Water Supply-What do you connect with?

[CKirk922]

When you hit a hydrant, what appliances, hose, and lengths do you use to make connections?

We typically will hit a hydrant with a 50' x 5" storz with a steamer to storz off the hydrant and a piston intake on the steamer.

Some lays will begin with a 50' x 3" straight out and straight in.

We have a couple of 2 1/2" x storz hydrant valves that adapt down to 2 1/2" with a fitting that I'm trying to get the guys to use on hydrant ears. Connecting this valve on the ears would give us the ability to connect another lay off a hydrant without shutting down the flow.

On one engine we have a 25' x 5" storz that is used if we are close enough.

[RFDACM02]

5"x25ft. soft hydrant hose or a 4.5" hydrant thread to 5" storz adapter and up to 300 ft. of 5" LDH depending on location and occupancy. All hydrants have one 2.5" hydrant gate on a 2.5" port "just in case". We also carry 2.5" o 5" Sotrz adapters.

We add the hydrant gate or ball valve to the 2.5" port for additional supply, but in reality the most often use has been to remove the line from broken hydrants before the water company arrives to shut it down. I know of at least three times in the past 5 years we've needed to use the gate to be able to remove the pumper.

[FWDbuff]

Forward Lay: Engine connects a HUMAT (hydrant assist valve) and lays in 5" LDH to the scene.

Reverse Lay: Drops 5" at the scene. Whoever is picking it up does whatever with it (usually into their piston relief intake valve.)

Hydrant Connection for reverse lay: Connect a 25' or 50 length of 5" directly to the plug and into the piston relief intake.

Hydrant connection to boost a previously laid line:

1. Connect 25' or 50' section from the discharge of the HUMAT to the intake of the rig.

2. Connect a 25' or 50' section from the LDH discharge of the rig to the intake of the HUMAT. Open the butterfly valve allowing water into the rig, then boost the pressure into the discharge as required.

[FyredUp]

We forward lay using 5 inch hose. The first section off the engine has the adapter connected to it to hook to our hydrants. In the hydrant bag are 22 1/2 inch gate valves and a 2 1/2 NST female to 5 inch storz adapter.

We also carry a 25 foot and a 50 foot 5 inch pony section for making up the end of the forward lay or for a direct engine to hydrant connection.

[RFD21C]

We foward lay 4 inch from the hydrant and run it into the piston intake. no gate valves on the 2.5 on the side. Other companies take other hydrants.

We carry a 25' and 50' setions of 4 inch to make up the difference in the lay or directly to the hydrant.

If I am on a hydrant pumping in a relay on a larger fire i will run my 25' section off the steamer connection on the hydrant and into the pistion-in-take. Unless the truck i am on has a 6'' soft sleeve then i run that off the hydrant steamer into my steamer connection on the hydrant. Then I will run my front suction one of the 2.5 connections on the hydrant.

[FIREMECH1]

All engines carry at least 800' of 5" with the hydrant adapter already on the first coupling going to the hydrant. First 2 sections is 50', then 100' after that. You use whatever you need from the hydrant to the PIV. Nothing is used between the hydrant and the PIV.

I'm not familiar with forward/reverse laying, so I need to be educated. If the first on scene engine goes in, they either hit the hydrant if very close, or wait for another engine to hook up a line from the hydrant to the first engine in. Not sure if the hose is from the first engine working, or the second in/first to hit a hydrant.

Like I said, I know enough to get myself in trouble. But I am very observant when on scene. I'll ask the guys tomorrow, been wondering this question myself.

FM1

[chiefengineer11]

I'm not familiar with forward/reverse laying, so I need to be educated. If the first on scene engine goes in, they either hit the hydrant if very close, or wait for another engine to hook up a line from the hydrant to the first engine in. Not sure if the hose is from the first engine working, or the second in/first to hit a hydrant.

Like I said, I know enough to get myself in trouble. But I am very observant when on scene. I'll ask the guys tomorrow, been wondering this question myself.

FM1

Forward lay is from the water source (hydrant) to the fire. Reverse lay is from the fire to the water source. It used to be common practice in our area for hose beds to be packed according to the most commonly used lay. If you usually used a forward lay, the hose would be packed with the female coupling out. If you reverse laid, it would be male out. And you always kept a double male/double female coupling set handy.

[kuh shise]

We have always been set-up with reverse lays, and moved to a "two section engine company" approach as outlined by Warren Kimball in his "Fire Attack I & II" books published by NFPA in the 1970's. Originally we had L Model Macks with small (150 gal ) tanks that had to be supplemented with hydrant water asap. The tactics never changed, since the attack engine applied tank water (750 gal now) as quickly as the preconnect lines could be stretched. Bringing this back to the O.P.'s question... We run two hydrant hook-ups on every engine. Officer's side has a 25 ft. - 5" Storz with 4 1/2" hydrant thread preconnected to an inlet with either an internal or external valve and associated relief valve. Driver's side has a 6" by 2 1/2" gated siamese with a 25 ft. section of 3" hose and a hydrant gate preconnected. We also keep two - 25 ft. rolls of 3" in the compartment to supplement the supply from a second 2 1/2" hydrant outlet. We still have some "Mae West" hydrants in service, so the 3" comes in handy in the older parts of the system. Since the second section crew gets dropped at the scene, it is essential that the D.O. can make the hydrant taps quickly when working alone at the plug.

