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Thread: Austin Fire Exam, May 23rd 2012

  1. #821
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    So what is everyone's prediction on the scores will be posted and when we will take the CPAT? That's if they decide to hire our class. I know there are countless variables that no one knows that will effect the scores posted date. But I'm just curious on everyone's opinion.


    I am glad I prepared that everything was going to be late, cause I almost didn't sign up for another semester of school thinking I would know my score before September. Haha.


  2. #822
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    Can't see it going forward past this:

    The U.S. Department of Justice has found that the Austin Fire Department is engaged in a pattern or practice of discrimination against African American and Hispanics as a result of its hiring process, according to a letter the city received Thursday from the federal agency.

    The Justice Department found that the Fire Department’s hiring process in 2012 disproportionately screened out African Americans and Hispanics, according to the letter. A preliminary analysis shows a different hiring process the Fire Department used to screen fire cadet applicants this year, it said, also will cause adverse impact.

    “We have serious concerns that, if implemented, the city’s 2013 hiring process will” violate federal law, the letter says.


    Fire Chief Rhoda Mae Kerr could not be reached for comment Thursday, but in a memo she sent to department personnel Thursday night, she said she will continue to work with the city’s law department and the Justice Department.

    Her memo describes the Justice Department’s determination as being that the Fire Department is engaged in a pattern of “unintended discrimination against African-Americans and Hispanics in its hiring process.”

    Federal law prohibits both intentional discrimination and employment actions that are “fair in form but discriminatory in operation.”

    An assistant attorney general with the Justice Department has authorized the filing of a lawsuit against the city to ensure the Fire Department complies with federal law and remedies the effects of past discrimination, the letter says, and a suit would be filed no later than Oct. 26.

    However, the letter indicates that the city has expressed interest in participating in settlement negotiations, and that litigation may not be necessary.

    In a statement sent to the American-Statesman, City Manager Marc Ott said the city appreciates the Justice Department’s “attention to this matter” and acknowledgment of the city’s cooperation during the investigation.

    “We have been unable to find a solution on our own and that is unfortunate,” he said. “We look forward to working with the Department of Justice, the Fire Department and the Austin Firefighters Association in our efforts to select the best and most qualified applicants to serve in our department.”

    In order to follow the law, the letter suggests that the city modify its hiring process and provide relief to the African-American and Hispanic applicants harmed by the city’s 2012 hiring process.

    The Justice Department’s letter comes less than two weeks after the city received a letter from the U.S. Equal Employment Opportunity Commission, which similarly announced that it had found that minority applicants for the Austin Fire Department’s 2012 cadet academy were discriminated against.

    The federal agency said it had finished an investigation into the department’s hiring practices from 2012 and found that a group of black applicants was discriminated against because of race and a group of Hispanic applicants was discriminated against because of national origin.

    The findings led the city to say it would no longer tap candidates from the 2012 hiring list to become firefighters.

    It wasn’t clear Thursday how the Justice Department’s findings will affect this year’s hiring process.

    The Justice Department announced in April that it was authorizing an investigation into the Fire Department’s hiring practices based on information indicating it might discriminate against some minorities.

    http://www.mystatesman.com/news/news...30927_12435924

  3. #823
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    Quote Originally Posted by aliciaaaaah View Post
    Can't see it going forward past this:


    The U.S. Department of Justice has found that the Austin Fire Department is engaged in a pattern or practice of discrimination against African American and Hispanics as a result of its hiring process, according to a letter the city received Thursday from the federal agency.

    The Justice Department found that the Fire Department’s hiring process in 2012 disproportionately screened out African Americans and Hispanics, according to the letter. A preliminary analysis shows a different hiring process the Fire Department used to screen fire cadet applicants this year, it said, also will cause adverse impact.

    “We have serious concerns that, if implemented, the city’s 2013 hiring process will” violate federal law, the letter says.


    Fire Chief Rhoda Mae Kerr could not be reached for comment Thursday, but in a memo she sent to department personnel Thursday night, she said she will continue to work with the city’s law department and the Justice Department.

    Her memo describes the Justice Department’s determination as being that the Fire Department is engaged in a pattern of “unintended discrimination against African-Americans and Hispanics in its hiring process.”

    Federal law prohibits both intentional discrimination and employment actions that are “fair in form but discriminatory in operation.”

    An assistant attorney general with the Justice Department has authorized the filing of a lawsuit against the city to ensure the Fire Department complies with federal law and remedies the effects of past discrimination, the letter says, and a suit would be filed no later than Oct. 26.

    However, the letter indicates that the city has expressed interest in participating in settlement negotiations, and that litigation may not be necessary.

    In a statement sent to the American-Statesman, City Manager Marc Ott said the city appreciates the Justice Department’s “attention to this matter” and acknowledgment of the city’s cooperation during the investigation.

