1. #1
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    Default FDNY sacks EMS chief

    I assume most people have seen this by now on the Firehouse front page:

    http://www.firehouse.com/news/top-he...lizzard-snafus

    The first thing that comes to mind when I read this is why they are trying to hold the EMS chief responsible for a snow storm that delayed crews from responding? How could he have had any control over that? Maybe there are some political things going on or other screwups he had that the press didn't report. I think we have some FDNY people here who might be able to provide some more details?

    I just keep thinking about our own situation as it relates to this. We get enough snow around here that there have been times we've had to tell 911 callers that we simply can't and won't respond. (A classic example would be a 20 mile response way out in the county when we have 20 miles of unplowed road between us and no visibility) We've never had a complaint about it as I think most people around here understand that we have limitations when a blizzard strikes.

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    Someone was going to take the fall.

    I have to say that the city should have been able to do better then 30 hours, even for a fx ankle or an imminent birth.
    I am now a past chief and the views, opinions, and comments are mine and mine alone. I do not speak for any department or in any official capacity. Although, they would be smart to listen to me.

    "The last thing I want to do is hurt you. But it's still on the list."

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    Unless they know something we don't, I find it hard to hold him responsible for ambulances not being able to get where they have to go, especially when it appears that someone else (in this case Sanitation) failed to do their job.

    Up here in snow country, we're usually ahead of the game, but a good storm can still cause problems.

    Something I haven't seen yet is a comparison of the number of calls normally received vs the number of calls received during the storm, both by 9-1-1 and as actual dispatches.
    Opinions my own. Standard disclaimers apply.

    Everyone goes home. Safety begins with you.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ChiefKN View Post
    Someone was going to take the fall.

    I have to say that the city should have been able to do better then 30 hours, even for a fx ankle or an imminent birth.
    All of the outer boroughs were a nightmare. Random blocks were untouched, while other main throughways were somewhat better, sometimes. Countless cars abandoned and buried in the drifts, blocking roads ect...

    While riding as a passenger I had the unfortunate experience to see it myself. Downtown BK was a nightmare. By Tuesday, even the roads around metrotech still had vast amounts of unplowed snow to try to navigate through, 15"+ easy. like the little loop st you take beside 9metro to go to the central park ing on flatbush ext i believe it is, the parking garage right next to HQ.

    Ambulances couldn't go down most of the side streets and had to stop their bus and hike the rest of the way down streets to get to the call and shlep their patient back to the ambulance. Countless rigs were getting caught in the snow, including ambulances that were getting pulled out by fire apparatus.

    I saw 2 snowplow trucks between Monday and Tuesday. I only saw one the entire day I was in downtown BK.

    The EMS chief shouldn't take any blame for the obvious negligence of sanitation. I don't care for EMS (as a career) and will never be a "street doctor", as my bro puts it, but if they're talking about Perrugia....he's done more to advance EMS capabilities since the takeover, than arguably anyone before: Rescue Medics (actually very impressive), actual bunker gear instead of those lousy raincoats, enhancing the EMS Haz-Tac program (EMS units with techs on board), and so many other firsts for NYC EMS.
    Last edited by Firehouse_Chick; 01-06-2011 at 04:02 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Firehouse_Chick View Post
    All of the outer boroughs were a nightmare. Random blocks were untouched, while other main throughways were somewhat better, sometimes. Countless cars abandoned and buried in the drifts, blocking roads ect...

    While riding as a passenger I had the unfortunate experience to see it myself. Downtown BK was a nightmare. By Tuesday, even the roads around metrotech still had vast amounts of unplowed snow to try to navigate through, 15"+ easy. like the little loop st you take beside 9metro to go to the central park ing on flatbush ext i believe it is, the parking garage right next to HQ.

    Ambulances couldn't go down most of the side streets and had to stop their bus and hike the rest of the way down streets to get to the call and shlep their patient back to the ambulance. Countless rigs were getting caught in the snow, including ambulances that were getting pulled out by fire apparatus.

    I saw 2 snowplow trucks between Monday and Tuesday. I only saw one the entire day I was in downtown BK.

