doing or learning (by wanting matching turnouts when coveralls would be more practical)
    -Poor work ethic (not willing to put the time into writing out questions and replies properly)
    -Lack of respect (by your comments to DeputyMarshal)
    -No willingness to learn (by completely ignoring any suggestions of more practical alternative gear and saying fire fighting isn't about writing skills)
    -Quick to anger (by your comments to DeputyMarshal)

    You had stated that you had a good advantage over other potential employees, because of your education. This may be true, but you have a disadvantage because of the impression you give. You may be able to prepare for the oral interview and hide all of these things, but when you're doing the physical ability test, and someone makes a comment to you about not doing something properly, and you lash out at them, the employer is going to take note.

    Take the opportunity to learn, and improve the way you interact with others in the fire service. It'll help you way more than any certification will.

  6. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by grecko.1 View Post
    DeputyMarshal, could you post a bit about your career? When you started, how long you've been in the fire service, what you're doing in the fire service now? Give him an idea of who he's talking to? Perhaps help him realize he should listen?

    ttexplorer48, learn from what he posts. I'm guessing he's been in the fire service longer than you've know what the fire service was. If he says you have allot to learn about something, you probably do. You'd be wise to listen - its the best way to make yourself more likely to get hired in the future.

    Just to give you an idea, the initial impression you've made on here is something along the lines of:
    -Cares more about how he looks while in the fire service than what he's doing or learning (by wanting matching turnouts when coveralls would be more practical)
    -Poor work ethic (not willing to put the time into writing out questions and replies properly)
    -Lack of respect (by your comments to DeputyMarshal)
    -No willingness to learn (by completely ignoring any suggestions of more practical alternative gear and saying fire fighting isn't about writing skills)
    -Quick to anger (by your comments to DeputyMarshal)

    You had stated that you had a good advantage over other potential employees, because of your education. This may be true, but you have a disadvantage because of the impression you give. You may be able to prepare for the oral interview and hide all of these things, but when you're doing the physical ability test, and someone makes a comment to you about not doing something properly, and you lash out at them, the employer is going to take note.

    Take the opportunity to learn, and improve the way you interact with others in the fire service. It'll help you way more than any certification will.
    To answer the impressions that you have of my from my posts. I am a hard working individual, I am trying to better myself to be the best that I can be. I have respect for people. Everytime I walk by an adult its Morning sir/mam or afternoon sir/mam. Usually I am pretty calm but its when people say things that arnt true about me is when i become upset

  7. #32
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    ttexplorer48: You may not agree with what everyone here tells you. And it is ok to disagree and sometimes you might even be right. However you need to remember you talking to people who have earned respectful disagreement if any. Most of these guys were fighting fire when there still was fire and probably while you were still a wet dream. So ditch the attitude. If you disagree with something, explain why in a respectful manner and make an effort to do so correctly. This isn't text messaging your BFF or email with your friends. This is a professional forum of professional people. Act professional and you will be treated professionally.

    Everyone else:
    It isn't up to you on this forum to decide what appropriate explorer apparel is in his department. That's up to his department. But since you brought it up... Coveralls? In all my years, I have NEVER seen an explorer/junior program where explorers are issued coveralls instead of some form of gear. Coveralls are not adequate. They need some form of protective gear. from head to toe. Do you give your non-interior firefighters carharts to wear to calls? Probably not. Sure it doesn't need to be interior quality anymore. But coveralls aren't going to cut it. And in addition to it not being adequate, part of this whole program is learning to be ready when you're an adult firefighter. Gear accomplishes a big part of that.

    By the book, yes explorers are part of the BSA. However here in reality, they are about as far detached from scouting as you can be. Other than paying dues and utilizing the insurance, there is nothing that 99% of explorers do that will ever have anything to do with scouting. I know because I was in boy scouts, I was in explorers, I ran the explorer program before I moved, and I spend a lot of time looking at what other ones to do too. It just isn't reality. Yes, there are certain qualities like respect and integrity, but they aren't there because of boy scouts. They're there because they're necessary with or without scouting. The only difference between juniors and explorers is the spelling of the word and the person who writes the check for insurance payouts (over simplified, but making a point).

