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  1. #1
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    Default Navy Fire Department Info

    I am looking to get some more information from Navy Firefighters.

    Recently started work as a Civilian on NAS Jax in a business setting. However I have over 10yrs FF experience, career and on-call. Left the FF Service to finish college, would love to get back into FF however the cost of testing/travel prohibited me from trying to get back into a career dept.

    I have been debating in applying for a Firefighter position with the Navy. I was wondering about the promotion opps, and the shift schedules. I have a good feeling that the Fire Dept doesn't offer such a lucrative position that I am in now, (in an intern program so GS 07 this yr, GS 09 next, and GS 11 by the end of my 2nd yr).

    Firefighting is in my blood, and it is eatingme up inside not being able to do it.


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    Quote Originally Posted by LRMark26 View Post
    I am looking to get some more information from Navy Firefighters.

    Recently started work as a Civilian on NAS Jax in a business setting. However I have over 10yrs FF experience, career and on-call. Left the FF Service to finish college, would love to get back into FF however the cost of testing/travel prohibited me from trying to get back into a career dept.

    I have been debating in applying for a Firefighter position with the Navy. I was wondering about the promotion opps, and the shift schedules. I have a good feeling that the Fire Dept doesn't offer such a lucrative position that I am in now, (in an intern program so GS 07 this yr, GS 09 next, and GS 11 by the end of my 2nd yr).

    Firefighting is in my blood, and it is eatingme up inside not being able to do it.
    Well, just for your reference in case you think you got a cushy job right now: A GS-7 step 1 Firefighter on a 72/hr work week (which is what the entire DoD FES does) makes $59,633.50 annually ($52,678.08 is used for retirement/life insurance calculations--but that has been proposed to be changed with HR 3186). A GS-11 on a 40 hour work week makes $57,408 annually. Those are both with "rest of US" locality calculations. Not to mention that firefighters are under the special retirement provision meaning your pension portion of your retirement is 1.7% of your high 3 up to 20 years of federal service and 1% for each year after, whereas every other DoD employee under FERS is only 1% across the board (with the exception of ATCs, cops, and nuclear couriers). I make just under what a GS-12 makes and have been in the federal service for 2 years.

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    How old are you??

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    Shridden

    How does the ff gs 7 , 72 hr 59,000 work out per hour vs gs 11, 40 hour, 57,000 ?????

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    A GS-7 Step 1 federal firefighter works a 144 hour pay period (72/hr week). For 106hrs, they recieve $14.07 (FF hourly rate) and for 38hrs, they recieve FF OT rate which is $21.11. That calculates out to $2,293.60 a pay period. Calcuate that by 26 pay periods in a year and that would be an annual salary of $59,633.60.

    A GS-11 Step 1 non-firefighter federal employee makes $27.51 an hour for 80 hours a pay period (40 hour work week). That calculates out to $2200.80 a pay period and gives an annual salary of $57,220.80... which curiously enough is less than OPM's published pay charts of $57,408.00. Whatever, you get the point though.

    Federal firefighters make significantly less per hour than other GS employees. We have firefighter base pay versus GS true pay. My GS-7 counterparts make $18.59 an hour versus my $14.07. Imagine how much federal firefighters would be getting paid if they went off of true GS pay.

    My pay period salary, with true GS pay, would be $3030.17 which would give me an annual salary of $78,784.42... for a firefighter (Hazmat Tech/BLS). Most department's use GS-7 as bottom level entry firefighter (there are exceptions). Imagine doing GS-8, GS-10, GS-13 firefighter pay calculations based off of true GS pay.

    At larger departments, GS-11 is an Assistant Chief. As it stands, A GS-11 step 1 Operations Assistant Chief makes $88,282.48 annually. If we were to give them salary based off of true GS pay, they would be making $116,587.38 annually. This is all based off of "REST OF US" locality pay which is 14.16%. Imagine if that same A/C were working in San Diego or Los Angles on true GS pay.

    http://www.dodfire.com/pay/2010_Fire...ay_Program.xls
    Last edited by ShredddinCali; 11-11-2010 at 04:48 PM. Reason: Corrections

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    So if you take 26 pay periods x 144 hours = 3744 hours

    And if you take say $58,000 / 3744 it equals $15.50 an hour???


    Not good at math

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    Quote Originally Posted by fire49 View Post
    So if you take 26 pay periods x 144 hours = 3744 hours

    And if you take say $58,000 / 3744 it equals $15.50 an hour???


    Not good at math
    Your math is correct, what's your question?

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    Quote Originally Posted by fire49 View Post
    How old are you??
    I'm 29.....

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    Quote Originally Posted by LRMark26 View Post
    I'm 29.....
    DoD federal civilian are capped at age 37 for entry in to the DoD FES, mainly because under our retirement provisions, there is a mandatory retirement age of 57 and you must have 20 years of service to retire.

