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They want to put 2 classes a year in. June and sept are only 3 months apart bud. Supposedly after the first class in 5 years. They're going to need some time to recoup, get instructors in order and set up the rock again. Take it as it is.Quote:
Originally Posted by john_smith1
Because that part was made to be a gimme for people who lack reading and listening skills.
Obviously some people did very well on all the sections and it didn't affect them either way
The last part was designed to make the cognitive and reading comp sections worth less(watered down) to help those who lack necessary skills. We all know who they were trying to screw and who they were trying to give points away to, its unconstitutional and thats all I will say about it.
They could change every question on the last part and I could go in and score a 100 on it now just answering strongly agree or disagree. Thats not a test, its bull****. One could't realistically say that 100% about the first few sections and be sure, because they are real questions based on information, easy or not.
I went into the last part believing there would be disqualifies as did others, it was a trick and thats not what a test should be about.
^^^^^ Prime example of pointing the finger, not the thumb.^^^^^
IMO this sounds more likely than a June class (unfortunately). The city's official release mentioned 600 hires per year, and also if the EMT's process was a bit rushed to get the January class in, that's even worse news for a June class as we're about 1 week behind their schedule now.Quote:
Originally Posted by bk60191983
bk - you may end up being right, but be careful when citing 'a guy on the job who heard a thing.' It's speculation and rumor, and probably best on the forum IMO to make sure you are clear about that. Many of us hear things from guys on the job who hear things, and many on here are OTJ and haven't heard such things. My point is, nobody knows nothing for sure, including the guy you are citing. Maybe a class in June, maybe a class in September. We'll see.Quote:
Originally Posted by bk60191983
HopefulFF - I'm not sure about that. I thought the 2500 guys got their packages in September, which would mean that from package-academy they had four months. If OC's got packages next week or the week after, we'd have no less than five months. Correct me if I'm wrong, but if that's the case a June class is still highly likely. Even if the next class went June 1 there would be at least a few weeks in between the end of the previous class and beginning of the next one, and they've had no problem with even tighter timeframes than that in the past. What I see as LESS likely is them leaving the academy quiet during half of May, all of June, July, and August, and then finally putting another class in come September.
MM mentioned he got his package on August 30th, so just about 19 weeks before his first day.
If they want to hire roughly 600 FFs per year and put in classes of 300 then there will always be months where they aren't using the academy for probie school, unless they do classes of 150 for some reason.
Of course I hope I'm wrong. I guess we'll see.
I honestly believe that the city and FDNY would like to crank out class after class ASAP but there are two thing holding them up.
1) The priority hire clowns need to have their scores finalized and I'm sure their own protest sessions before the city can know how they sort in with the OC list.
2) Also, the city will likely wait for its appeal in the second circuit court before they send any notices (they do not want to even start to process these jerks if they don't have to). Unless, you hear them ask for a stay on the hiring order like they did for the monitor's payments till the 2nd CC rules. Which will I'm sure would be rejected by Garauifs anyway.
After that we'll probably start getting mail pretty quickly. So lets just hope the appeals court rules soon and rules correctly.
I'm not so sure if the clock hasn't started already. DCAS gives test every four years. Unless the test-life is expanded. WE applied for test in 2011, so next application would be 2015. It's 2013.Quote:
Originally Posted by stang0480
The clock doesn't start until the list is established. Our list was published, but not established.Quote:
Originally Posted by john_smith1
This test is the future of the fire service/civil service in general. This is due to the society we live in. I've taken 4 fire dept tests including this 1, and EVERY single one, the majority was a personality-type test ( Strongly agree, agree, indifferent, etc) I'm talking big cities, Philly, FDNY, small cities, Allentown Pa, and large countys down south, Loudoun cty FR.Quote:
Originally Posted by BrooklynBorn
Not to mention, the majority of employers now have a personality assessment as part of the application process..Lowes, etc.
The only civil service, true civil service test that I took was for PA corrections officer..scored the same on that as I scored on this, so I'm ok with it.
Was this test a gimme? Honestly, yes. I looked at the study guide, went in, took the test, and that was that. The real test is not the written test..but the process itself, the CPAT and the academy. You can sugarcoat a test and its scores however you want, but you can't sugarcoat the job. The reality of the job, the reality of what can happen on the job, the hard work, and the dedication. The cream does rise to the top, it might just take a little bit longer.
and I'm middle of the road. I'm 27 right now, by the time my number gets called I will be close to 30. I want to settle down and have kids. I will prove myself, god willing if I make it there, in the academy, and god willing to the guys wherever my assignment is. I will work hard, study hard, and go the extra mile for anyone. I hope that doesn't come off as selfish or whatnot..but the future of fire service/civil service testing is here. Its a lottery now, hopefully you will get lucky and get a good number, the rest is up to you. Will you take your shot and prove yourself?
