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Thread: FDNY Exam 2000

  1. #2951
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    Quote Originally Posted by MFES View Post
    From what I read of that article, the quota is ***theoretically*** only going to be in effect for the first 300ish minorities hired to make up for the "discrimination" of the two tests prior to 6019. I agree with most of the guys on here - the quota is completely wrong and we should do what we can to stand against it - but did anyone else read the article the same way? As infuriating as it is, at least it doesn't sound (at this point) that its going to be in effect indefinitely.
    That's how I read it as well. 2 blacks and 1 hispanic for every 5 people hired until the totals of 186 blacks and 107 hispanics are reached.

    It's downright depressing just to type that quota out. I remember being a school kid and thinking our generation would be the ones to see people for who they are and not see them for their color. The older I get, the more I realize things aren't changing for the better.
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    Did anyone else catch in that article the paragraph that reads "all new hires must past the new test as long as its cleared by the courts"? That would technically mean even the quotas would have to pass, right?

    If this quota thing goes thru I'm gonna talk to the judge and see if he can me into med school even though I had a low GPA. Then he can get me back pay from years of not being a neuro surgeon.

  3. #2953
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    Quote Originally Posted by ICNYC View Post
    First I have not once on this forum said what I want to happen. Second I have said and an saying that I expect quotas to be the way they will hire history has shown ie affirmative action . I'm not saying its right or wrong , I'm saying that when things like this happen quotas, affirmative action based acceptance into schools , or programs is usually what happens. History is proof enough. Don't attack me with ur opinion . I'm not putting my feelings on here bitching I'm just trying make sense of it all and the direction it's moving in . So I can adjust my life accordingly . So don't be a dick when u see a post that u gets u worked up so much u write bull**** just to get a bunch of likes. I want to kno the direction this thing is taking I'm not into debating right or wrong
    Just like other guys on here I'm not into that little kid crying **** . So leave that attacking bs for someone else
    You think I post on here to get a bunch of "likes"? Get a clue kid. I post on here because I have a vested interest in the job.

    You've already put it out there. From what I've discerned from your opinion is that you think that square one starts in the academy regardless of how you got there. It does, but you should get there on your merits; not a handout. I'm concerned that this job is becoming someones social experiment and pulls people who aren't next in line for the job.

    Affirmative Action/Quotas do not work. In fact it becomes reverse discrimination just to fill a slot.

    If this is the opinion of people who are hoping to get on the job, then once again, I'm done here.

    Finally, type out the whole word. It's "you" not "u". If you're trying to come across as educated and informed, it's not working. We aren't texting here.

    Good luck punk.
    Last edited by ffbam24; 07-19-2012 at 12:03 AM.

  4. #2954
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    Quote Originally Posted by PHHC08 View Post
    If this quota thing goes thru I'm gonna talk to the judge and see if he can me into med school even though I had a low GPA. Then he can get me back pay from years of not being a neuro surgeon.
    Don't forget to ask to be compensated for the intangible benefits like enjoyment of flexible scheduling and job satisfaction!!
    FDNYorDIETRYIN likes this.

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    Make phone calls, write letters and emails,,,,, i mentioned the mayors office of veterans affairs, i wrote another to my poc there and attached a copy of the court doc. i just wrote how it is an injustice to all vets and non vets alike. to be skipped over and quotas. i dont know how much power they have and its probly better to contact a media outlet.

    remember 3 out of 5 minorites will be off the "special list" not list 2000. so the minorities who studied and did well and earned a low list number have to suffer the consequences also.

    just to clear thing up, those are proposals correct? they arent written in stone. we do know well that bloomberg will not stand for quotas definetly a major asset in this particular case.
    Last edited by myles8683; 07-19-2012 at 10:15 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ffbam24 View Post
    You think I post on here to get a bunch of "likes"? Get a clue kid. I post on here because I have a vested interest in the job.

    You've already put it out there. From what I've discerned from your opinion is that you think that square one starts in the academy regardless of how you got there. It does, but you should get there on your merits; not a handout. I'm concerned that this job is becoming someones social experiment and pulls people who aren't next in line for the job.