    The EMS chief shouldn't take any blame for the obvious negligence of sanitation. I don't care for EMS (as a career) and will never be a "street doctor", as my bro puts it, but if they're talking about Perrugia....he's done more to advance EMS capabilities since the takeover, than arguably anyone before: Rescue Medics (actually very impressive), actual bunker gear instead of those lousy raincoats, enhancing the EMS Haz-Tac program (EMS units with techs on board), and so many other firsts for NYC EMS.
    George? Is that you ole buddy?

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    Quote Originally Posted by RFDACM02 View Post
    George? Is that you ole buddy?
    As in Georgie W? the George from Flanders? who left the forums about a yr ago, George?

    That's weird, what makes you think this? I didn't think he thought much of NYC or the dept.

    I'm not him, I'm not BOU, nor scarecrow or any of the other names people suggested.

    side note: not for nothin, out of all the banned persons that I supposedly am; I think the banning of Calffbou was something that shouldn't have ever happened. Don't get me wrong, as much as I don't care for many of his methods and ideas, or the odd pro-west coast musings and kicks he got into at one point, he seems to be a very nice person in real life. I've been reading FH for the past couple years. Some of the members here I've learned and gotten great laughs from, respect and like him very much as a person. Still bothers me when I think about it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Firehouse_Chick View Post
    As in Georgie W? the George from Flanders? who left the forums about a yr ago, George?

    That's weird, what makes you think this? I didn't think he thought much of NYC or the dept.

    I'm not him, I'm not BOU, nor scarecrow or any of the other names people suggested.

    side note: not for nothin, out of all the banned persons that I supposedly am; I think the banning of Calffbou was something that shouldn't have ever happened. Don't get me wrong, as much as I don't care for many of his methods and ideas, or the odd pro-west coast musings and kicks he got into at one point, he seems to be a very nice person in real life. I've been reading FH for the past couple years. Some of the members here I've learned and gotten great laughs from, respect and like him very much as a person. Still bothers me when I think about it.
    So, mystery guest...

    You've obviously been on here before as another name, you didn't just join in Nov, 2010. We know your full of ..... about being a girl, the brother, the whole story.

    Will you be playing this game for long?
    I am now a past chief and the views, opinions, and comments are mine and mine alone. I do not speak for any department or in any official capacity. Although, they would be smart to listen to me.

    "The last thing I want to do is hurt you. But it's still on the list."

    "When tempted to fight fire with fire, remember that the Fire Department usually uses water."

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    Ken, don't feed the monkeys. All they do is fling poo......
    Matt G.
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    Quote Originally Posted by mtg55 View Post
    Ken, don't feed the monkeys. All they do is fling poo......
    Fling poo?

    Brown rice or white rice?

    With two you get egg roll.
    I am now a past chief and the views, opinions, and comments are mine and mine alone. I do not speak for any department or in any official capacity. Although, they would be smart to listen to me.

    "The last thing I want to do is hurt you. But it's still on the list."

    "When tempted to fight fire with fire, remember that the Fire Department usually uses water."

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    He wouldn't have gotten sacked if he had a better offensive line.
    I am more than just a serious basketball fan. I am a life-long addict. I was addicted from birth, in fact, because I was born in Kentucky.
    ― Hunter S. Thompson

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    Quote Originally Posted by ChiefKN View Post
    Fling poo?

    Brown rice or white rice?

    With two you get egg roll.
    Its the C-27 lunch special. Its delicious.
    Matt G.
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    EVERYONE BUT ME!!!!

    ALL GAVE SOME BUT SOME GAVE ALL
    NEVER FORGET 9-11-01
    343
    CAPT. Frank Callahan Ladder 35 *
    LT. John Ginley Engine 40
    FF. Bruce Gary Engine 40
    FF. Jimmy Giberson Ladder 35
    FF. Michael Otten Ladder 35 *
    FF. Steve Mercado Engine 40 *
    FF. Kevin Bracken Engine 40 *
    FF. Vincent Morello Ladder 35
    FF. Michael Roberts Ladder 35 *
    FF. Michael Lynch Engine 40
    FF. Michael Dauria Engine 40

    Charleston 9
    "If my job was easy a cop would be doing it."
    *******************CLICK HERE*****************

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    ...so what will become of Chief Peruggia? The press release said he was remaining with the EMS Command, somewhere...

