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  1. #21
    Forum Member FIREMECH1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trkco1 View Post
    Isn't putting the shift lever in the neutral position do the same thing? This is a serious question, I'm just trying to learn, I haven't operated a pump in years.
    Putting the shift lever in the neutral position just locks it into the "last" position it was in, at the transfer case. If you go from road to neutral, the transfer case is locked into road. It kills, or locks out the air system. Conversely, if you go from road to pump, then to neutral, the transfer case is locked into pump gear.

    Putting it in reverse has no bearing when you put the pump shift selector in neutral. Sometimes you do need to put the trans in reverse to be able to align the shift collars on the transfer case, to get it in pump gear.

    FM1
    I'm the one Fire and Rescue calls, when they need to be Rescued.

    Quote Originally Posted by EastKyFF
    "Firemens gets antsies. Theys wants to goes to fires. Sometimeses they haves to waits."


  2. #22
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    Default Pump Shift

    Quote Originally Posted by FIREMECH1 View Post
    If you have a Hale pump manual, it says to go directly from road to pump, not stopping in the center/neutral position.

    Waterous is also the same. Why people say or do this, I don't know. But it does not need to stop in the center/neutral position while making the road to pump transfer.

    FM1
    FM1,
    I understand what the manuals say. And I have been shifting them with the hesitation for over 30 years because it works, everytime.To each their own.

  3. #23
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    Default Speedometer Reading

    Quote Originally Posted by KuhShise View Post
    donethat: while most engines still operate the speedometer when in pump gear, there are a significant number of newer, computer controlled speedometers that do not show any speed when pumping. This is a shame, as being able to check the relative speed on the speedometer can be a valuable tool to make certain that the pump is in gear and in the correct pumping gear. For others, you should make a mental note of the reading when in pump gear and at idle, then check this before exiting the cab every time you place the pump in gear. If you still have a manual transmission, and accidentally place the transmission in the wrong gear (Ex. Mack in 3rd instead of 5th) you will have a much lower speedometer reading than normal. (3 mph vs 15 mph)
    KuhShise,
    I checked our latest new 2011 rig last night. The speedometer reads about 18 mph at idle with the pump engaged. And goes back to (o) when the trans is shifted back to neutral. Just like all the mechanical transmissions over the years. I was told the speedo signal comes from the trans computer to the J1939 gage package. I was also told this signal could be programmed to the off position. So if you have an electronic rig that does not have this capability, it could be a programming choice made by the truck manufactuer to not show this input.

  4. #24
    Forum Member FIREMECH1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by donethat View Post
    KuhShise,
    I checked our latest new 2011 rig last night. The speedometer reads about 18 mph at idle with the pump engaged. And goes back to (o) when the trans is shifted back to neutral. Just like all the mechanical transmissions over the years. I was told the speedo signal comes from the trans computer to the J1939 gage package. I was also told this signal could be programmed to the off position. So if you have an electronic rig that does not have this capability, it could be a programming choice made by the truck manufactuer to not show this input.
    donethat is correct. The speedo reading has to be acknowledged through a laptop to the trans computer. Some builders turn them off, or have them turned off. Either way, with a laptop and software, you can turn it on, or have your Allison trans dealer turn it on.

    FM1
    I'm the one Fire and Rescue calls, when they need to be Rescued.

    Quote Originally Posted by EastKyFF
    "Firemens gets antsies. Theys wants to goes to fires. Sometimeses they haves to waits."

  5. #25
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    Default Thanks!

    donethat & FireMech: Really appreciate the info. Guess we need to have the Sutphen "Re-sparked" to bring up the speed-o reading. I always depended upon this when we had the old mechanical shift Macks. Never thought much about it as we advanced through the Pierce, and just thought it was the way things were when we got the Sutphen. The KME engine and aerial both read before you exit the cab. Never gave it much thought. Thanks again.
    Last edited by KuhShise; 03-10-2011 at 10:29 PM.

  6. #26
    Forum Member FIREMECH1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KuhShise View Post
    donethat & FireMech: Really appreciate the info. Guess we need to have the Sutphen "Re-sparked" to bring up the speed-o reading. I always depended upon this when we had the old mechanical shift Macks. Never thought much about it as we advanced through the Pierce, and just thought it was the way things were when we got the Sutphen. The KME engine and aerial both read before you exit the cab. Never gave it much thought. Thanks again.
    It's all good. Thankfully my teething years were still mechanical, before being electronic. Why someone would turn off this essential tool, escapes me.

    FM1
    I'm the one Fire and Rescue calls, when they need to be Rescued.

    Quote Originally Posted by EastKyFF
    "Firemens gets antsies. Theys wants to goes to fires. Sometimeses they haves to waits."

  7. #27
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by FIREMECH1 View Post
    It's all good. Thankfully my teething years were still mechanical, before being electronic. Why someone would turn off this essential tool, escapes me.

    FM1
    They turn it off so that it don't show extra miles on the truck.

  8. #28
    Forum Member Rescue101's Avatar
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by FIREMECH1 View Post
    If you have a Hale pump manual, it says to go directly from road to pump, not stopping in the center/neutral position.

    Waterous is also the same. Why people say or do this, I don't know. But it does not need to stop in the center/neutral position while making the road to pump transfer.

    FM1

    EDIT: Looking at the pic, #2 probably says "Shift to pump".
    It's done to give any shaft rotation time to "play out"before you reach either operating position. T.C.

  9. #29
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    Default Switch?

    Quote Originally Posted by hinesfire View Post

    I sat in the engine last night and engaged & disengaged the pump several times. I believe I could hear the pump (pto?) engage, each time, well before the indicator lights come on.
    We have had some problems with a switch that turns on the "pump engaged" light. I don't know how your switch activates, but on one of ours, it is released by a lever when the pump is put in gear. It is underneath the pump where it gets wet and full of dirt. Internally it gets rusted, and slowly will move, then seize completely.

    Maybe yours is sticking, and moves when it wants. I keep spares.


    As for shifting, I attended a Waterous pump class, they said to shift it all the way don't hesitate. A Hale manual I read also said the same.

    The center position, as donethat said, releases the air pressure from the shift cylinders. That allows a manual pump engagement.

    I haven't had to try that yet, but lever is there.

    But everyone has their own way.
    Last edited by Hope FD; 03-14-2011 at 12:03 AM. Reason: Add material

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