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Thread: FDNY Exam 2000

  1. #2981
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    Interesting that they are having this orientation to talk about the CPAT before grades have even come out. Here's hoping that this means we'll be seeing scores in the fall and processing soon after!


  2. #2982
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    First off, we are debating about the unified group letter. We are going to send this idea off to law experts and see where they go with it. That doesn't mean though that you can't write a letter based off of yourself. I suggest everyone write their own and if we go ahead to write a group one, use ours as a basic if you need help formulating.

    Next thing is that the UWF thing is a cluster(you know what) so I'd leave it alone. I wrote a personal letter to see if they would allow all or any as they are using city property for their training only to be turned down.

  3. #2983
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    How many letters would we need to make some noise? Im not sure how many candidates are on 7029, 2043, 2000 and 2500 combined but we would probably need about 65-75% to write letters. Is this realistic?

  4. #2984
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    in your letters dont forget to mention that study session in queens closed to white candidates.....that really happened and didnt make enough news

  5. #2985
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    Quote Originally Posted by myles8683 View Post
    in your letters dont forget to mention that study session in queens closed to white candidates.....that really happened and didnt make enough news
    yep, attending that session and being turned away will definitely be mentioned in my letter

  6. #2986
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rush2000 View Post
    How many letters would we need to make some noise? Im not sure how many candidates are on 7029, 2043, 2000 and 2500 combined but we would probably need about 65-75% to write letters. Is this realistic?
    Squeaky wheel gets the grease.

  7. #2987
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    Can someone please explain something because I guess I'm missing something. The original lawsuit was against tests 7029 given in 1999 and 2043 given in 2002. Then comes alone test 6019 in 2007 that the judge throws out because of disparate impact which he's says is basically discrimination because of the results. So how come only people are going to collect from the 7029 and 2043 tests? Was 6019 not discriminatory enough? Because if that's the case then the city shouldn't be stopped from hiring off that list. I just started thinking about this after reading all of the emails from the city about the fairness hearing. If someone could shed some light on this for me I'd appreciate it. Thanks.

  8. #2988
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    Did anybody just get the same email from DCAS about the Relief Order? This is the 3rd time i'm getting this email, it looks the same as the previous two.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bellestoria View Post
    Did anybody just get the same email from DCAS about the Relief Order? This is the 3rd time i'm getting this email, it looks the same as the previous two.
    I got it too. It's the same.
    Test: 2000
    Score: 98
    List Number: 60**

  10. #2990
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    Quote Originally Posted by 7andchange View Post
    Can someone please explain something because I guess I'm missing something. The original lawsuit was against tests 7029 given in 1999 and 2043 given in 2002. Then comes alone test 6019 in 2007 that the judge throws out because of disparate impact which he's says is basically discrimination because of the results. So how come only people are going to collect from the 7029 and 2043 tests? Was 6019 not discriminatory enough? Because if that's the case then the city shouldn't be stopped from hiring off that list. I just started thinking about this after reading all of the emails from the city about the fairness hearing. If someone could shed some light on this for me I'd appreciate it. Thanks.
    Might be something you want to mention in the letter.

  11. #2991
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    Default My objection letter

    ``````````````````````
    Last edited by Geschaefer; 01-03-2014 at 08:13 PM.
    MFES and River6019 like this.

  12. #2992
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    Only suggestion to those who are writing is to make it serious. Sarcasim has a place but not in a letter of protest towards a Federal Judge involving a case. On the forums wayy understandable, in a official protest; not so much.
    Fdnytolife4130 likes this.

  13. #2993
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    Sarcasm is rarely detectable through text. Your comments seem bitter and don't help the cause. You make all the good points but tighten up the snide and sarcastic remarks if you want your letter taken seriously.

    Edit: Sorry, I didn't read DJ's post. What he said.
    Test: 2000
    Score: 98
    List Number: 60**

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    Still trying to get the wording exactly how I want it. A main legal point I'll make sure to highlight is how the judge guaranteed that our race information on the application sheet (that he required us to input) would not effect our hiring. It obviously will if his decision stands.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Geschaefer View Post
    This is my letter..
    Its not great; and im sure im missing a ton of import points I should be making.
    mostly im being a wise azz but for those who don't feel like typing; feel free to copy and paste any portion of mine.


    Tuesday, July 24, 2012

    From: XXXXXXX
    To: US DOJ
    Re: Objection to proposed Relief Order (Dkt. 922)

    My name is XXXXXXX
    I am a United States Marine Combat Veteran. I was hired off of list 6019 (List #XXXXXX) The V stands for Veteran. 5 days before myself and 149 other probationary Fire Fighters were to enter the academy the City rescinded their offer for employment due to budgetary concerns.
    A letter from the City informed us that we would be the first to be hired (when hiring commenced)
    Soon after; the DOJ and the Vulcan society became involved, and had my hiring list thrown out due to claimed racist hiring practices by the City of New York.
    I believe that all past entrance exams and hiring practices were fair and without regard to one’s race.
    As I recall; I had been investigated by 3 of the candidate investigations team’s employees; and all were Hispanic women.

