Was looking to see what kind of diffrent practices everyone here has for doing a raise or lower from a window ie: you have to make a pick off of a window washer at a high rise apartment building. Does your department use dead mans in doorways, or do you have a portable over head system that works in windows?
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Thread: Anchoring for windows
12-11-2010, 03:50 PM #1
Anchoring for windows
12-11-2010, 06:11 PM #2
- Join Date
- Jan 2004
We go to the roof and operate from there. There is usually more room to work and better anchors.
12-11-2010, 06:24 PM #3
Sorry I should have been more to the point. Say the victim is hanging between the 20th and 21st floor, the building has 90 floors to it. In other words im saying you will be lowering a rescuer the majority of the building if you go the route of lowering from the roof ( not saying this is wrong in anyway). This is more of a thinking outside the box/ what would you do if the roof is not an option. Again not taking anything away from the roof anchors.
12-11-2010, 08:05 PM #4
If the roof was out of play I would probably rig from interior anchors on the 23rd floor and exit from a window on the 22nd floor all the while trying my best to align our egress point and anchor point with the area the victim was stuck. If we cant get alignment from one window then perhaps rigging a load sharing anchor from the 25th floor and exiting from the 24th could work. Once we reach the victim we could connect a line to the back of their harness lower them to a window on the 20th floor and pull them in. If thats not an option we could always do a line transfer.Utilize a mini 4:1 MAS or a pick-off strap to off load them from their line and connect them onto you then take a nice ride down to the ground.
Just two quick possibilities floating around in my head.
Mike Donahue"Training Prepares You...For Moments That Define You
12-12-2010, 05:19 AM #5
lots of variables. in terms of anchors, i'd find one inside the building somewhere above the patient. deadman in the doorway, large plumbing, set 2+ bolts in the floor.
i think the bigger problem will be safely opening the window and making access to the exterior of the building not from the roof. if i can do this easily maybe we can just do that right where the patient is and pull them inside.
we'd probably just use the aerial platform shown below. 367 feet = approx 30 stories. should reach ok.
12-12-2010, 05:39 PM #6
- Join Date
- Dec 2010
Last edited by GRIMPMASTER; 12-12-2010 at 05:41 PM.
01-20-2011, 11:55 PM #7
- Join Date
- May 2008
- Long Island NY
Mike Im all in for the line transfer but here is another question, Does any one know at what floor of there buildings do the windows not open any more? i believe its a code regulated feature dependent on the city you operate in. A somewhat "new" tool is the ALPHA glass saw in which we have cut the glass out of the window directly in front of the victim and pulled them in. So my point is rigging configurations are situationally dependent and common sense and a good knowledge base on anchor selection should always be paramount and if there is any doubt back it up.
01-21-2011, 03:11 PM #8
Aren't most true high rises that tall equipped with windows that do not open? How easy is window removal to complete on sealed windows like that?
What or where do the window washer or outside maintenance types hook into to perform their jobs? Would it be easier to haul them up then to lower a rescuer down?
Could you just remove the window he is stuck in front of and bring him in?
Personally I would think that if you are going to lower a rescuer to perform a pick off you would find an anchor within the building, might mean removing some sheet rock to expose structural members. Rig your lowering/haul systems a level higher than the point you are going to operate your rescuers from, gives you the high help, swing rescuer out the level below and retrieve the patient by swinging him into that lower level.~Drew
USAR TF Rescue Specialist
01-22-2011, 11:34 AM #9
- Join Date
- Jan 2004
This is a point I've highlighted while teaching anchoring in the past. We are still the fire department and this is still an emergency. Ripping down sheet rock to the structural members is something we do REAL well.
For a first post, it's kind of Spam, but the concept of the Syam is interesting. It would be nice if you could give some specs and some better pictures of the rigging on your website when you use it for a basket lowering. Perhaps it's just a language barrier. Neat idea though.
01-24-2011, 10:37 PM #10
- Join Date
- Jan 2011
I like Mike's idea about going to a couple of floors above, rigging, and heading out the windows and then back in. However, if we can't get out the windows...
If the washer is hanging on his vertical lifeline, why not consider using it to get him to the ground? If his VLL is in good condition, I would head for the roof and start rigging. We'd attach tandem prussiks to the VLL and the prussiks to my lowering system (CMC MPD). We perform a short haul with the MPD, disconnect the VLL, connect the VLL back on the main line, disconnect the washer's bos n' chair, and lower the washer to the ground.
01-24-2011, 10:43 PM #11
I like it. The only thing I might add, is clipping a separate belay to the victims line and lowering it to him if he is conscious and having him attach it, if not, SRT would work in a pinch.John D. Calamia, BS, NREMTP, FP-C
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