1. #1
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    Default Ventilation, or ?

    Not sure what was going on in this one, although I have some ideas.
    Standard tactics?
    Lessons to learn?

    VERY SCARY HOUSE FIRE & FLASHOVER WITH ESCAPE! (Dolton,IL)
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=btSQ2tYOElo

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    Think I've seen and commented on this one.

    1. Private dwelling, why isn't the hose line charged prior to entry? There is no justifible good reason that hose line went into the structure dry, and came out the say way.

    2. Can't see what else is going on, nor do I have audio here, but I believe I saw at least three apparatus on scene, were they all driver only? Where was everyone else?

    3. If your hose line is dry and your advancing into the structure, you aren't ready for fire attack so therefore you definitly aren't ready to feed massive amounts of oxygen to a fire you aren't even sure where its at yet, so why take the picture window in the front.

    4. I like how comments were disabled on youtube for it. I take it the comments along the lines of "WTF* were you thinking?" weren't the "cool" "awesome" "great job" "we all went home" comments they were looking for.

    *No not Wikileaks Task Force either. Ha.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnVBFD View Post
    Think I've seen and commented on this one.

    1. Private dwelling, why isn't the hose line charged prior to entry? There is no justifible good reason that hose line went into the structure dry, and came out the say way.

    2. Can't see what else is going on, nor do I have audio here, but I believe I saw at least three apparatus on scene, were they all driver only? Where was everyone else?

    3. If your hose line is dry and your advancing into the structure, you aren't ready for fire attack so therefore you definitly aren't ready to feed massive amounts of oxygen to a fire you aren't even sure where its at yet, so why take the picture window in the front.

    4. I like how comments were disabled on youtube for it. I take it the comments along the lines of "WTF* were you thinking?" weren't the "cool" "awesome" "great job" "we all went home" comments they were looking for.

    *No not Wikileaks Task Force either. Ha.

    Merry Bah Humbug
    Good comments. It does look like they failed on a few very basic points. I wish we could see the whole video w/o editing and get an idea of what was going on in all sectors to make a full analysis.

    Happy denominational or non-denominational celebratory day!

    Merry Christmas all!
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    Nothing scary about that fire... looks like there was a pump issue, water took forever.

    Finally get water and do the exterior attack in through the window.

    Not sure who was venting before the line was ready, but duh.

    Sorry guys, you could've done a better job on this one.
    I am now a past chief and the views, opinions, and comments are mine and mine alone. I do not speak for any department or in any official capacity. Although, they would be smart to listen to me.

    "The last thing I want to do is hurt you. But it's still on the list."

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    bungelow? where are the steps to go down. usually the side door takes you down.

    protect the first floor and send a line down. vent the basement windows as the 1 st line is in place. pretty basic to me.
    Originally Posted by madden01
    "and everyone is encouraged to use Plain, Spelled Out English. I thought this was covered in NIMS training."

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    Fully involved???...don't think so.
    Went in and did a search and rescue...It was unoccupied. Can't tell how much searching was done but, ok.

    Don't know the water issue.

    If you're inside and start taking out windows (like that big one) to vent smoke, you can also draw the fire towards you.
    Line should have gone in the door, not the window.

    I've thrown enough stones.

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    If you take a window, take the whole window. It gets on my nerves when people leave half the dang window intact. Seems like they could have secured the storm door so it was out of the way.

    Anybody know why they chose to vertically ventilate after the bulk of the fire was knocked down?
    FF/Paramedic

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    Quote Originally Posted by len1582 View Post
    Fully involved???...don't think so.
    That's a term that gets thrown out a lot... I recently heard a fully involved go under control with 1 line stretched in about 5 minutes. Good trick, that!
    I am now a past chief and the views, opinions, and comments are mine and mine alone. I do not speak for any department or in any official capacity. Although, they would be smart to listen to me.

    "The last thing I want to do is hurt you. But it's still on the list."

    "When tempted to fight fire with fire, remember that the Fire Department usually uses water."

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    This is fully involved. Was like this when we rolled up. Arson of course. Just because you see a little fire doesnt mean its fully involved.
    Attached Images Attached Images  

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    Quote Originally Posted by ChiefKN View Post
    That's a term that gets thrown out a lot... I recently heard a fully involved go under control with 1 line stretched in about 5 minutes. Good trick, that!
    In my neck of the woods, we get "single vehicle ROLL_OVER" for every 1050.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tfpd109 View Post
    This is fully involved. Was like this when we rolled up. Arson of course. Just because you see a little fire doesnt mean its fully involved.
    Could you tell that to the thousands of intrepid cell phone users who call in burn barrels and brush piles as "fully involved structures?"
    Opinions my own. Standard disclaimers apply.