    He's enrolled in FF1, FF2, and EMT-B as a high school student. I'm pretty sure that qualifies as willing to learn and dedicated. Most teenagers would rather be smoking weed or getting drunk. Cut the kid some slack, he's not some idiot that wants everything handed to him. He's putting in more effort at his age than most adults in the fire service do twice his age. Kick his *** in the right direction rather than just kicking his ***. It is much more effective.
    Even the burger-flippers at McDonald's probably have some McWackers.

  8. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by ttexplorer48 View Post
    To answer the impressions that you have of my from my posts. I am a hard working individual, I am trying to better myself to be the best that I can be. I have respect for people. Everytime I walk by an adult its Morning sir/mam or afternoon sir/mam. Usually I am pretty calm but its when people say things that arnt true about me is when i become upset
    I was brought up under the philosophy that you are what you write. You write the same way you think. You write the way you speak. The use of words and understanding their meaning is one of the keys to success. There are few things more important than the proper use of grammer when trying to improve yourself. You are very much judged by your words and your command of language.

    Of course, everything is relevant.

    Your use of words is not as critical if you are applying at McDonalds. You just need the ability to say "do you want fries with that?"

    If you want to be a firefighter, the use of words becomes important. Promotions and advancement somewhat depend on your ability to write reports or analysis in a clear, consise and factual manner. If you cannot construct a sentence with proper spelling and grammer, you have limited your chances of going anywhere.

    The anger and general attitude, coupled with the "I'm special" is disappointing. You are your own worst enemy. We choose to become better because we recognize our shortcomings. We strive to be the best we can be because someone may be depending on us. We do not do this for ourselves. It does not mean we are special.

    And finally, you must remember that this forum is read by thousands of firefighters. Many are in the position to hire and fire. You must remember that the hand you bite today, may serve you for dinner tomorrow. In other words, some of us see new people that have the desire to be firefighters on a daily basis. We have a duty to enlist the best that we can find. It is not always about how much stuff is under their belt.

    Most of the time, I'm going for the best well-rounded individual possible. I don't hire the guys that tell me how special they are or the guys that try to wow me with paper. While it may show dedication or the ability to follow-through, the whole person is what I am interested in. I have never seen a fire that a piece of paper could extinguish. Anger doesn't solve issues, and attitudes may kill my people. The special ones never touch my apparatus let alone walk on the fireground.

    It is not my intent to attack you, or even cause you an issue. I sincerely hope you achieve your dream. I do question your reasons or motivation. You began this topic with a purpose. You have let it stray away from that noble purpose only to reveal that you need to wake up and take care of some issues. This is not necessarily a kiss of death for you, it simply means you need to work on a few things. You brought much of the displeasure on yourself. Could this be a sign of needing to mature a bit more? Quite possibly.

    Please take my advice and listen to the guys that have been around a while. Don't try to impress them with what you wish to do. We all started the same way, the desire to be a firefighter.

    A suggestion... abandon the current profile in this forum. Create a new one and start over with a new beginning. Just be careful to not repeat the mistakes or reveal anything that links the past with the new. You might be surprised how much knowledge you may gain.
    HAVE PLAN.............WILL TRAVEL

  9. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by notfruitybutloopy View Post
    My expolorer gear sucks as well, it's falling apart and is duct taped together. Hopefully we'll get some new gear soon... I wonder if I can purchase my own and use it...
    It's kind of expensive.You don't belong to a Post that allows you to go inside on actual calls,do you?I've only heard of a few that did that.My old department never let our Explorers do more the go-fer tools which they had to hand over before getting anywhere near the hot zone for any operation we were conducting.
    Not every department has a policy of keeping you safe while learning about firefighting along with the other skills taught by the Explorer program.

