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Thread: Where is IAFF?

  1. #21
    55 Years & Still Rolling hwoods's Avatar
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    Post And........

    Fuss, and a couple of others: While I don't disagree with your point about Experience and Training. Departments down this way have no interest at all in your experience and Training, since when you are hired, you go to the Academy. Period. A couple of years ago, a friend of mine left one County FD after 4 or 5 Years to accept a Job with another. He started all over at the Bottom. Again. County Departments like we have are large enough to be able to Pay a Firefighter while they go thru the Academy, so they do. The thought behind this is that by Training someone to do it "your" way, they will always do things right and fit right in with everyone else. In Practice, this theory leaves a bit to be desired though..........

    (BTW, there are only 5 "City" Departments in the entire State of Maryland, in Baltimore, Hagerstown, Cumberland, Annapolis, and Salisbury. Every other Department is either County or Independent VFDs........
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  2. #22
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    The problem is that different cities aren't like different GM plants. Does the UAW go up to Ford saying hey we have these 20 GM guys, hire them? As far as I know they don't.

    The problem is the civil service laws of 50 states, 1 federal district, and a thousands of county and muncipalities. Maybe the IAFF could provide a list of recently laid of guys to be made available to departments, but anything else would be throwing time and money down a pit. The IAFF is international too, can I transfer from the US to Canada or vice versa?

  3. #23
    Forum Member snowball's Avatar
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    Out in California, Alameda City did a neat thing a few months ago. They were in need of a few bodies so the only applications that were allowed were from laid off FF's. You had to have a letter from the department that you were laid off from as proof to qualify to take their exam.
    IAFF

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    That's what I like to hear snowball, helping brothers first!

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    Quote Originally Posted by big_leauges View Post
    BW, the town I was in basically just gave the cops $500 a year to go PSO. And the clowns they are, they agreed. Next year 4 more firefighters will get laid off. One is 47y/o with 15 years exp, and another is 52, and could run circles around most 20 year olds. These guys deserve another, a better shot, and continuing their careers.
    I dont disagree with you brother, infact I feel like most new recruits in the fire service have a "I learned everything I need to know in class" attitude. I'd personally rather work with a brother that has experience.

    What kind of union were you a member of? Anymore It seems like most locals talk big and act like they are tough as nails but when it comes down to it they usually stand by and let people get laid off.

    I'll keep my eyes open for any laterals I see...

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    BW, I was/am part of the IAFF. .
    Last edited by big_leauges; 03-28-2011 at 06:20 PM.

  7. #27
    Forum Member MemphisE34a's Avatar
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    BigLeagues,

    What is your Local doing? The IAFF has secured programs and stimulus money to hire back laid off firefighters IF they are solicited for help.

    There is no one in Washington who goes around looking for laid off firefighters.

    Off coarse your Governor could refuse the funds.
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  8. #28
    Forum Member nyckftbl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fire49 View Post
    This has been s problem with the fire service for a long time , if you wanted to move yo a different city or state ,you had to start all over again

    Its the exact opposite of a problem.
    Proud East Coast Traditionalist.

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by BW21 View Post
    What kind of union were you a member of? Anymore It seems like most locals talk big and act like they are tough as nails but when it comes down to it they usually stand by and let people get laid off.

    I'll keep my eyes open for any laterals I see...
    What exactly is it that you expect theese locals to do?

    Big Leauges...i sympathize with your plight. However the IAFF can't trump civil service laws.