    Affirmative Action/Quotas do not work. In fact it becomes reverse discrimination just to fill a slot.

    If this is the opinion of people who are hoping to get on the job, then once again, I'm done here.

    Finally, type out the whole word. It's "you" not "u". If you're trying to come across as educated and informed, it's not working. We aren't texting here.

    Good luck punk.
    Excellent post and I couldn't agree more.

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    I am curious if any has heard anything about how they plan to grade the test with the weights of Psych portion and regular portion?
    If the judge is successful in his push for this priority hiring for minorities who scored over a 20, and these "priority" hires need to pass the 2000 test, then I am wondering how they plan to grade 2000 and the Psych portion. I ask because I have a feeling (obviously) there will be some serious screwing with the test key and weighting of it, in order to help the Priority hires pass.

    I really hope the appeal crushes this nonsense and exposes the hypocrisy in it to the public.
    Last edited by BrooklynBorn; 07-19-2012 at 01:31 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BrooklynBorn View Post
    I am curious if any has heard anything about how they plan to grade the test with the weights of Psych portion and regular portion?
    If the judge is successful in his push for this priority hiring for minorities who scored over a 20, and these "priority" hires need to pass the 2000 test, then I am wondering how they plan to grade 2000 and the Psych portion. I ask because I have a feeling (obviously) there will be some serious screwing with the test key and weighting of it, in order to help the Priority hires pass.

    I really hope the appeal crushes this nonsense and exposes the hypocrisy in it to the public.

    I dont think anybody has any info on how this will be graded and I have a feeling since those questions don't have a true "right" or "wrong" answer, that the answer key will be adjusted to get the desired results......and even then, there will be a push for quotas. The whole thing is a ****e sandwich, but we're all hungry and don't have much of a choice after all these years.

    Just my opinion on protest/letter writing/etc.....this whole thing is tied up in the Judicial System at this point and public opinion (and basic logic, apparently) does not really come into play at all.

    If it were an issue before the City Council, then getting public opinion on our side might help. The courts don't care what the public thinks, they will look (hopefully, now on appeal) at the facts and the law and make a judgement. Holding a protest rally may make you feel good and get some frustration out, but honestly, it won't make any difference on the outcome of this whole debacle. I guess having more people aware isn't a bad thing though.

  9. #2959
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    I think we would have had a better chance if it was just the vulcans vs the fdny but the Department of Justice is what hurt us. "United States of America v. City of New York" does not look good at all.
    Ive always heard that to get through this process you have to really want it. For you guys already otj, was the academy a cake walk? For a person to get through it, did he/she have to really push themselves or not? I guess what i really want to know is can a person that is'nt serious about this job get through the academy. I cant imagine a person getting through that couldnt even fill out the application correctly.

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    I'm not with this department but I am with another career dept and of course lazy people slip through the cracks but fire school isn't a joke. It will be a eye opener to most people who have no fire experience. Recruits who don't take it serious will pass out in burns or during PT with gear, people will fail tests they don't study for, and instructors will see who isn't giving the effort they should be giving and will handle them appropriately. If those lazy people still make it through a bad label will be attached to them and they won't start with a good reputation. Houses won't want them, FF won't want to work with them, and this job won't be all that great for them.
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  11. #2961
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    As far as the article source, the writing seems to unorganized. I'll wait to a legitimate news source releases something. I know everybody's patience is growing thin, but eventually they'll have to hire. FDNY has to be setting a record right now for most OT ever gotten by a city organization.

