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  1. #1
    MembersZone Subscriber Golzy12's Avatar
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    Question Unsupported Pt pickoffs without a victim harness

    I'm looking to do some brainstorming with everyone. At my department we don't have a quick connect victim harness but other then that we have a full complement of rope rescue equipment (we will be pushing to get a victim harness soon). Without a victim harness how would you handle a person clinging to a rock face with no harness on. What equipment would you use to initially secure the pt and then what would you use as a harness for the pt. Here are my ideas, let me know if you guys can improve on them.

    -I would tie into the main and belay line and tie tails on each line
    -I would attach a pickoff strap to the tail on my main line, attach another pickoff strap to the loop on my mainline and bring a loop of webbing down with me
    -When I reach the pt. I will apply the pickoff strap attached to the tail on my main line around them and adjust it to fit them
    -With the pt somewhat secured I would use the loop of webbing to tie a seat harness around them
    -I would connect the pickoff strap attached to my main line loop to the webbing harness and take up the slack
    -I would also connect the tail from my belay line to the webbing harness
    -From there I would have the pt sit back in the harness or raise the main line to raise us and then weight the webbing harness.

    Obviously not ideal but were working with what we've got
    Last edited by Golzy12; 08-09-2011 at 07:02 AM.


  2. #2
    Forum Member FiremanLyman's Avatar
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    I am confused, think you are thinking a more complex scenario, because I view this as a pretty easy pick off. If I were to leave the station right now on that call my immediate thoughts would be;

    -Equip myself with a harness with dual pigtails, and a 15 foot webbing in a loop.

    -Be lowered to the pt. on a two tension rope system, stop short of patient (my knees level with his head).
    -Invert, and place hasty harness on patient.
    -Clip patient into my pigtails (pick off).
    -Lower to ground or haul to top (situational dependent).

    Am I missing something in your scenario?
    ~Drew
    Firefighter/EMT/Technical Rescue
    USAR TF Rescue Specialist

  3. #3
    MembersZone Subscriber Golzy12's Avatar
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    My thought was that it would be nice to secure the patient somehow before tying hasty harness. Do you think that is overkill?

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    Forum Member FiremanLyman's Avatar
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    My concerns would be more focused on the patient trying to grab onto you when you make access, adding a sudden load to your system that might stretch enough to tumble him to the ground. I would side on doing less steps more quickly to secure them.

    I also thought maybe send a line down with a large bowline or 8 on bite to have the patient loop under their armpits. Then again, the time taken to do this verses just going down to get them is another call. If the pt. is so precariously positioned that this would risk him falling when he loops it over him...

    Twelve in one hand, dozen in the other.
    ~Drew
    Firefighter/EMT/Technical Rescue
    USAR TF Rescue Specialist

  5. #5
    Moderator ProgressiveRescue's Avatar
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    Clearly time is of concern here being the climber has no harness or rope attached to him. So with that being said whatever we do it needs to be quick and noninvasive. Here's a quick idea. First things first I would stop myself from being lowered just above the victim ensuring I'm high enough to be out of their reach. Now's the time to play psychologist, calm them down and explain your gonna help them out and not to jump onto you.
    Golzy12 Let's build off of your anchor/pick-off strap idea. How about a separate victim line with and figure 8 bite on the end with a beaner attached and about 6' up a prusik knot also with beaner attached. You can now invert or lower yourself down to the victim and carefully pass the eight on a bite around the victim and clip it back on the line. Have the team topside take up the slack carefully so not to move the vic. Should the victim slip the rope will tighten up and stop them from falling. Not ideal but we're just throwing ideas around right? Now throw a hasty harness on them bring the prusik down and connect to the hasty harness.

    Mike Donahue
    "Training Prepares You...For Moments That Define You

  6. #6
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    In that scenario I would probably lower myself or get lowered to the victim and toss a diaper harness on him tied with webbing, and just pick him off.
    In the time it would take to do anything else I can put a diaper on him and clip him into a pickoff strap
    The nice part about a diaper is that he can keep holding onto the rock face or whatever while I get it on him.

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