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  1. #1
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    Question Proper FD behavior?

    Take a look at this link here.

    http://www.break.com/index/the-ultim...-slide-2076840

    What's your take on this video?

    Personally, I think this dept. is taking a HUGE risk in public safety and proper use of tax payers dollars & equipment. Now, I don't know the background of this "event", but I know this would not fly in my dept!



  2. #2
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    I understand this may not be the proper place to post this topic, oh well.

  3. #3
    Forum Member EastKyFF's Avatar
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    That was dumb. There are a lot of problems here:

    1. How long would that engine have been delayed if a call came in? Specifically, how much time would it take to break down the supply line and get the engine in motion? And how far were they from their assigned station? What would they say if those delays were perceived to have cost someone their life or property? (Doesn't matter if the time affected it or not; perception is reality and people will perceive it as a costly delay.)

    2. Did it occur to the crew that operating a deck gun at such a low trajectory and pointing it right at people could cause serious injuries?

    3. Speaking of serious injuries, that's one long slide. What responsibility would the FD have held if someone had slid off the thing and suffered a catastrophic head or spinal injury?

    4. Are they hooked to a hydrant? Isn't this far worse than inner city kids cracking open a hydrant on a 100-degree day? At least they sometimes don't get the caps off and just play in the leak. Our water company would be livid if we wasted water like that. They don't like us using it to train, and certainly not to play.

    I could go on and on but I won't.
    "Be polite, be professional, but have a plan to kill everybody you meet.”
    --General James Mattis, USMC


  4. #4
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    You don't know the background relax there killer... could be a fund raiser/benefit, etc etc

  5. #5
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    Now, I don't know the background of this "event", but I know this would not fly in my dept!

    If its not your fd why are you worried about?

  6. #6
    Forum Member NY911Bowhunter's Avatar
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    Awesome............
    FTM - BTB - KTF

  7. #7
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    And where is this so that I may take a turn?
    We do not rise to the occasion. We fall back to our level of training.

  8. #8
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    Because Dashman, when firefighters do something stupid and irresponsible, it makes ALL firefighters look bad in the public's eye! That is just how it works! Hence my posting this link to encourage other members NOT to do stupid crap like this!

  9. #9
    Forum Member Bones42's Avatar
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    We have performed many events that I guess people would think are dumb and make the entire fire service look bad. I apologize to all fire fighters in the world.

    Next week, I will be doing another one and will do so for 6 weeks after that. We take an engine to our local park and open a portable deck gun onto a tennis court. Kids run around in the spray.

    Yes, I realize my entire town will now burn to the ground because 1 of my 4 engines in doing a public service. The 100 gals per minute that are flowing will cause the ocean to drop 6 inches and cause a drought in Texas. A child walking down the sidewalk may possibly stub a toe and need surgery that will cost billions of dollars to my town.


    hmm, maybe because we do things like this for our town, we don't have that many problems with our town.

    Again, way too many unknown things from this one video to get all worked up.
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bones42 View Post
    We have performed many events that I guess people would think are dumb and make the entire fire service look bad. I apologize to all fire fighters in the world.

    Next week, I will be doing another one and will do so for 6 weeks after that. We take an engine to our local park and open a portable deck gun onto a tennis court. Kids run around in the spray.

    Yes, I realize my entire town will now burn to the ground because 1 of my 4 engines in doing a public service. The 100 gals per minute that are flowing will cause the ocean to drop 6 inches and cause a drought in Texas. A child walking down the sidewalk may possibly stub a toe and need surgery that will cost billions of dollars to my town.


    hmm, maybe because we do things like this for our town, we don't have that many problems with our town.

    Again, way too many unknown things from this one video to get all worked up.
    I guess we shouldn't have taken 2 of our 7 engines out of service last week for a spray down at a prescoool, which actually doubled as a mass decontamination drill.

    Looks like a very small time with likely a very limited call volume. I'm quite sure that this was not thier only engine. Seems to me like a very good PR event.

    Only change I would have made was a little more fog and a little less straight stream on the nozzle. Other than that seems like a hell of a good way to develop some good will in the community.

    Something my current combo and VFD, and past VFD would do ina heartbeat.
    Train to fight the fires you fight.

  11. #11
    Forum Member EastKyFF's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    I guess we shouldn't have taken 2 of our 7 engines out of service last week for a spray down at a prescoool, which actually doubled as a mass decontamination drill.

    Looks like a very small time with likely a very limited call volume. I'm quite sure that this was not thier only engine. Seems to me like a very good PR event.

    Only change I would have made was a little more fog and a little less straight stream on the nozzle. Other than that seems like a hell of a good way to develop some good will in the community.

    Something my current combo and VFD, and past VFD would do ina heartbeat.
    How in the world is a spraydown at a preschool a mass decontamination drill?

    How do you know they have a very limited call volume?
    "Be polite, be professional, but have a plan to kill everybody you meet.”
    --General James Mattis, USMC


  12. #12
    Forum Member EastKyFF's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bones42 View Post
    We have performed many events that I guess people would think are dumb and make the entire fire service look bad. I apologize to all fire fighters in the world.

    Next week, I will be doing another one and will do so for 6 weeks after that. We take an engine to our local park and open a portable deck gun onto a tennis court. Kids run around in the spray.

    Yes, I realize my entire town will now burn to the ground because 1 of my 4 engines in doing a public service. The 100 gals per minute that are flowing will cause the ocean to drop 6 inches and cause a drought in Texas. A child walking down the sidewalk may possibly stub a toe and need surgery that will cost billions of dollars to my town.


    hmm, maybe because we do things like this for our town, we don't have that many problems with our town.