    Have you considered relocating? There are departments out there hiring now. Take a look at Austin, TX, they are taking laterals in 2011.

    http://www.ci.austin.tx.us/fire/recruitment/

    I hope I am never faced with your situation and truly sympathize with you and your family. Good luck.
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  10. #30
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    I'm not sure that some of you understand what the IAFF can and can't do.
    Extreme example: if a town decides to reduce their funding of the fire department by 50% their is nothing the IAFF can do. That chief is faced with a few options, lay offs, reduce everyones pay against the contract, stop paying benefits against the contract. So let's say they lay off 40% of the work force and freeze everyones salary, what can the IAFF do? ... Nothing. Sure you could go to arbitration and may even win, but the town doesn't have the money, so aside from a few lawyers getting paid what happens... no one gets rehired. When the town does need more bodies they get hired back per the local's rules.
    In many cases towns are hurting real bad use the money guys at the IAFF to look at the books, if the town is legitimately hurting and fairly spreads the cuts then nothing can be done about it.
    I've had friends in other towns get layed off, it blows, no doubt about it. But in those cases no one has been hired to replace them so the union can't do anything. We can't strike, in many places slowdowns and blue flu is prohibited by laws. The union does great things but really can't do anything in this case.

    As for the hire process in other towns the IAFF is also not able to do anything. A town can set what ever criteria for hire that they want. Some want medics, some want medics and certified firefighters some want people with college, some want people just out of HS. The union has no say over this. I can see both sides of this. I can take a group of firefighters who never worked with me, put them on an engine and get the job done. Some towns would like guys with no knowledge and teach them their way only. I went to the academy with a guy who had close to 10 years in the volunteers, he was a great fireman who had to go to the academy again because that is what his department wanted.

    Good luck finding a place to continue your trade, I wish you the best of luck, just don't look toward the union to help, you'll end up disappointed.

  11. #31
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    Yes Monty, I did see about Austin, and it looks exciting. I
    Last edited by big_leauges; 03-28-2011 at 06:21 PM.

  12. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by nyckftbl View Post
    Its the exact opposite of a problem.
    I sort of used the analogy of a marriage.

    One is married to one's department for better or worse. When there is a divorce, you can't just pick up where you left off with the next spouse. You start all over again.
    Politics is like driving. To go forward select "D", to go backward select "R."

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    I'm not sure that some of you understand what the IAFF can and can't do...
    I totally agree that the IAFF and the locals have little effect on local decisions, requirements, et al.

    I would suggest, however, that the IAFF could become an advocate for consistant hiring practices and lateral opportunities such as the OP suggests, and perhaps even offering up a clearinghouse for available positions (I'm not in IAFF - maybe they do already).

    On the flip side - I would actually expect resistance from some locals on this - they'd prefer to hire and promote "local" talent.

    Last I knew, the IAFF was pretty much nation-wide. They certainly would be in a position to do something of that sort.
    Opinions my own. Standard disclaimers apply.

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  14. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by big_leauges View Post
    Yes Monty, I did see about Austin, and it looks exciting. I have tested in 7 states in the last 4 months, so I have been racking up miles on my car. But thats me. One of the guys laid off with me has 3 kids and is divorced, so he cant move. Again, he is a great firefighter and he will probably never get another job.

    It's frustrating because I do truly understand why you guys are saying the IAFF can't help. Civil service is what it is. Like I said , it would be a long process. The best hope I can see right now is Chiefs or guys doing interviews and hires realize this is a crisis and try to help in the hiring process. I still think a national list would be the best option. But until then, but let's not forget these guys.
    A national list? Explain to me why you should be able to move to Memphis for example and have seniority over guys who were hired here before you? Firefighters nationwide should not be penalized for your local financial problem.
    FTM-PTB

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    Hey big_leagues

    Right now sacramento ca is accepting applications for later ff/medic.

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    Just put Sacramento app in, looks great.
    Last edited by big_leauges; 03-28-2011 at 06:22 PM.

  17. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by big_leauges View Post
    ...proven liability ...
    I don't think this means what you mean to mean.
    Logic and proportion have fallen sloppy dead.

  18. #38
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    Default seniority layoff

    My question is this; Why are the senior FF with 20+ yrs the ones being laid off. Does your contract not have wording in it to protect seniority. And lay off from the bottom up.

    Where i work and in my contract if there were to be lay offs they would start with the least senior employee and go up. That way you wouldnt end up in the situation where you are where a guy who is say 45 yrs old may never get a job again, where the new guy who has a a year on and is 20 yrs old still has a future somewhere else.

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