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    Quote Originally Posted by DaFAO View Post
    ...so what will become of Chief Peruggia? The press release said he was remaining with the EMS Command, somewhere...
    their not sure yet...maybe S.I. command


    by Michael Daly

    What if next time it is not a blizzard, but a terrorist attack?
    What if city officials discover to their astonishment that departments besides sanitation were so weakened by budget cuts that they could not adequately respond?
    What if we discover we need not fewer fire companies, but more?

    What if we are reminded what a difference change booth clerks can make in the subway in a crisis?

    What if we realize that we have been weakened in ways we did not anticipate until it was too late?

    Officials reassure us they are prepared and by every indication they are right.

    But they also told us they were ready for the blizzard.

    And the guy at the top does not seem to fully appreciate the magnitude of the failure, though he was in the middle of it.

    Even when he was no longer out of town, our usually masterful mayor seems to have been out of touch.

    Check it out for yourself at NYCMayorsOffice on Twitter, which posted a series of photos taken of Bloomberg on a kind of culinary tour through the outer boroughs Dec. 27.

    "Checking out the roti options at Sybil's Bakery in Queens" reads the tag line for one.

    "Hot food on a cold Brooklyn day...thanks Kettle Black!" reads another.

    "NYC family making the best of a snowy day with an early dinner at Colonnade Diner," reads another.

    The last photo shows Bloomberg smiling with a couple and their two kids in the Staten Island eatery.

    "Neither snow nor rain nor gloom of nite (sic) keeps NYC's diners from serving up great food," the tweet adds.

    Such an attitude and such a tour would only be fitting for the mayor of a New York who had shrugged off the blizzard, as it has storms of recent years. Bloomberg's relaxed expression suggests he imagined he still ran such a city.

    As clocked by the tweets, he was able to proceed from Ozone Park to Bay Ridge to Staten Island in just over an hour, including however long it took him to grab a bite at the Bay Ridge spot.

    That would be making pretty good time with no snow, which makes you wonder if perhaps somebody called ahead with the mayor's route and made sure it was cleared, maybe without him even knowing.

    That could have fostered an illusion that it was still the city he thought it was. The rest of us were learning otherwise as we struggled through unplowed streets.

    At least part of the failure was due to Bloomberg's decision not to declare a snow emergency.

    Philadelphia mayor Michael Nutter did so at 2 p.m. Sunday, just about when our mayor was returning from out of town.

    The result of doing it in Philadelphia was that the plows were able to clear the major roads from curb to curb without encountering parked or stalled cars.

    The result of not doing it in New York was a disaster.

    Bloomberg must have thought the Sanitation Department was up to the job.

    He remains confident in the capabilities of the police and fire departments and I sure hope he is right.

    One person I hope is wrong is a friend in counterterrorism who suggests that officials are aware that the emergency services are as weakened as sanitation.

    "Sad to say, but they're trying to give everybody a snow job," my friend said.

    He then said something that is incontestably true.

    "It's not vital until you need it."
    ALL GAVE SOME BUT SOME GAVE ALL
    NEVER FORGET 9-11-01
    343
    CAPT. Frank Callahan Ladder 35 *
    LT. John Ginley Engine 40
    FF. Bruce Gary Engine 40
    FF. Jimmy Giberson Ladder 35
    FF. Michael Otten Ladder 35 *
    FF. Steve Mercado Engine 40 *
    FF. Kevin Bracken Engine 40 *
    FF. Vincent Morello Ladder 35
    FF. Michael Roberts Ladder 35 *
    FF. Michael Lynch Engine 40
    FF. Michael Dauria Engine 40

    Charleston 9
    "If my job was easy a cop would be doing it."
    *******************CLICK HERE*****************

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    Quote Originally Posted by E40FDNYL35 View Post
    their not sure yet...maybe S.I. command


    by Michael Daly

    What if next time it is not a blizzard, but a terrorist attack?
    What if city officials discover to their astonishment that departments besides sanitation were so weakened by budget cuts that they could not adequately respond?
    What if we discover we need not fewer fire companies, but more?