    Everyone goes home. Safety begins with you.

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    Sorry, no can do... But really guys, how often do we get a call and the info is 100% correct? Or even half right? Not because of dispatch, but from the RP. IE: It seems to happen with most all fires, accidents, and somehow even a lot of medicals.
    HOWEVER, back to the topic...
    Last edited by tfpd109; 12-25-2010 at 11:31 PM. Reason: I need a proof reader!

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    Can't tell from the video but was there a line or an attack to the basement? Obvious pressurized smoke pushing from front door. I'd worry about floor integrity and a charged line a must before entry. But I wasn't there so I don't have all the particulars but I don't believe it was near fully involved, until they took out part of the window.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tfpd109 View Post
    Sorry, no can do... But really guys, how often do we get a call and the info is 100% correct? Or even half right? Not because of dispatch, but from the RP. IE: It seems to happen with most all fires, accidents, and somehow even a lot of medicals.
    HOWEVER, back to the topic...
    Where I'm at, the "fully involved" information seems to come more from the first arriving FD personnel (usually a Chief or other officer) than from the civilian callers reporting the fire.

    I frequently hear the initial report of "fully involved" and then see news footage or photos later on and at least half the building looks like it wasn't even on fire.

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    I really didn't see anything "scary" about this house fire and I guess I missed the "escape" following a flashover.

    The video doesn't really provide a good view of "whole picture", but other than the delay with getting the line to the front door charged and taking that window what looked to be "too soon", I really didn't see anything significantly questionable.

    I'll just assume that the video didn't show why they needed to vent the roof at that point.

    As for the "where is everybody else" question..........

    From a quick search, they appear to be a small career department, so it's quite possible that the units are only minimally staffed and they are still awaiting the arrival of off-duty and/or mutual aid personnel. My department is that way. We only have a handful or so of personnel on the scene for the first several minutes until the off-duty personnel start to arrive at the scene.

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    Quote Originally Posted by FireMedic049 View Post

    As for the "where is everybody else" question..........

    From a quick search, they appear to be a small career department, so it's quite possible that the units are only minimally staffed and they are still awaiting the arrival of off-duty and/or mutual aid personnel. My department is that way. We only have a handful or so of personnel on the scene for the first several minutes until the off-duty personnel start to arrive at the scene.
    All my comments about the fire have already been covered, but I feel like I can provide some input on the "where is everybody else" question. FM is correct, Dolton is a small career FD, right outside Chicago. Fairly busy for fire duty, as far as suburbs go. Not the best area. The other towns in their MABAS division are also good towns for fire, so it would be no surprise to me if their m/a was tied up at another fire.....or possibly multiple MVAs due to the weather. Also, the weather could not have helped response times.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnVBFD View Post

    4. I like how comments were disabled on youtube for it. I take it the comments along the lines of "WTF* were you thinking?" weren't the "cool" "awesome" "great job" "we all went home" comments they were looking for.
    Just FYI, this wasn't filmed by a firefighter or a member of a FD. This was filmed by a company who sells DVDs of fires, good MVAs, etc. All their videos have comments disabled.

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    The only thing scary about this video is the lack of coordination and proper understanding of tactics by the people who responded.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rescue101 View Post
    I don't mind fire rolling over my head. I just don't like it rolling UNDER my a**.

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    "I was scared out of my mind!" Washington Weekly
    "A terrifying thrill ride"Lower Pigsknuckle Bugler
    "A real nail biter"Hayseed Exclaimer
    "I nearly jumped out of my skin!"Podunk Newswire

    How can you argue with those reviews??
    IAFF

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    Quote Originally Posted by TNFF319 View Post
    If you take a window, take the whole window. It gets on my nerves when people leave half the dang window intact. Seems like they could have secured the storm door so it was out of the way.
    And to add, why even go inside to take that particular window out? It's a few feet off the ground, just stand in front of out OUTSIDE and take it out. But clearly there was a lack of attention to detail here.

    Lot's of great comments in here by others. Great learning tool. It would be nice to know the reason for the water delay too.

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