  10. #35
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    Default This is an essay that I had to write to become an Lieutenant in our Fire class

    Im Joe DeLong, and I would appreciate the opportunity to serve Charlie class as a lieutenant. As many are aware Im on the Troy Twp. Fire Explorers. There I serve as the captain and I also hold the position of president of the Troy Twp Fire Explores. In my previous years of high school I was a boy scout, but when I started to learn about the opportunities to serve and protect the community by becoming a firefighter/ EMT I fell in love with the career. This is why I came to Penta, to continue my education and to better myself. In the future I will go above and beyond to become a Chief of a Career Fire dept.

    As many people are aware the position of lieutenant is taken seriously. You need to be able to control yourself and your actions to be the best you can be. As captain of the Troy Twp Fire Explorers I have been put through some very stressful situations, and due to these stressful situations I have learned to control myself and my actions. I also volunteer in the community when I am free. I think a leader should be someone to look up to, someone that you can trust, and someone who will do the right thing and do it the right way when nobody is looking. It is easy for people to do the right thing when people are watching you, but when their backs are turned they should still perform their duties as everyone in the world was watching. A leader should also be willing to go beyond his duties to make sure everything is okay. They should always be on time and always be reliable. A good officer should ask his/ her crews what the crew needs help with, not telling other people to do it. An officer needs to be good with delegating authority. Lastly, an officer needs to know his crews skills so he can place them where it will help him most completing the tasks at hand.

    I possess these skills because I am hard working and reliable, every time that I am needed it is very hard for me to say no. I always try to do the right thing even when everyone has their back turned. An example of this is for our explorer post. Every time that we would use a truck or piece of equipment it would get cleaned and put back and be in better condition than what we found it in. Most people would just rinse the truck off but I scrub it whether it needs it or not. Many times I have stayed at the station after most of the firefighters have gone home after a run and washed the trucks they took out. I am good at delegation of authority, an example of this would be for a structure fire I would put a experienced firefighter on attack and put an less experienced guy with him so he can learn while perform his duties. I treat people as if they were my actual brothers and sisters. I have their back no matter what. If I see that someone is struggling with a task then I do whatever I can to help them out anyway possible.

    I feel I am the best candidate for lieutenant because I feel I possess the skills that are required for this officer position. If I receive the position of lieutenant I can promise you that I will not let you down.

  11. #36
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    I was just curious of what everyone thought of my essay.

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    Quote Originally Posted by notfruitybutloopy View Post
    I know how much it casts mate, I looked it up when I was ten lol. We can activly participate at a car fire as long as we have parent okay and it's during a meeting. But TBH I've had to skip a bunch of them because of real like paid work.


    IF you are in Virginia and an explorer and are allowed to work car fires or any other fires, I sure would like to know more.

    Send me a PM with all the details, department, when and where, dates, etc.





    ttexplorer48 - if things in these forums upset and bother you, you are going to have a very hard time in a fire house, once the members find out how thin skin you are.
    Stay Safe and Well Out There....

    Always remembering 9-11-2001 and 343+ Brothers

  13. #38
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    OK, GETTING BACK ON THE SUBJECT OF GEAR... NOT GRAMMAR (although I do agree it is very important)...

    For those of you saying that the explorers do not need fire gear:
    If insurance companies and SOPs require the actual firefighters to use full gear during trainings (WHICH EXPLORERS DO PARTICIPATE IN) then shouldn't explorers be required to wear full gear? YES. For most pump operations, which most explorers are allowed to participate in, most fire departments require at LEAST bunker pants, fire boots, fire/extrication gloves, and a fire helmet. So if you have an explorer doing pump operations for a training, they need to have fire gear.

    Now, my department does not have any we can donate, but this is how we got our DONATED GEAR (yes our gear was donated):

    Make a flier explaining what you need and why. List some things your explorers are legally allowed to do that would require gear. Print 50-100 of the fliers and send them to every department you can think of, even if your department doesn't associate with them. A good idea would be to have your Chief sign the fliers, and attach his (or your explorer advisor's) email address. Chances are you will get more than what you need.

