# Thread: Rush to Lift? Victim Killed after Car Drops During Lift with Spreaders

1. Originally Posted by tajm611
Lever=\=fulcrum.
NOT exactly. A fulcrum is a part of a lever system. A Lever is a lever.

2. No, it's exact. Your illustration proves it. Move the load between the fulcrum and action point and it's still the same. The ladder is the lever as the ground is the fulcrum. A fulcrum is a constant in a majority of all force multiplying systems, only the load and lever configurations differ.

3. Originally Posted by voyager9
Fulcrum:
Nasty *** flying machine! T.C.

4. Originally Posted by tajm611
No, it's exact. Your illustration proves it. Move the load between the fulcrum and action point and it's still the same. The ladder is the lever as the ground is the fulcrum. A fulcrum is a constant in a majority of all force multiplying systems, only the load and lever configurations differ.
Lever REQUIRES a fulcrum which MAY be a separate component. So NOT exact. In the case of using a ladder to raise a car you MIGHT just use the Ladder by raising one end using the ground as the fulcrum. Or you might opt to use some cribbing as a fulcrum in which case to now have a lever with a secondary fulcrum. A winch is a lever,where is the fulcrum there? T.C.

5. If we're going to pick nits... a lever and a fulcrum are two distinct components of the simple machine, "the lever". A "lever" without a fulcrum is just a stick and cannot do any useful work. A fulcrum without a lever can't do any useful work either.

Originally Posted by Rescue101
Lever REQUIRES a fulcrum which MAY be a separate component. So NOT exact.
The fulcrum is always seperate from the lever. It is the point in space where the lever transfers force to a relatively immoveable object; not a physical object itself.

A winch is a lever,where is the fulcrum there?
The winch is an example of another simple machine, "the wheel and axle"; not a lever. If you were to compare by analogy, the "fulcrum" of a winch is the axle or maybe more accurately, the points at which the axle transfers force to a relatively immovable object.

6. Originally Posted by DeputyMarshal
If we're going to pick nits... a lever and a fulcrum are two distinct components of the simple machine, "the lever". A "lever" without a fulcrum is just a stick and cannot do any useful work. A fulcrum without a lever can't do any useful work either.

The fulcrum is always seperate from the lever. It is the point in space where the lever transfers force to a relatively immoveable object; not a physical object itself.

The winch is an example of another simple machine, "the wheel and axle"; not a lever. If you were to compare by analogy, the "fulcrum" of a winch is the axle or maybe more accurately, the points at which the axle transfers force to a relatively immovable object.
I really should refrain from posting when I've thriple shifted. You would be correct on the lever and the diagram below was what I was thinking when i mentioned the winch. DUH! I use this stuff every day, T.C.

7. Originally Posted by DeputyMarshal
If we're going to pick nits... a lever and a fulcrum are two distinct components of the simple machine, "the lever". A "lever" without a fulcrum is just a stick and cannot do any useful work. A fulcrum without a lever can't do any useful work either.

The fulcrum is always seperate from the lever. It is the point in space where the lever transfers force to a relatively immoveable object; not a physical object itself.

The winch is an example of another simple machine, "the wheel and axle"; not a lever. If you were to compare by analogy, the "fulcrum" of a winch is the axle or maybe more accurately, the points at which the axle transfers force to a relatively immovable object.

Thank you.

8. Originally Posted by Rescue101
I really should refrain from posting when I've thriple shifted. You would be correct on the lever and the diagram below was what I was thinking when i mentioned the winch. DUH! I use this stuff every day, T.C.
No worries. Except that a pulley (system) is yet another type of simple machine distinct from both the lever and the wheel & axle. I'll grant that the analogy of a "spinning lever" in the drawing isn't entirely inappropriate.

9. Originally Posted by DeputyMarshal
No worries. Except that a pulley (system) is yet another type of simple machine distinct from both the lever and the wheel & axle. I'll grant that the analogy of a "spinning lever" in the drawing isn't entirely inappropriate.
Daily driver for me. Every one of my rigs has a minimum of 4 blocks on them(not Firetrucks) Leverage can be found in many places, a vehicle frame being one. The 25 ton truck has 6 blocks on it. Now if you want to talk compounding,I can show you how to develop some POWER. With a small winch. T.C.

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