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    Quote Originally Posted by I3akdraf View Post
    I'm not with this department but I am with another career dept and of course lazy people slip through the cracks but fire school isn't a joke. It will be a eye opener to most people who have no fire experience. Recruits who don't take it serious will pass out in burns or during PT with gear, people will fail tests they don't study for, and instructors will see who isn't giving the effort they should be giving and will handle them appropriately. If those lazy people still make it through a bad label will be attached to them and they won't start with a good reputation. Houses won't want them, FF won't want to work with them, and this job won't be all that great for them.
    I agree with you on a majority of these people being weeded out physically and mentally in the Academy, but I have friends on the job who tell me there's always a few who somehow slide through the academy by a hair. Those are the same people who get into immediate problems with their firehouse. Eventually tensions reach the limit and they request a transfer to a quieter, less busy house. Like I said these kinds of people are very few in number, but it's been known to happen. Also you can't just say "Oh we don't get along w/ this person because they're lazy" because that's when people formulate BS stories (example: They don't like me for my religion, race, sexual orientation, political beliefs).

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    Dear Exam 2000/2500 Applicants:

    This letter is to notify you of a Proposed Relief Order in United States and Vulcan Society, et al. v. City of New York, Civil Action No. 07-cv-2067. You are receiving this notice because the City of New York's records indicate that you took Written Examination 2000 or 2500.

    Written Exams 2000/2500 were developed under the supervision of the court in this lawsuit. They are not the basis of the underlying lawsuit or the upcoming Fairness Hearing, both of which concern Firefighter Exam No. 7029 (primarily administered in 1999) and Exam No. 2043 (primarily administered in 2002). However, because the Proposed Relief Order includes terms relating to the hiring of new firefighters, we are notifying you of the terms of the Proposed Relief Order and providing you with an opportunity to object to the order before it is entered.

    Below please find a link to a document entitled "NOTICE OF PROPOSED RELIEF ORDER AND FAIRNESS HEARING." This document describes the basis of the lawsuit and the terms of the Proposed Relief Order. In addition, the document provides the time and place of a Fairness Hearing regarding the Proposed Relief Order and tells you how to make an objection to the terms of the Proposed Relief Order if you choose to do so. Please read the document carefully as your right to object to the Proposed Relief Order or participate in the Fairness Hearing may be affected.

    http://www.nyc.gov/html/dcas/downloa...lief_Order.pdf

    received this in an email today...

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    So, I just got the email from DCAS and perhaps I'm reading into it but it think they might just be saying, HEY this could effect your hiring! Write an objection!

    Even if that's not their intended message, anyone who took exam 2000 and doesn't write an official objection letter through that link is screwing themselves and anyone who stands for fair hiring.

    This is something we can do not that might actually help us and its much easier and less risky than organizing a protest.

    Get to writing people!

    Dear Exam 2000/2500 Applicants:

    This letter is to notify you of a Proposed Relief Order in United States and Vulcan Society, et al. v. City of New York, Civil Action No. 07-cv-2067. You are receiving this notice because the City of New York's records indicate that you took Written Examination 2000 or 2500.

    Written Exams 2000/2500 were developed under the supervision of the court in this lawsuit. They are not the basis of the underlying lawsuit or the upcoming Fairness Hearing, both of which concern Firefighter Exam No. 7029 (primarily administered in 1999) and Exam No. 2043 (primarily administered in 2002). However, because the Proposed Relief Order includes terms relating to the hiring of new firefighters, we are notifying you of the terms of the Proposed Relief Order and providing you with an opportunity to object to the order before it is entered.

    Below please find a link to a document entitled "NOTICE OF PROPOSED RELIEF ORDER AND FAIRNESS HEARING." This document describes the basis of the lawsuit and the terms of the Proposed Relief Order. In addition, the document provides the time and place of a Fairness Hearing regarding the Proposed Relief Order and tells you how to make an objection to the terms of the Proposed Relief Order if you choose to do so. Please read the document carefully as your right to object to the Proposed Relief Order or participate in the Fairness Hearing may be affected.


    Link to: NOTICE OF PROPOSED RELIEF ORDER AND FAIRNESS HEARING

    http://www.nyc.gov/html/dcas/downloa...lief_Order.pdf

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    Quote Originally Posted by River6019 View Post
    So, I just got the email from DCAS and perhaps I'm reading into it but it think they might just be saying, HEY this could effect your hiring! Write an objection!

