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  1. #1
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    Default John Bean Fire Apparatus Operation

    I work for a Utility Contractor, the company owns the following 1981 Ford F700 Series Truck with the following: John Bean Fire Apparatus
    1981 Fire Apparatus
    Model 1TA975FC925
    Unit RN1000VOLTSS
    Pump No. D2-136-481
    Test 136-81
    S.O. No. 8278
    Performance Plate 854-432

    I have been researching all over the web, attempting to locate a Operations/User Manual for this Fire Apparatus. I have checked with FMC and John Bean (which is now part of Snap-On) I have pretty much not accomplished anything, other than going in circles

    I am really hoping that by posting my request to Firehouse Forums, someone who has knowledge of the John Bean Fire Apparatus, can provide assistance. I would really appreciate any assistance is locating a Manual. Thank you for reading this post.

    Sincerely mmahoney


  2. #2
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    Does it have a volume pump, high pressure pump, or both?

  3. #3
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    This is a high pressure pump - Pumps out approx 30 gallons a minute

  4. #4
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    shriver fire repair in anderson indiana is the guy u want to talk to he used to build the pump's when they were built in tipton indiana he's got them.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by mmahoney View Post
    This is a high pressure pump - Pumps out approx 30 gallons a minute
    Almost all of the truck mounted pumps I have seen were the R60, 60 GPM model which supplied 2 reels at 30 GPM each. If so, it will be driven by a pillow block with 5 belts going up to the pump which will look like it is sitting on it side and have three cylinders. All I can help you with is what I am familiar with but hopefully it will be close enough to get you going.

    At any rate, I can't remember the exact wording of the valves but having only a high pressure pump makes it a lot easier to help online since there will be a single tank to pump valve instead of three (a true nightmare of a delivery which usually required a chalk board to describe the suction plumbing since you could actually use the John Bean pump to prime the volume pump in about 2 seconds.) This brings up an oddity of FMC trucks. Sometimes the tank to pump valve is open when the handle is pushed in and sometimes they operate like the valves we are all used to. So, the first thing to do is figure out which way this truck works.

    Bean high pressure pumps are positive displacement, piston types. Once they are turning and water is coming in it must have a place to go since water doesn't compress. If you trace the discharge plumbing down you will find a pressure relief valve. Generally it will look like a vertical tower with viewing ports on four sides and a strong spring visible within. The bolt on top with the jamb nut is the adjustment. As the bolt is tightened into the spring the discharge pressure will increase. Find the valve and make sure it looks operational. Check the threads and see if anyone has been messing with it. If the jamb nut is firm and paint shows no tool marks it should be good enough to develop pressure even if the seat is damaged. If it looks like someone has been messing with the adjustment you will want to make sure there is some pressure on that spring. If the valve looks like it has been disassembled, take it apart and make sure it is all there and OK visually.

    As you check the plumbing related to the discharge plumbing you will find another valve generally just before the relief valve. It might return to the tank, vent to the atmosphere or lord knows what if FMC was involved but it will not go to an actual discharge. This valve is used to take all of the load off of the pump so it can be shifted into gear without killing the engine or breaking belts and things. It must be open unless you have some RPM and want to discharge some water. When it is closed water will go nowhere until it reaches the relief valve crack pressure. I can't remember what they usually labeled it so let's just call it the bypass.

    So, here is the pumping procedure.

    1. Make sure the bypass valve is open,
    2. Shift pump into gear,
    3. Start increasing engine RPM,
    4. As RPMs increase start closing the bypass (it's a two handed, simultneous operation,)
    5. As the bypass starts to close maintain RPM with the throttle,
    6. Once the bypass is fully closed run the throttle up to the preset pressure, that will be the point where pressure fails to increase as the engine RPM do increase.

    This is the point where the preset pressure can be adjusted if it needs attention. Regardless of the model of pump, if the reel is equipped with black, 3/4" high pressure hose and the #29 gun set the pressure to 850-900 PSI. Any other nozzle I am not familiar with but I understand they were designed for lower pressures.


    Now, when a discharge opens the pressure will drop. When it does, run it back up to the preset. Once all discharges are open and you can maintain the preset pressure note the engine RPM. That is the RPM you want to set at every time you pump the unit just to be sure your backside is covered.

    There will be pulsing in the hoses. These pumps are brutal. If it is a Royal 60 with two #29 fog guns it can be a very dangerous situation that requires vigilance regarding safety. To demonstrate this, get a 4 x 4 and you will be able to easily cut it in half with one gun. They will also make mincemeat of an over stuffed sofa that is smoldering.

    30 GPM going through a 3/16" hole creates a LOT of nozzle reaction. ALWAYS make sure the #29 guns are on fog before slapping that trigger. The guns are on/off with no throttling. They do have a "deadman" feature and will shut off if you let go but, the sudden burst of force from a straight stream gun coming on has hurt a lot of people who were behind the nozzleman.

    I don't know if any of this will help you or not but I hope it will. The plumbing is most likely the same on all of the John Bean piston pumps but I don't know that for a fact.

    I don't do messaging or whatever because I value my anonymity but will try to monitor this thread if you have any more questions. With any luck we'll get some people who are more familiar with the pumps than me and we will get you up to speed. Hopefully you won't need any parts but if you do, we'll find them.

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    Thank you for your replies so far - I will pass this information onto the boss. I will attempt to contact Shriver fire repair and see what information they have. I will continue to check this site to review replies and post more information.

    Thanks again, mmahoney

    For those of you who are curious, I was able to get a picture of the John Bean Fire Apparatus and I have attached to this message
    Attached Images Attached Images  
    Last edited by mmahoney; 03-21-2011 at 11:41 AM. Reason: Upload Picture

  7. #7
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    jeremy1213 > Is shriver fire repair in anderson indiana - Possibly Shreves Emergency Vehicles Sales & Service instead??

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by mmahoney View Post
    jeremy1213 > Is shriver fire repair in anderson indiana - Possibly Shreves Emergency Vehicles Sales & Service instead??
    i will get u his contact number in the morning

  9. #9
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    firepundit: It is called a "Ross Relief" valve and the discharge side is sent back to the tank. It is set at the desired use pressure (800 or 1,000 psi) and the pump rpms raised until it is relieving. The flow through the Ross helps keep the pump cool when you aren't putting water on the fire. We had a 5 stage centrifugal on an American LaFrance heavy rescue that was equipped with this type of valve in 1959. Since the John Bean is a positive displacement pump, when the nozzle is closed, the pressure will rise until something blows, or the pump stalls. The Ross is like a safety relief on a boiler.
    Last edited by KuhShise; 03-16-2011 at 11:58 PM.

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