    What if we are reminded what a difference change booth clerks can make in the subway in a crisis?

    What if we realize that we have been weakened in ways we did not anticipate until it was too late?

    Officials reassure us they are prepared and by every indication they are right.

    But they also told us they were ready for the blizzard.

    And the guy at the top does not seem to fully appreciate the magnitude of the failure, though he was in the middle of it.

    Even when he was no longer out of town, our usually masterful mayor seems to have been out of touch.

    Check it out for yourself at NYCMayorsOffice on Twitter, which posted a series of photos taken of Bloomberg on a kind of culinary tour through the outer boroughs Dec. 27.

    "Checking out the roti options at Sybil's Bakery in Queens" reads the tag line for one.

    "Hot food on a cold Brooklyn day...thanks Kettle Black!" reads another.

    "NYC family making the best of a snowy day with an early dinner at Colonnade Diner," reads another.

    The last photo shows Bloomberg smiling with a couple and their two kids in the Staten Island eatery.

    "Neither snow nor rain nor gloom of nite (sic) keeps NYC's diners from serving up great food," the tweet adds.

    Such an attitude and such a tour would only be fitting for the mayor of a New York who had shrugged off the blizzard, as it has storms of recent years. Bloomberg's relaxed expression suggests he imagined he still ran such a city.

    As clocked by the tweets, he was able to proceed from Ozone Park to Bay Ridge to Staten Island in just over an hour, including however long it took him to grab a bite at the Bay Ridge spot.

    That would be making pretty good time with no snow, which makes you wonder if perhaps somebody called ahead with the mayor's route and made sure it was cleared, maybe without him even knowing.

    That could have fostered an illusion that it was still the city he thought it was. The rest of us were learning otherwise as we struggled through unplowed streets.

    At least part of the failure was due to Bloomberg's decision not to declare a snow emergency.

    Philadelphia mayor Michael Nutter did so at 2 p.m. Sunday, just about when our mayor was returning from out of town.

    The result of doing it in Philadelphia was that the plows were able to clear the major roads from curb to curb without encountering parked or stalled cars.

    The result of not doing it in New York was a disaster.

    Bloomberg must have thought the Sanitation Department was up to the job.

    He remains confident in the capabilities of the police and fire departments and I sure hope he is right.

    One person I hope is wrong is a friend in counterterrorism who suggests that officials are aware that the emergency services are as weakened as sanitation.

    "Sad to say, but they're trying to give everybody a snow job," my friend said.

    He then said something that is incontestably true.

    "It's not vital until you need it."
    MIDDLE of It? How about the DIRECT CAUSE of it? T.c.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Firehouse_Chick View Post
    As in Georgie W? the George from Flanders? who left the forums about a yr ago, George?

    That's weird, what makes you think this? I didn't think he thought much of NYC or the dept.

    I'm not him, I'm not BOU, nor scarecrow or any of the other names people suggested.

    side note: not for nothin, out of all the banned persons that I supposedly am; I think the banning of Calffbou was something that shouldn't have ever happened. Don't get me wrong, as much as I don't care for many of his methods and ideas, or the odd pro-west coast musings and kicks he got into at one point, he seems to be a very nice person in real life. I've been reading FH for the past couple years. Some of the members here I've learned and gotten great laughs from, respect and like him very much as a person. Still bothers me when I think about it.
    Side Note: FH.com is not the only one who has banned Calffbou.... a few employers have also, but he still a nice guy...
    Last edited by kyle77; 01-08-2011 at 12:44 AM.

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    Default Storm Response

    People have to remember that during an extreme weather event (snow storm, flooding, hurricane, etc.) emergency services may be delayed or not even able to respond at all.