    GOOD LUCK!
    Explorer Assistant Chief Alisha Fern

    Leadership: The ability to guide, direct, and influence others.

    Leadership can be thought of as a capacity to define oneself to others in a way that clarifies and expands a vision of the future.


    alisha.fern@firehousemail.com

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    I like you, your funny!. I struggle with this every day and if you want to be something so should you.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ttexplorer48 View Post
    Also to be a good firefighter doesn't mean to have good grammer it means to be the best you can and love the job you do.
    That's incorrect. Good spelling and grammar (not to mention good grades across the board) are VITAL to being a good firefighter.

    It shows thinking ability and self respect, among other things. Stuff that CAN'T be taught.
    Pete

  16. #41
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    Everything we do is in the eye of the public and we need to act, speak and look professional. How you present yourself in the public is a direct reflection on your department and I am sure they all appreciate a good public opinion. We do write LEGAL reports that can be called to court and when you get called as the writer of the report and they make you look like a fool on the stand for how you wrote your report it does not go well. Not that any of us aim for that, but sometimes we all get lazy after a many hour call in the early hours of the morning with lots of personnel and water flowed and many things going on that all need to be recorded and reported. Just keep all that in mind.

    As for the gear, it is hard in this economy for a department to justify getting new gear for many members let alone the explorers. I do feel that explorers need full turnout gear since they should be training right along with the rest of us and doing that in coveralls does not do justice. We have our recruits in the gear that has been passed down from when we could afford new gear and not all of it matches and some is a little wore out too. It is hard and I understand the frustration for not looking like the rest of the department.

    Some suggestions would be check with local departments if they have any gear they could donate since it will be served at least somewhat near by. I would follow Explorer Asst Chief Fern advice and make fliers for them to be passed out as it looks like you are taking the time and is more professional than just swinging by and asking for handouts.

    Good luck to you and take some advice from these fellas here that have a lot of time and experience in this profession. Sometimes the officers giving the interviews may seem to be grumpy tough skinned individuals that you will have to deal with and treat respectfully regardless of what they say to you.

  17. #42
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    Angry New Gear and Juniors

    1. Explorers/JRs will not be conducting any operations in the hot zone, just ask RS1606, nor will they be experiencing any life threatening situations outside of training scenarios.

    2. LKQVFD499, when stating the safety of donated gear will not be up to par, why not have the Explorers conduct a gear inspection, afterall it is a hands-on skill.

    3. The more sweat any Explorer or Junior puts into learning a new skill will serve them better on fireground operations and even stay with them throughout their fire service career.

    4. Why spend precious resources on buying Explorers/JRs new gear when there are line firefighters who need gear more than them? Firefighters know how take care of new gear, Explorers/JRs might destroy them on the first day of receiving the gear.

  18. #43
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    Juniors here are issued the same PPE as firefighters, right down to the Nomex hood.

    As a rule, they do not receive new gear, but the gear they are issued have passed inspection and have no holes, rips, tares or any other defect that would create a safety issue.

    Basically, if we wouldn't issue it to a firefighter, it's not issued to a junior.

    Our juniors are allowed to participate in live fire training, including burn house fires, and are often tasked to conduct overhaul at structural and vehicle incidents under the supervision of an officer or senior member as preparation for full duty at age 18. To issue them gear not up to the task would not be providing them with the protection they deserve.

    There have been situations where juniors have received new gear. Generally, if they have been active, and have achieved a high level of training, we will purchase and issue new gear when they get within 6-8 months of turning 18.

    It's one way of letting them know that you beleive they are ready and prepared to take the next step in the fire service.

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    Quote Originally Posted by FIREguy2011 View Post
    1. Explorers/JRs will not be conducting any Explorers/JRs might destroy them on the first day of receiving the gear.
    Thats pretty hard to do.

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    Quote Originally Posted by stevetc99 View Post
    Thats pretty hard to do.
    but possible if I might add.
    Benton Fire District Four
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    When things get rough, just say:
    Acabo de perder cinco minutos de su vida.

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