[Eng34FF]

We have 2200 ft of 3" supply line (can be split in the middle for dual lays) with a Humat on the end. We drop the Humat and 50' layout pack at they hydrant or layout point and normally forward lay to the scene.

[FWDbuff]

We have 2200 ft of 3" supply line (can be split in the middle for dual lays) with a Humat on the end. We drop the Humat and 50' layout pack at they hydrant or layout point and normally forward lay to the scene.

My god- there's still a Dept in the US that uses 3" as a supply line?

[LaFireEducator]

Nothing complicated.

A hydrant with a steamer and (2) 2 1/2" ports gets the LDH on the steamer with a threaded-LDH adapter and one of the 2 1/2's gets a hydrant gate.

A hydrant with no steamer and (2) 2 1/2" ports gets either a 3" (w/ 2 1/2" couplings) to one of the ports and a gate to the other or if we lay a LDH a 2 1/2" - 4"/5" (depending on if the engine carries 4" or 5") with a gate to the other port.

Single 2 1/2" port hydrants gets a 3" only. LDH is not used on those hydrants.

[LaFireEducator]

My god- there's still a Dept in the US that uses 3" as a supply line?

We will generally use LDH and not use a 3" supply line on a structure fire unless it is a red low flow hydrant and the LDH would not provide any additional flow.

We will use a 3" as a supply line for a large trash fire, brush fire or some other non-structural incident where the flow from a 3" is sufficient.

Reason is simple. Quicker re-pack time.

[CKirk922]

My god- there's still a Dept in the US that uses 3" as a supply line?

Yes Virginia, there are real Neanderthals among us....Where did I put my club? I need to smack some FFs over the head on my department for using 2 1/2" and 3"...(Sarcasm intended)

[CKirk922]

We will generally use LDH and not use a 3" supply line on a structure fire unless it is a red low flow hydrant and the LDH would not provide any additional flow.

We will use a 3" as a supply line for a large trash fire, brush fire or some other non-structural incident where the flow from a 3" is sufficient.

Reason is simple. Quicker re-pack time.

Sarcasm aside, we generally do the same. 75 percent of our fires end up with drop ponds anyway in non-hydranted areas. Funny thing is, our coverage area is split 50/50 hydranted. It is the farm houses that generally go up. Older construction I guess.

[Eng34FF]

My god- there's still a Dept in the US that uses 3" as a supply line?

Yep, I believe that most of our county still uses 3". I'm not sure, but I think I've read on here that some of the departments up in PG still use 3" as well.

[RFD21C]

DC Fire department still uses 3 inch and 1 1/2 attack lines.

[Nozzle nut 22]

Our dept typically uses a forward lay of 5". Both engines and the quint have the 5" bed finished with a 4 1/2" nst x 5" storz gate valve. The hydrant bag carries 2, 2 1/2" ball valve gates, 2 spanners, and a hydrant wrench.

We remove all caps, and gate all hyrant outlets.

For occasions when we actually sit on the plug, we carry hydrant lengths of 5" and 3" and usually hook up a 5" roll up, and 2 3" donuts.

A manifold is carried in the rear cmpt on the pumpers for the odd reverse lay. Our current rescue pumper has been set up for reverse lays, with a 5x 3, 2 1/2" manifold on the end of the 5" bed. I have not looked at this in some time, so it may have changed. ( because we have 2 regular engines and a quint, this rig RARELY is used as an engine for anything other than car fires and mva safety lines. Both of those situations use tank water almost all the time)

[FIREMECH1]

Forward lay is from the water source (hydrant) to the fire. Reverse lay is from the fire to the water source. It used to be common practice in our area for hose beds to be packed according to the most commonly used lay. If you usually used a forward lay, the hose would be packed with the female coupling out. If you reverse laid, it would be male out. And you always kept a double male/double female coupling set handy.

All our 5" LDH have Storz couplings on them. First out end has a hydrant adapter.

Asked the boys today about this, and they said they had a SOP change a little while ago. Instead of the second engine pulling the first engines hose to the hydrant, the first in is required to lay a line to a hydrant. With the MTD's, they know where to hook up or lay to the hydrant. So from what they said, they do forward lays. But they can also do a reverse lay. Depends on where the hydrant is.

Sorry for the hi-jack.

FM1

[Weruj1]

5" stortz may need a threaded adapter............and it is either 50' if you are at the hydrant ..........if not off comes 100' sections...............to a manual piston intake on the side of the engine.

[nameless]

My god- there's still a Dept in the US that uses 3" as a supply line?

Indeed there is. There is a world beyond your own little sphere.