    Even if that's not their intended message, anyone who took exam 2000 and doesn't write an official objection letter through that link is screwing themselves and anyone who stands for fair hiring.

    This is something we can do not that might actually help us and its much easier and less risky than organizing a protest.

    Get to writing people!

    Dear Exam 2000/2500 Applicants:

    This letter is to notify you of a Proposed Relief Order in United States and Vulcan Society, et al. v. City of New York, Civil Action No. 07-cv-2067. You are receiving this notice because the City of New York's records indicate that you took Written Examination 2000 or 2500.

    Written Exams 2000/2500 were developed under the supervision of the court in this lawsuit. They are not the basis of the underlying lawsuit or the upcoming Fairness Hearing, both of which concern Firefighter Exam No. 7029 (primarily administered in 1999) and Exam No. 2043 (primarily administered in 2002). However, because the Proposed Relief Order includes terms relating to the hiring of new firefighters, we are notifying you of the terms of the Proposed Relief Order and providing you with an opportunity to object to the order before it is entered.

    Below please find a link to a document entitled "NOTICE OF PROPOSED RELIEF ORDER AND FAIRNESS HEARING." This document describes the basis of the lawsuit and the terms of the Proposed Relief Order. In addition, the document provides the time and place of a Fairness Hearing regarding the Proposed Relief Order and tells you how to make an objection to the terms of the Proposed Relief Order if you choose to do so. Please read the document carefully as your right to object to the Proposed Relief Order or participate in the Fairness Hearing may be affected.


    Link to: NOTICE OF PROPOSED RELIEF ORDER AND FAIRNESS HEARING

    http://www.nyc.gov/html/dcas/downloa...lief_Order.pdf
    You are fast my friend. I was just going to post this.

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    Also, I see no reason why anyone couldn't write an official objection. I am going to print out a 100 of these and hand them to friends and family.

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    Quote Originally Posted by River6019 View Post
    Also, I see no reason why anyone couldn't write an official objection. I am going to print out a 100 of these and hand them to friends and family.

    I was wondering this myself. I know the letter states we are being notified because we took the exam, but that still leaves a lot of openings. I'll be doing the same thing you are.


    Edit: Someone else mentioned this earlier but it definitely is worth repeating, the proposed 293 "priority hires" aren't coming off of Exam 2000's list. It is in the best interest of anyone who took this exam, regardless of your race, to file a objection.
    Last edited by HopefulFF; 07-20-2012 at 01:22 PM.

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    Who reads these letters, The appeals court? can any one write one, including people who didn't take the test?

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    Step one: Plastered the link with a basic summary on my facebook page.

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    Quote Originally Posted by River6019 View Post
    Step one: Plastered the link with a basic summary on my facebook page.
    I posted it on mine as well

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    Quote Originally Posted by BrooklynBorn View Post
    Who reads these letters, The appeals court? can any one write one, including people who didn't take the test?
    I think anybody who received the notice today is able to write one, but I would say fwd. it to any and all who may be interested. I think every member if the Dept. will have an opportunity as well.

    I know I said in my previous post that letter writing would be futile, but I stand corrected. I think this may be the only opportunity to let the Judge know exactly how much pain he has caused so many potential candidates.

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    About to start on my letter right now. I don't want to get hired and go in to a firehouse with an X on my back just because I'm Hispanic. Disgusting.

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    The more the months go by the more pathetic this judge gets. What about 6019's lost enjoyment and job satisfaction? Their the ones that got screwed over, like if the number itself became a new sexual position. All parties involved deserve to get punched in the throat.
    I will not tire, I will not falter, and I will not fail!!!

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    I'm going to thoroughly enjoy writing this letter. I bet you Merit Matters will have an amazing one, I'd love to read that.

    Everyone should submit objections of course, but should a formal objection also be done on behalf of the 2000 Exam candidate group? Might not be a bad idea since there's strength in numbers.

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    Can some people post their letters here? It would be good to get ideas and to form a uinified front... plus I have no idea what to write lol

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