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    Thanks Sherddin! I just pulled up the FF Pay schedule, didn't realize there was a different one. Makes me feel better about applying now, and if I am lucky enough, better at making the decision to change back to firefighting. Or at least will make it easier to sell to the wife.

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    Quote Originally Posted by fire49 View Post
    Shridden

    How does the ff gs 7 , 72 hr 59,000 work out per hour vs gs 11, 40 hour, 57,000 ?????
    If you have never been a Federal Firefighter, you wouldn't understand. It's very difficult to explain. We do not get paid the true hourly rates as posted in federal pay tables.

    In "laymans terms", think of it this way.....The first 8 (of your 24) hour shift is called "work time" and you get paid your full "hourly" rate. The second 8 hours are called "stand by time" and you get paid approx. 2/3rds of the full hourly rate. The third 8 hours are called "scheduled sleep time" and you get paid approx 1/3rd of the full hourly rate. No you don't get paid the full "work" rate if you get up in the middle of the night for a run. Thats just the way it is.

    Also, other factors are worked in- You get paid extra if the facility you work at has things like explosives, high rise buildings, bulk fuel depots, airfield, ships, chemical weapon depots, etc. You also get a locality pay depending on where you work; the more expensive it is to live there, the more you get. That's why a GS7, Step 4 D/O in Philadelphia may get paid more than someone of the same rate working at......Mountain Home AFB, just as an example.

    Does anyone have a copy of the Federal FF's pay cheat sheet published by the IAFF???? I have one from 2005 somewhere.......
    "Loyalty Above all Else. Except Honor."

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    Quote Originally Posted by LRMark26 View Post
    Thanks Sherddin! I just pulled up the FF Pay schedule, didn't realize there was a different one. Makes me feel better about applying now, and if I am lucky enough, better at making the decision to change back to firefighting. Or at least will make it easier to sell to the wife.
    The pay chart is by no means an official DFAS or OPM publication but the guy who makes it is a very smart dude and it's pretty accurate. I've never seen any discrepancies on his calculations vs what people are making.

    To answer your original question, promotion potential is based on how young the dept is and how the hiring authority wants to hire; internally or externally. Shift schedules vary by dept. If you go to the dodfire.com forum, you'll see several threads on shift schedules and you can get an idea of what navy regions are doing what schedule.

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    Quote Originally Posted by FWDbuff View Post
    Also, other factors are worked in- You get paid extra if the facility you work at has things like explosives, high rise buildings, bulk fuel depots, airfield, ships, chemical weapon depots, etc.
    Not to sounds like an @$$ but could you cite your sources on that. I have never heard or seen anything that gives you extra money based on the type of mission your base/post/NAS has.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ShredddinCali View Post
    Not to sounds like an @$$ but could you cite your sources on that. I have never heard or seen anything that gives you extra money based on the type of mission your base/post/NAS has.
    It's in the Chinese Overtime money, I wouldn't even begin to know where to look, thats why I was asking if anyone had the IAFF Cheat Sheet.

    When I was assigned to the Phila Naval Shipyard, we got extra pay for shipboard FF'ing and bulk fuel depot.

    When I was at Aberdeen, we got it all- bulk explosives/weapons storage, fuel depot, chemical weapons, airfield, etc.........I'll ask a guy on FB who knows the pay system pretty well.
    "Loyalty Above all Else. Except Honor."

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    Quote Originally Posted by FWDbuff View Post
    It's in the Chinese Overtime money, I wouldn't even begin to know where to look, thats why I was asking if anyone had the IAFF Cheat Sheet.

    When I was assigned to the Phila Naval Shipyard, we got extra pay for shipboard FF'ing and bulk fuel depot.

    When I was at Aberdeen, we got it all- bulk explosives/weapons storage, fuel depot, chemical weapons, airfield, etc.........I'll ask a guy on FB who knows the pay system pretty well.
    please let me know because i am quite curious. is this a strickly navy thing? i suppose it could go under special pay incentives.

    this could be a huge deal if there are special pays available that firefighters aren't getting compensated for... not that we don't make enough money anyways...

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    Ok, I was wrong, but sort of right.

    There is no "extra" compensation in your pay for these hazards. However, if you are assigned to a post with these hazards, there is a provision within DOD regs that allows them to bump up your GS rating. Fully qualified FF's at my last post were GS-7's.
    "Loyalty Above all Else. Except Honor."

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    Quote Originally Posted by FWDbuff View Post
    Ok, I was wrong, but sort of right.

    There is no "extra" compensation in your pay for these hazards. However, if you are assigned to a post with these hazards, there is a provision within DOD regs that allows them to bump up your GS rating. Fully qualified FF's at my last post were GS-7's.
    That makes sense as more responsibilities and hazards warrent higher pay grades. Thats how we can have GS-11 or 12 Fire Chiefs at some installations and GS-13 or 14s at others. Thanks for the info.

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