    In one hand the DOJ and Vulcans are claiming that this relief order is to make whole all those who have been assumed victims of racism. Yet in the other hand they disregard we recent applicants who have been made to sit and wait while “justice be done”
    I find it truly boggling that the DOJ seeks so vigorously to rectify the claimed injustices done to Blacks and Hispanics by the cruel FDNY and City of New York; while at the same time the DOJ so blatantly ignores the fact that their quest for “Justice” has impeded the lives and quality of lives of all races affected by their involvement.
    The Vulcans have turned to you for claimed institution of unfair hiring practices; I’ll ask you this; who am I to turn to when you ACTUALLY institute unfair hiring practices?

    I don’t think that a truly impartial organization can so blatantly contradict its stated objectives.
    I believe that your organization should aim to be one who’s goal is “justice for all” as opposed to your careless relief order which provides “justice for some”

    You emailed me asking for an objection; and there you have it. I fully object to your relief order and ask that you withdraw your involvement and allow hiring to commence.
    I further request that the DOJ no longer entertain claims from the Vulcan society for a period lasting no longer than an accumulation of 1 year for each person not hired in a timely manner since their involvement or 6000 years; whichever is sooner.
    I will be careful not to anticipate a speedy or reasonable response; as I believe that your organization has made its decisions and biases quite clear throughout this witch hunt.

    Thank you in advance for writing all wrongs and leaving many unemployed or career-less during these hard economic times.

    Respectfully;
    XXXXXXX
    Great letter, leave out "cruel" fdny. Might be better without. Nice work.

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    Quote Originally Posted by River6019 View Post
    Still trying to get the wording exactly how I want it. A main legal point I'll make sure to highlight is how the judge guaranteed that our race information on the application sheet (that he required us to input) would not effect our hiring. It obviously will if his decision stands.

    I don't think that is correct. I believe the pool of applicants to reach the 293 quota are not people who took this exam. In other words, blacks or hispanics who took only this exam are not eligible to be hired outside of rank order off of our list. I could be wrong, but that's how I interpreted the situation.

  17. #2997
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    Quote Originally Posted by HopefulFF View Post
    I don't think that is correct. I believe the pool of applicants to reach the 293 quota are not people who took this exam. In other words, blacks or hispanics who took only this exam are not eligible to be hired outside of rank order off of our list. I could be wrong, but that's how I interpreted the situation.
    Yeah, I guess exam 2000 people wouldn't be used for the spots. I was thinking of 1 of the 6 hiring "options" he gave the city a couple years back to be able to hire off 6019. Its was basically hiring 293 off 6019 with the quotas.

    All the more reason every one of the 40,000 plus who took this exam should be writing an objection.

  18. #2998
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    Quote Originally Posted by River6019 View Post
    Yeah, I guess exam 2000 people wouldn't be used for the spots. I was thinking of 1 of the 6 hiring "options" he gave the city a couple years back to be able to hire off 6019. Its was basically hiring 293 off 6019 with the quotas.

    All the more reason every one of the 40,000 plus who took this exam should be writing an objection.

    It could certainly be worth mentioning, as the judge seems to be proposing several "remedies" that would also come off as racist. Maybe just worded differently/coming at it from another angle.

  19. #2999
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    ........................
    Last edited by Fdnytolife4130; 07-25-2012 at 02:42 PM. Reason: Wrong info
    Test 2000
    Score 97
    List#700X
    Do I stand a chance?

    I will not tire, I will not falter, and I will not fail!!!

  20. #3000
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    heres my letter just mailed it off



    US Department of Justice

    The basis of my objection to this relief order is that it is giving priority hiring to those who do not deserve it. They did not pass the test that others spent countless hours studying for, they did not prepare themselves mentally for the civil service exam and now they may be offered a job? A job where lives are on the line, thereby making a dangerous job even more dangerous .That just seems so far beyond logical I am struggling to wrap my brain around what is going on.
    I am a Veteran of the United States as well as a resident of New York City. I took exam 6019 and although I wholeheartedly disagree with the way the courts and Judge Garafius in particular handled it I accepted it and began studying for the next exam. As a full time student on the GI Bill I made time to study for exam 2000 because I knew that the FDNY recruiting efforts and minority outreach efforts would pay off. I attended many study sessions given by the city and even one given by the Vulcan Society only to be turned away at the door because I was white. Judge Garafius unfortunately does not seem to think the FDNY did enough and he feels priority hiring in the form of racial quotas is in order. How is that fair to returning veterans or anyone else who worked just as hard to get a good score on the test? I write this letter hoping that your minds aren’t already made up on this decision. Exam 2000 was a great exam straightforward and done by a third party PSI. I am confident that if the FDNY hired off that list alone for four years they would receive the desired outcome since they were not allowed to hire off the equally diverse list 6019. By none other than Judge Garafius, this judge has his own agenda and just wants to make a name for himself, he obviously has no regard for the city he serves or its citizens if he wants to give priority hiring to those who are not qualified to do a dangerous job and save lives. What is going on right now in his court room goes against every lesson I was ever taught in both military and civilian life.
    As the Department of Justice it is your obligation to thoroughly review all aspects involved in this case. Look at the FDNY recruitment efforts to minority communities, look at judge Garafius’ beyond reasonable demands for the FDNY as well as his quota hiring plans, look at the demographic breakdown of test takers, think of the repercussions his plans will have on public safety. I thank you for taking your time in reading my letter as I am sure you have a lot more that are very similar
    Very Respectfully
    xxxx

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