Uniform Shorts

We are looking for guidance on the use of uniform shorts in our department. I have been asked to gather info.

We run combination fire/EMS and inspections. Our personnel are all cross trained, and respond to all types of emergencies, some of our guys ride the engine, some on ambulance, some in staff cars as inspectors.

Our current uniform ensemble allows us to wear station pants, safety toe shoes and bunker or forestry coat and helmet for auto accidents and brush fires.

My questions...

-What are some of your policies and requirements regarding shorts?
-In NJ, does anyone know if there are any regulations on this (either DHSS or PEOSH)?
-NFPA 1975 doesnt seem to address shorts specifically, are there any NFPA standards that cover this?
-When you respond to EMS calls (on a fire apparatus) are you required to wear bunker pants?
-When you respond to EMS calls (on the ambulance) are u required to wear bunker pants or any other overclothing?
-When you respond on MVA calls (no reported pin) on either firetruck or ambulance, are you required to wear bunker pants?

Any other info or guidance would be appreciated.

Thank you.

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Originally Posted by MG3610

We are looking for guidance on the use of uniform shorts in our department. I have been asked to gather info.

We run combination fire/EMS and inspections. Our personnel are all cross trained, and respond to all types of emergencies, some of our guys ride the engine, some on ambulance, some in staff cars as inspectors.

Our current uniform ensemble allows us to wear station pants, safety toe shoes and bunker or forestry coat and helmet for auto accidents and brush fires.

My questions...

-What are some of your policies and requirements regarding shorts?

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We are allowed shorts from May 1 thru Sep 30. Shorts are only permitted for field members/officers, be they fire or EMS side, any rank except BC and above (or cadet/below). Staff positions not permitted to wear them at any rank. If shorts are worn, instead of the regular button-down shirt we have a uniform polo shirt (performance fabric-type) that must be worn. Also, no boots or high socks permitted - must be an oxford style shoe and ankle socks; we are allowed a loafer-type oxford slip-on which is what most prefer.

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-In NJ, does anyone know if there are any regulations on this (either DHSS or PEOSH)?

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I'm from PA - so I'll say FIIK. (F If I Know)

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-NFPA 1975 doesnt seem to address shorts specifically, are there any NFPA standards that cover this?

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FIIK

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-When you respond to EMS calls (on a fire apparatus) are you required to wear bunker pants?

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Actually we're generally forbidden from wearing bunker pants on EMS runs, hence we call them shoe runs. Sometimes it can't be avoided, such as back-to-back runs, coming from fire run to shoe run. Reasoning behind this is to not track carcinogen-laden bunker gear into someone's home unnecessarily. Legend also has it (a friend of a past then-commissioner), who had pristine white carpets, until someone took ill there and a whole bunch of filthy FFs showed up in even filthier bunker gear...

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-When you respond to EMS calls (on the ambulance) are u required to wear bunker pants or any other overclothing?

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Bunker gear is carried on medic units, but used (almost) only if they respond to standby for a structure fire.

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-When you respond on MVA calls (no reported pin) on either firetruck or ambulance, are you required to wear bunker pants?

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No, kinda. We have two types of accident responses, MVC=minor accident/no entrapment/etc. = shoe run, MVA=more severe than MVC/poss. entrapment/etc. = gear. But MVC is one of those exceptions to the rule of "no gear on shoe runs" - it is our discretion. Personally, I had a poor prior experience on a "MVC" that wasn't, and will respond only with gear, be it MVC or MVA, if possible.

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Any other info or guidance would be appreciated.

Thank you.

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I'll try to dig up our Directives section that deals with the shorts later.

Only issue regarding shorts in NJ is the PEOSH requirement that career FF's must wear Nomex or 100 % cotton uniforms. We wear 100 % cotton 5 11 BDU shorts during summer. Requirements are black ankle socks, all black sneakers or low cut shoes, no work boots and dept issued T or polo. We cannot wear shorts when doing UFC inspections, otherwise we have them on all summer. Don't do EMS however I would not recommend shorts on EMS calls....I know depts. that use light weight brush pants (cotton or nomex, cotton is cheaper) to slip on over their shorts when going on EMS runs.

Hope this helps.

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Originally Posted by mcl312

Don't do EMS however I would not recommend shorts on EMS calls....I know depts. that use light weight brush pants (cotton or nomex, cotton is cheaper) to slip on over their shorts when going on EMS runs.

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Why do you differentiate on EMS runs?

There's really no reason why you couldn't wear shorts on EMS runs. Intact skin is considered a barrier. I think a lot of policies are based more out of fear than anything. Besides, we all wear short sleeves and if you get blood on your arms no one cries about it. Common sense goes a long way here. Unfortunately we don't get to wear shorts in these humid summers here in Michigan so I'd be happy even if I couldn't wear them on EMS runs.

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Originally Posted by LFDmedic421

There's really no reason why you couldn't wear shorts on EMS runs. Intact skin is considered a barrier. I think a lot of policies are based more out of fear than anything. Besides, we all wear short sleeves and if you get blood on your arms no one cries about it. Common sense goes a long way here. Unfortunately we don't get to wear shorts in these humid summers here in Michigan so I'd be happy even if I couldn't wear them on EMS runs.

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Exactly, and cotton aint exactly a barrier.

I work in north central Texas and we can wear shorts at our discretion. Some of the other surrounding departments have a calendar rule (March-September) but with our weather here that's pretty, well, stupid. It's nothing to be 38 in April and 85 in January.

- Can wear them any time of the year with t-shirt/ polo shirt, or sweatshirt/ job shirt.
- Not required on EMS runs, pure discretion if you think it will be a messy one.
- Required on MVA's due to glass and sharp edges.
- Not sure of NJ standards.
- Have to wear black ankle socks and a black shoe no taller than 6".

Trying to get an idea of acceptance of uniform shorts - specifically for medical first responders, and people working events such as fairs.

Some of our area departments feel they are un-professional, I feel they are both professional and cool. (not Kewl)

Over here... http://www.firehouse.com/forums/t121141/

When I was a deputy sheriff we had a uniform that was a polo shirt with shorts w/cargo pockets for outdoor summer music fests. It was much much better than long polyester pants and people tipping over from heat exhaustion.

The FD currently has polo shirts and navy blue cargo pants with the pockets.

All depends on the person wearing them.
Some people should never let their legs be seen in public.

We used to allow shorts along with a company polo shirt when I worked at the racetrack for all the crews that worked the grandstands and non hot track areas. those of us on track had to wear firesuits or extrication suits.

What do you wear to brush calls? Changing out of shorts might be a pain... (our department just requires long pants, we don't use nomex pants)

wear shorts 24/7 365 days a year. Wouldn't have it any other way.