1. #1
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    Default Cardiac Monitors- Which is best?

    I am looking for information regarding the Philips MRx monitor/defibrillator. Our department has secured funding to buy approximately 20 of these. We are looking at the Philips, Zoll and Physio monitors. We currently have Physio monitors. I want to know about the durability of the Philips monitor. We are a large urban department of 500 firefighters and we take 50,000 calls a year, 80% being EMS. If anyone has any information about any of the monitors, please let me know. Thanks!

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    I have looked at several brands in the last year. I have only used Physio, so I am little biased. However, I have done a fair amount of research. The biggest selling point to stay with Physio, which we did, was the capacitor. If the AHA changes their recommendations, like they always do. Then the Physio could potentially be the only one that is easily changed. The capacitors on the Zoll and Phillips can only charge to a max of 200 joules. The Physio can still go to 360. This could be a huge issue should they change the standards and require the higher energy delivery. Other than that, they are all pretty much user preferences after that.
    Jason Brooks
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    That's a good point. I need to do some research regarding the 150j vs stacked shocks. The other thing that I am concerned about with the Philips is the durability. We have Lifepak 10's still around that work fine. Although they don't have 12 lead capability, they still function like they did when they were purchased. I think we should buy something that is going to last and be easily updated.

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    Default MRx

    We have been using MRx's for six years with no issues, just purchased new ones. Not real high volume but around 10,000 ems. All fire based EMS in our area uses Philips, Great service from Philips. Private ambo just purchased Lifepaks no comparison just ask them which one they would prefer. The 360 issue is the only thing Physio is hanging their hat on, one obscure study from Europe with a small control group..something like 10 pts. Just follow manufactures guidelines what ever the tech and you will be fine for now and in the future.

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    The Philips and Zoll monitors charge to 200J for Biphasic shocks, the Physio charges to 360J for Monophasic. Do you guys know the difference between the two? Kind of a big deal.


    I use the Zoll E-Series at my full-time EMS job, the Philips MRx at my part-time job, and used the Lifepak 12 a few years ago at my volunteer squad. I'm probably biased, but I do like the E-Series most of the three. I like the generally leaner shape of the E-Series, it's much more comfortable to carry with the shoulder strap than the weird-shaped MRx. Fully-loaded, it's a little heavier than the MRx, but not by much. I do like the MRx though for the fact that I can view 4-5 different rhythms/waveforms at a time, and all 12 leads without actually printing the 12-lead.


    A nearby Fire Department ( a little bigger than your's call volume) just purchased the MRx for all of its apparatus a couple years ago. I know the guy that lead up the committee on deciding which monitor to go with, and he was very thorough with his assessment of it; weight, size, ease of use, optional upgrades/attachments. They tested all three main suppliers through all 15 line apparatus crews, and the vote ended up coming up with MRx. They're a BLS Non-transport agency. I think the Defibrillator option is pretty awesome for those that aren't trained on how to actually shock and still want to have a cardiac monitor.


    Although I do like the built-in Carbon Monoxide detector on the Lifepak 15s

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    Quote Originally Posted by FFMedic31 View Post
    The Philips and Zoll monitors charge to 200J for Biphasic shocks, the Physio charges to 360J for Monophasic. Do you guys know the difference between the two? Kind of a big deal.
    :
    The Physio's shock at 360 for biphasic as well. I think you need to do some research here.
    Jason Brooks
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    Touche, sir. I'm rusty on my Physio knowledge I guess. Thanks for correcting me.

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    Life Star ambulance uses the Phillips monitors. Miramontes could get you in touch with somebody to get their opinions of it.
    "The quality of a person's life is in direct proportion to their commitment to excellence, regardless of their chosen field of endeavor." - Vince Lombardi

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    Quote Originally Posted by jbrescue View Post
    The Physio's shock at 360 for biphasic as well. I think you need to do some research here.
    Corretct, but it is the amps not the joules you need to worry about.

    We are in the process of buying new monitors. From what we have been shown, the zoll is the only one that delivers the correct amount of amps per pt. I have used all three moitors and there is not much diffrence in any of them.
    FF/Paramedic

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    The best monitor for you is the one that is easiest or most familiar for you to use. All perform to standards or the FDA wouldn't allow them on the market. I have used Physio, Phillips and Zolls over the years and I'm just more used to the Lifepaks so that is what I prefer. We currently use the LP-15's which perform with no problem and are set up just like the 12's so the transition is brainless.
    If your going to cry about doing the job you signed up for do us all a favor and quit, there are plenty of dedicated people standing in line for the best job in the world.