    One solution, for any future snowstorms, is to position snowmobiles at preselected locations (firehouses, etc.) to allow EMS to respond to medical emergencies. If EMS could utilize snowmobiles, they could most likely respond anywhere in the city, when ambulances could not travel in blocked streets.

    EMS personnel on snowmobiles, using portable radios and taking along certain EMS equipment and supplies, could respond to the highest priority calls (heart attacks, etc.).
    If some type of sled could be utilized to transport non-trauma patients to the closest ambulance or even to a nearby medical center, that could help with patient transport.

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    Quote Originally Posted by FIRE117 View Post
    One solution, for any future snowstorms, is to position snowmobiles at preselected locations (firehouses, etc.) to allow EMS to respond to medical emergencies. If EMS could utilize snowmobiles, they could most likely respond anywhere in the city, when ambulances could not travel in blocked streets.

    EMS personnel on snowmobiles, using portable radios and taking along certain EMS equipment and supplies, could respond to the highest priority calls (heart attacks, etc.).
    If some type of sled could be utilized to transport non-trauma patients to the closest ambulance or even to a nearby medical center, that could help with patient transport.
    Going along with that. Alaska should know how to respond so if you get in that kind of situation Google an Alaskan fire department maybe they would be willing to give some tips.

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    Default Winter Response

    A former FD that I was a member of, had a tracked vehicle. Whenever there was an impending snowstorm/blizzard, the chief would have us load the 2 1/2" spare hose off the racks into the back of this tracked vehicle. We also included a hydrant wrench and 2 1/2" nozzle. This tracked vehicle did not have a radio, so a portable radio was taken along, too.

    The plan was for us to respond to any fire during the blizzard/snowstorm and fight the fire, until road crews could clean a route for the arrival of the pumpers.

    We would go out in this tracked vehicle and transport people. We would go to the homes of the street dept. personnel, pick them up and take them to the street dept. building, to retireve the snow removal equipment.

    Since EMS was a separate agency, I do not know what arrangement they had to respond to medical emergencies during snowstorms and blizzards. I do know the police dept. used snowmobiles to patrol the city.

    While providing fire and EMS services during a snowstorm/blizzard is difficult, snowmobiles and tracked vehicles should be looked at. Also, besides carrying a portable radio, GPS should also be used to find locations.

  20. #20
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    its cute that you guys think we can go buy snowmobiles while Bloomturd is trying to close firehouses....but why dont we start with chains for ambulances?
    Proud East Coast Traditionalist.

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    Quote Originally Posted by nyckftbl View Post
    its cute that you guys think we can go buy snowmobiles while Bloomturd is trying to close firehouses....but why dont we start with chains for ambulances?
    I'm asking cause I honestly don't know...Could the EMS Battalions have used their SUV's (I assume they're 4x4) for some of this? I know there were better than a thousand calls in the queue, but were they doing anything? Would Gerritsen Beach or Roxbury been of any help with their 4x4 engines?

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    Quote Originally Posted by DaFAO View Post
    I'm asking cause I honestly don't know...Could the EMS Battalions have used their SUV's (I assume they're 4x4) for some of this? I know there were better than a thousand calls in the queue, but were they doing anything? Would Gerritsen Beach or Roxbury been of any help with their 4x4 engines?
    NO! Ever been to NYC in 12+ inches of snow? A dozen cars will ball up any attempt at snow removal and they had a LOT more than that( both snow AND cars). Snowmobiles MIGHT have worked but they would get ZERO support from the Ivory palace. T.C.

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    Quote Originally Posted by nyckftbl View Post
    its cute that you guys think we can go buy snowmobiles while Bloomturd is trying to close firehouses....but why dont we start with chains for ambulances?
    Looked from MY angle that you guys had more TROUBLE( Cars/blocked roads/streets)than any chains were going to cure. T.c.

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    How long would a snowmobile last down on the street while the crew is upstairs tending to Grandma?

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    Quote Originally Posted by RFDACM02 View Post
    How long would a snowmobile last down on the street while the crew is upstairs tending to Grandma?
    30 seconds without an armed guard. Assuming you want to wade thru all that snow to get it. T.C.

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