Arguing about this is about as useful as arguing about why we don't wear 3/4 boots, or why we can't ride the tailboard anymore. it is what it is.
It took about 6 months to a year for 6019 to become official, correct me if I'm wrong. They can test whenever they want, The list is good for 4 years, the commissioner stated 2400 or so people will be hired from this list. 2 classes a year for the next 4 years=2400 people. Expected to reach 8000 or so on the list. That is from the mouth of the man. So that is what I am taking it as.Quote:
Originally Posted by john_smith1
Sadly it does little to prove how it was scored, the breakdown of who took what, how the tribunal of the protest session reached their answers, and how the test was algorythmically put together. The cream won't rise to the top if it's a lottery system because in a lottery system it is luck not merit that determines the process. Really in a lottery system it is purely statistical meaning if you throw enough shtick at the wall, enough will stick to cover most of the open patches. Also nearly all those departments that you mentioned are trying to recruit minorities with little to no avail, and have for years relied on these tests which have done little to help the turnover rates at some of them. You also have the bonus of being a veteran meaning that due to this you are a priority for nearly all departments as you have that added to your resume and those departments can be eligible for federal grant money due to that.Quote:
Originally Posted by BigGriffC12
Wouldn't even trust that guy, said he knew how the test was scored only to have his third in command say we don't know how we reached the score.Quote:
Originally Posted by BigGriffC12
Also if I had the list number 1 I'd still be doing this because the FDNY exam was for a long time the only true competitive exam. People who are saying this is the future of testing are the same are again just laying down and saying I'm ok with this. You will have a chance to prove yourself at the academy but those around you who were lucky to win the lottery could and might just be you're demise.
People can't understand that this is more than the lottery this is you're life and that if you have underqualified or underinterested people, who are babied into this process, who have few interests in firefighting outside the benefits, are the same reasons that the cream won't and can't rise to the top because it will not be allowed to.
Plus if all of you low number guys think you have the best shot anything can happen. See Minervas' post but until you are in the academy nothing is a guarentee and even then that could be taken away.
I'm almost certain Griff is right. I don't remember where exactly I saw it but I looked into this specifically not that long ago - the list is not yet "established" and won't be until they start hiring from it.Quote:
Originally Posted by BigGriffC12
I hope so... I myself am on the borderline listwise, 78xx. So this means that the class AFTER this April will be the first to use the oc list 2000? So if they go by the " new exam" every four year rule, the next exam might be 2017?????Quote:
Originally Posted by nycthirteen
Don't conflate the end of hiring from an established list with the city giving a new exam. They can continue to hire off of an established list even AFTER they give new exams (until a new list is established). So, for arguments sake, they can establish the list this year and it will be good until 2017, and they can still go ahead and give a new exam in 2016.Quote:
Originally Posted by nick0525
"Im not a good test taker!"
"The personality portion is bull!"
"The City and the Vulcans are f*****g me!"
"I scored great on 6019, but I **** the bed on 2000!"
"Knowing the inner workings of testing processes is my right!"
A number of you on here have some nerve. The truth of the matter is, a lot of you were not as prepared as you thought you were.
And as far as those who believe it is your duty to righteously combat all so called evil within DCAS and PSI, please save it. It is NOT your role to "fix" this system, despite what others may have you believe. Your role is to keep on preparing and successfully complete each round of the process that you encounter. Those who have prepared thus far can do without your meddling. Jesus, some of you are no worse than those last clowns who sued and these 293 other hair bags.
If you could not find a way to score well enough on that exam to at least have a shot of getting the call, then you are probably just smart enough not to s**t your own pants.
I don't completely agree with the last part of the test nor am I trying to insult anyone's intelligence, but I think exam 2000 was pretty easy and very well put together as far as testing one's math, reading, etc, skills. I am a minority and did not feel like exam 2000 discriminated me in any type of way.
I wouldn't say the test was easy. I mean realistically I only scored a 95. If I wasn't a vet and resident there is no way I would fall within the hiring range. I think that's something we need to remember there were not many perfect scores and without those points the list would probly be completely different. My point is plenty of these people wrote a better test and won't be hired.
I haven't been able to get to the bottom of this either. See my post below from a few pages back:Quote:
Originally Posted by john_smith1
I need to remember to call the next weekday I have off.Quote:
I just called the DCAS automated line to see if they would give any more info than this. Unfortunately it doesn't. It states the list was made public on October 3rd just like The Chief. The amount of eligibles has actually gone up to 40,906 but my list # hasn't changed. Either way, no mention of when the list expires. When I check for other NYC lists I'm on, they all state the same thing with the "made public on" language and none of them mention list was "established on." Perhaps someone can call DCAS during normal biz hours to inquire?
8 days in. 8 dropped probies. Hope you guys in the top 500 are getting ready, I heard that giving back your gear is pretty embarrassing.