    Again, way too many unknown things from this one video to get all worked up.
    I stand by my opinion. The tennis court is a whole different situation than these meatheads sliding down a steep bank at breakneck speed. What you're doing is far safer than what the video shows, and it is indeed good PR.

    I don't at all think that the use of the engine for this event is likely to pose any threat to the community's safety, in realistic terms that we firefighters understand. But let anything go wrong at any fire that occurs while firefighters are doing anything optional like the video shows, and rest assured that a small flotilla of lawyers & briefcases will appear on this city's shores, ready to hang, draw, and quarter everyone involved. Again, perception is reality. Just because there's no harm doesn't mean people will not THINK there is a foul.

    As for the water use, again, it's perception. No impact whatsoever on the city's utilities; I agree with you and your sarcasm. But there are communities where the water company is run by such tools that this type of thing would never fly. I'm in one of them.

    We do PR within the bounds of what won't do us more harm than good. Just Monday we sent an engine in a little parade for a local elementary school that won first and second places at the international future problem solving competition. Anytime a sports team wins a regional or higher tournament, the whole county turns out fire trucks to escort them back to town. The community appreciates the fire departments for that and all the other non-fire stuff we do.
    "Be polite, be professional, but have a plan to kill everybody you meet.”
    --General James Mattis, USMC


  13. #13
    Forum Member Bones42's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EastKyFF View Post
    ...Anytime a sports team wins a regional or higher tournament, the whole county turns out fire trucks to escort them back to town...
    Not whole county, but my town has done that as well. This past fall, girls soccer team won state sectionals. I was chief and was at the game, on the way home, called ahead and had PD and FD meet the team bus coming back into town.

    The community appreciates the fire departments for that and all the other non-fire stuff we do.
    Very true.

    I stand by my opinion.
    As you should. It's a free world and what works in some places may not in others.
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

  14. #14
    Forum Member EastKyFF's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bones42 View Post
    Not whole county, but my town has done that as well. This past fall, girls soccer team won state sectionals. I was chief and was at the game, on the way home, called ahead and had PD and FD meet the team bus coming back into town.


    Very true.


    As you should. It's a free world and what works in some places may not in others.
    Now, see, everybody? Bones and I disagree on some minor things but we play nice. There's a lesson here!

    p.s. Bones, what's "soccer"? Round sports items here are either bounced on hardwood or swatted about on turf.
    "Be polite, be professional, but have a plan to kill everybody you meet.”
    --General James Mattis, USMC


  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by EastKyFF View Post
    How in the world is a spraydown at a preschool a mass decontamination drill?

    Setup a full overhead and side spray system in a decontamination corridor just like we would for a mass decon event within a specified time frame. Very valid training given the real world setup and time parameters.

    How do you know they have a very limited call volume?
    I have no hard facts but if they were busy enough to free up that engine for a PR function, I would not suspect an especially high call volume.
    Last edited by LaFireEducator; 06-29-2011 at 09:26 PM.
    Train to fight the fires you fight.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by LaFireEducator View Post
    I have no hard facts but if they were busy enough not to free up that engine, i would suspsect a high call volume.
    I was going to leave this alone, but...

    LA, would you say the city of Philadelphia is a busy department?

    There was a controversy here a year or two ago, where an engine was taken out of service to do a "street baptism"; that is, flow from a hydrant in order for one of the local denominations to run under the spray and baptise the flock. The two controversies were the church/state implications, of course, but also taking a busy engine out of service where within the prior year or two neighboring engines were closed and/or "browned out".

    {EDIT: http://firstin.wordpress.com/tag/engine-24-baptism/ }

    Just because some department is using a pumper, does not mean their call volume is so low as to permit its use. Sometimes those in charge are jsut making bad decisions.
    Last edited by mrpita; 06-29-2011 at 09:32 PM. Reason: Found article for the event desscribed
    Opinions expressed are mine alone, and do not necessarily reflect those of the Philadelphia Fire Department and/or IAFF Local 22.

  17. #17
    Forum Member Bones42's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EastKyFF View Post
    ...
    p.s. Bones, what's "soccer"? Round sports items here are either bounced on hardwood or swatted about on turf.
    Just came back from a weekend of soccer in Wildwood NJ. Beach Blast tournament. ~1000 teams participating.

    Was too busy with the group to stop by NWFD to visit the Chief though...
    "This thread is being closed as it is off-topic and not related to the fire industry." - Isn't that what the Off Duty forum was for?

  18. #18
    Forum Member RyanEMVFD's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bones42 View Post
    :

    Yes, I realize my entire town will now burn to the ground because 1 of my 4 engines in doing a public service. The 100 gals per minute that are flowing will cause the ocean to drop 6 inches and cause a drought in Texas. A child walking down the sidewalk may possibly stub a toe and need surgery that will cost billions of dollars to my town.

    .

    I was wondering why we are having a drought in Texas right now.
    NREMT-P\ Reserve Volunteer Firefighter\Reserve Police Officer
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  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by RyanEMVFD View Post
    I was wondering why we are having a drought in Texas right now.
    They must be drafting some serious water because it's just as dry over here in LA.
    Train to fight the fires you fight.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by DropTank View Post
    Because Dashman, when firefighters do something stupid and irresponsible, it makes ALL firefighters look bad in the public's eye! That is just how it works! Hence my posting this link to encourage other members NOT to do stupid crap like this!


    THANK you DROP TANK......

    This quote is a golden jem here in these forums.......this could / should be applied over the whole forum........

    Funny, how it all fits together...IRONICALLY, on a daily basis, there is about 650 or more "guests" and unregistered viewers on the forum.........certainly alot more than the registered member users....talk about " in the public Eye"

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