    Firefighter/Paramedic

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    Default Cardiac Monitors

    You all make good points. I agree that all 3 would be options and there seems to be only subtle differences between all of them.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TNFF319 View Post
    Corretct, but it is the amps not the joules you need to worry about.
    What? Explain.

    Quote Originally Posted by TNFF319 View Post
    We are in the process of buying new monitors. From what we have been shown, the zoll is the only one that delivers the correct amount of amps per pt.
    Sounds like a sales pitch to me. All monitors capable of defibrillation are FDA approved medical devices and as such must meet strict guidelines. If a Lifepak doesn't deliver the "correct amount of amps per pt" than it would be a defective device and Medtronic would be subject to some serious liability.

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    Whichever one pays the best....

    We have the Philips MRx here in Memphis and have had them for a little over a year. They work very well and have proven to be pretty durable.
    FTM-PTB

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    Just got the new LifePak 15's with BP, ETCO2, 12 lead.....Nice monitor the only disadvantage so far, is the battery is the only power source there is no AC plug made for them yet. Not a big deal now but as the batteries age may be a problem.

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    Along this line - I am donating an AED to our local school. I have been looking for a refurb Lifepak 500, if for no other reason that is what all the Fire Departments in the area use, our trainer is a Lifepak 500 trainer, etc.

    Best price I find for a biphasic is around 600, (and even then some of the dealers advertising don't appear to have in stock what they advertise)

    Any good sources?

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    I am on a small vol dept but the guy that we put in charge to get our de fib was a full time EMT P in the Twin Cities for about 20 years. He has seen and tried them all and he not only chose the ZOLL for us but also for the dept he runs.

    This is a VERY easy machine to use, faxing 12 leads, pacing, shocking, and on and on. I have no trouble teaching any of this to my members. We use ZOLL E series in both our Ambulances and will untill for at least as long as I am on. Keep in mind also, the resale on the machine you will get, if like us we keep them for only a few years as they do out date fairly fast. Yes there are updates but there is some things you cant update.

    We just got a C PAC making CPR a breaze no matter how ruff the road. Maybe you could get both and strike a deal. Oh for those who dont know C PAC is a automatic CPR machine.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LVFD301 View Post
    Along this line - I am donating an AED to our local school. I have been looking for a refurb Lifepak 500, if for no other reason that is what all the Fire Departments in the area use, our trainer is a Lifepak 500 trainer, etc.

    Best price I find for a biphasic is around 600, (and even then some of the dealers advertising don't appear to have in stock what they advertise)

    Any good sources?
    I'm a Physio-Control distributor and I extend a 15% discount to firefighter/ambulance professionals. Just use the coupon code EMS in our online catalog. Or message me directly.

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    Don't know if you have purchased yet or not but thought I'd give you another side of the MRx. We have had these for almost 3 years now and since we got them we have been less than impressed. We have 17 ALS Ambulances and only 1 Engine that is ALS these trucks run about 36,000 medical/MVC calls a year.

    We switched from the LifePak 12 to the Phillips and have found them to be less durable. We break the printer every once in a while, lots of little crevices where blood and other gunk can collect.

    Other issues are with obtaining 12-leads, we have lots of artifact and tend not to get as clear of a printout as we did with the old LP 12's. The full-size color screen is nice however. The paper is shorter in height as well causing everything to be pushed together more.

    Another on-going problem we have had was the temperature probe that comes from Phillips, the tympanic temp probe was incredibly innaccurate, its average reading was in the 87 degree range. The oral/rectal temp probe was slightly better aaveraging in the low 90's when used. We tried different probes, updating the software, everything we could working with the rep and could never solve the issue.

    The pulse ox probe looks nice in theory but doesn't fit well on people with big hands. The pediatric pulse ox probe is retarded, just a downsized adult probe, I much preferred the tape on pulse ox probes from Physio.

    We have problems with the case as well, it is held to the monitor by velcro straps that are about 1"x1", that's not a lot of contact space and they are always coming un-done. A few other straps are about 2 inches long but only a quarter inch wide, never stays velcroed so we have resulted to taping over the velcro, real nice.

    Overall as a service we are not pleased with them and considering the issues they don't give us anything our old LP 12's couldn't have been upgraded to give (LP 12's were monophasic, no NiBP, and no EtCO2). All in all we wish we had gone a different route.

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    lifepak is my favorite

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    Default Zoll X-Series

    Just released a couple months ago, but based off the very popular Air Medical verison the ProPaq MD. Smaller than all other monitors with more capabilities than them all. Check it out, I'm impressed!
    http://www.zoll.com/medical-products...tors/x-series/

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