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  1. #181
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    Quote Originally Posted by RFDACM02 View Post
    I think it's actually a 33% increase over the 15 personnel it takes to have three shifts of 5. A three shift system is 75% of the size of the four shift, but a four shift is not 25% more than a three shift but in fact 33% more.
    Yeah, my bad. That explains why we'll probably never go to a four platoon system, unless there are a lot of givebacks. Just the cost in recruitment and training in the academy alone is prohibitive.
    "The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those willing to work and give to those who are not." Thomas Jefferson


  2. #182
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    Quote Originally Posted by edpmedic View Post
    Yeah, my bad. That explains why we'll probably never go to a four platoon system, unless there are a lot of givebacks. Just the cost in recruitment and training in the academy alone is prohibitive.
    Our boss is talking about the change in a three year plan. Not as a cost saving measure but as a personnel saving measure. We're one of two or three FD's left in the state working 56 hours and our guys get very little sleep due to EMS runs. This costs in turnover and replacements. Not to mention the general misery felt by members who often sleep less than 2 or 3 hours during a shift, go home for a day of lethargy, have one "normal" day off and then are back to it. With a few other changes we're one member short of being able to finance the conversion without raising taxes.

  3. #183
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jasper 45 View Post
    If a person in my department is fortunate enough to be hired at age 20, they will be working thirty years to reach the minimum age to draw up papers to retire. In our program you need to hit a minimum age along with a minimum number of years of service to receive a percentage of your salary.

    Doesn't sound too different from the rest of the state then really. You still need to reach a minumum age and number of years to look at retirement as well. I know there are differences though.
    The thoughts and opinions posted here are mine and mine alone and do not reflect the thoughts and or views of city or dept affiliation.

  4. #184
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    Quote Originally Posted by emt161 View Post
    Originally Posted by jccrabby3084
    If you don't like your working conditions or wage/benefit, then why gripe about someone else? Instead of griping, how about looking into what you can do to change your own plight. Look in the mirror first.


    Like I said above, I'm not talking about OR complaining about my pay or benefits. I was speaking from the perspectives of taxpayers who are being asked to pay higher and higher taxes to pay for the likes of pay and benefits that they'll never see.

    And for the record, the answer to every workplace problem is not "start a union." Besides, I'm a manager now. That's how I improved my situation- I made myself stand out by working hard, making the best of opportunities presented, going for additional training on my own time, taking on extra responsibilities, etc.

    First of all I never stated that the answer to every workplace problem is to start a union, infact there have been numerous times I stated a union is not needed in many places. However, considering your screenname is EMT, and you are on a fire related forums, there is no secret that EMS pay in the private sector does suck, but for the most part does have to deal with lack of unions as well. Hence the reason I said to look in the mirror.

    Now I'm also a paramedic and do handle a lot of EMS so I do understand the job and issues involved with EMS. A big difference between what I do and the private is that I'm also a firefighter and utilized as one, which is the reason for pay differentials. So my point being here is that when someone like you comes across they way you did, it is easy to deduce the animosity issues of why someone like me deserves say more than someone like you.

    This goes into the point about taxpayers. Point is majority of taxpayers really are not doing the same job. For instance I really don't care to pay what I do for insurance, but it is comparable across the board, so there really is no savings. The thing is I don't go complaining to my insurance company griping about rates and blaming it on the employees....which IS what is happening with public workers. Same thing goes for my cell phone service, sure rates are comparable and I have seen my rates increase, but I don't blame this on worker's salary and benefits, as what is happening with public workers. Again same thing with my cable provider, sure I can shop around, but everything is comparable, and have seen prices increase, so once again, I don't blame this on the workers as making to much.

    Point is that it is easy to get lost in the concept of taxes, but the reality is those taxes DO pay for services people want/expect. In reality those tax dollars for ready services like police, fire, EMS, and consistent service like trash pickup, recycling, maintained parks etc, DO come at costs. Just like the private sector costs do go up and that cost is in turn is passed to the consumer, yet why doesn't it hold the same for the public sector? Really that is the nuts and bolts of it, it is easy to bitch, whine, and complain about taxes, but really isn't this the same thing that does occur in the private sector???
    The thoughts and opinions posted here are mine and mine alone and do not reflect the thoughts and or views of city or dept affiliation.

  5. #185
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    Lightbulb Ronald Reagan/National Incident

    It appears the big bad Union representing air traffic controllers wanted unreasonable demands such as no control towers with less than two personnel present at all times. But the reasonable management negotiators saved everyone a few bucks and went with the one. Thankfully sleeping at the desk didn't kill anyone this time!

    Funny I thought the union was only looking out for themselves and the employers were for the safety of the public?

  6. #186
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    Quote Originally Posted by RFDACM02 View Post
    It appears the big bad Union representing air traffic controllers wanted unreasonable demands such as no control towers with less than two personnel present at all times. But the reasonable management negotiators saved everyone a few bucks and went with the one. Thankfully sleeping at the desk didn't kill anyone this time!

    Funny I thought the union was only looking out for themselves and the employers were for the safety of the public?
    Don't forget the person "asleep at the wheel" was management, not a union air traffic controller.

  7. #187
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    Quote Originally Posted by FireMedic049 View Post
    Don't forget the person "asleep at the wheel" was management, not a union air traffic controller.
    That's what makes it ok, it's the new American way, as long as management says or does, it's fine. It's the rest of us problem employees that are causing all the issues. Oh wait, I'm now non-Union management, I guess I'm confused.

  8. #188
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    Quote Originally Posted by RFDACM02 View Post
    That's what makes it ok, it's the new American way, as long as management says or does, it's fine. It's the rest of us problem employees that are causing all the issues. Oh wait, I'm now non-Union management, I guess I'm confused.
    Not confused, re-programmed.

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