    “We have been unable to find a solution on our own and that is unfortunate,” he said. “We look forward to working with the Department of Justice, the Fire Department and the Austin Firefighters Association in our efforts to select the best and most qualified applicants to serve in our department.”

    In order to follow the law, the letter suggests that the city modify its hiring process and provide relief to the African-American and Hispanic applicants harmed by the city’s 2012 hiring process.

    The Justice Department’s letter comes less than two weeks after the city received a letter from the U.S. Equal Employment Opportunity Commission, which similarly announced that it had found that minority applicants for the Austin Fire Department’s 2012 cadet academy were discriminated against.

    The federal agency said it had finished an investigation into the department’s hiring practices from 2012 and found that a group of black applicants was discriminated against because of race and a group of Hispanic applicants was discriminated against because of national origin.

    The findings led the city to say it would no longer tap candidates from the 2012 hiring list to become firefighters.

    It wasn’t clear Thursday how the Justice Department’s findings will affect this year’s hiring process.

    The Justice Department announced in April that it was authorizing an investigation into the Fire Department’s hiring practices based on information indicating it might discriminate against some minorities.

    http://www.mystatesman.com/news/news...30927_12435924
    We have to keep our hopes up!!
    DO NOT THINK NEGATIVELY!!!

  4. #824
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    What about the Asian Americans?! We are misrepresented in everything but the medical field

  5. #825
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neonshoes View Post
    What about the Asian Americans?! We are misrepresented in everything but the medical field
    Preach it brother

  6. #826
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    On September 26, 2013, the City of Austin received a letter from the U.S. Department of Justice directing the City to modify the current 2013 hiring process in order to address an unintended disadvantage to African American and Hispanic candidates.

    Once we have determined how the modified hiring process will work, we will notify all active candidates and provide an explanation of the process and direction on your next steps. In the meantime, no further action is required on your part. All 2013 cadet candidates who completed both exams will remain active candidates in the current hiring process.

    We apologize for any inconvenience this delay may cause. We will continue to update you via this website on the status of the hiring process, and appreciate your continued interest in becoming an Austin firefighter. If you have specific questions that are not addressed in this message, please email firerecruiting@austintexas.gov.

  7. #827
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    Quote Originally Posted by psilentchild View Post
    On September 26, 2013, the City of Austin received a letter from the U.S. Department of Justice directing the City to modify the current 2013 hiring process in order to address an unintended disadvantage to African American and Hispanic candidates.

    Once we have determined how the modified hiring process will work, we will notify all active candidates and provide an explanation of the process and direction on your next steps. In the meantime, no further action is required on your part. All 2013 cadet candidates who completed both exams will remain active candidates in the current hiring process.

    We apologize for any inconvenience this delay may cause. We will continue to update you via this website on the status of the hiring process, and appreciate your continued interest in becoming an Austin firefighter. If you have specific questions that are not addressed in this message, please email firerecruiting@austintexas.gov.
    Sounds to me like we'll all retest in the near future. What do you'll think?

  8. #828
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    No somehow they will push forward

    Hay it is Texas maybe they will do a lottery drawing, throw all the names into a ten gallon hat and pull out the winners

  9. #829
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    Last week FOX 7 told you about the failing grade the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission gave the Austin Fire Department for how it selected its cadets last year.Well now the Department of Justice is saying the City's current hiring process for 2013 is no better when it comes to discrimination.In a letter to the City of Austin this week from the Civil Rights Division of the U.S. Department of Justice, the Feds say they've determined "the city is engaged in a pattern or practice of discrimination against African Americans and Hispanics."In response, Fire Chief Rhoda Mae Kerr issued a statement referring to the discrimination as "unintended."Kerr said "I will continue to work with the City Law Department and the Department of Justice with regard to the hiring practices of the Austin Fire Department.'City Manager Marc Ott also issued a statement saying "We appreciate the Justice Department's attention to this matter and the acknowledgement of our cooperation during the investigation. We have been unable to find a solution on our own and that is unfortunate.""This is how I interpret that. You've got all these opposing parties who work for the same department. You've got city management, you've got the regular union, you've got the black unions, you've got a fire chief. And none of these folks for the most part have combined their efforts and said 'Look, let's get this done. Let's get away from thinking about dumbing down the process or affirmative action. Let's talk about how to make this a fair process and let's agree not to sue each other but to get the right outcome. But nobody will say that," said Nelson Linder with the Austin Chapter of the NAACP.Linder says the discrimination at the fire department has been a problem for a long time.He has spoken with minorities who are currently firefighters and those who didn't make the cut."When I talk to black folks who have taken this exam, they don't say specifics. They are surprised that they failed it. And these are very intelligent people. That's why I think obviously, it's a process and the way the whole test is structured. I think they're giving too much credit to things that people are not familiar with," Linder said.Currently whites make up 79 percent of the department. African Americans make up 4 percent and Hispanics, 15 percent.Gavino Fernandez with LULAC says if the city can't solve this, they need to look around."This is one where we need to go back to the drawing board and reassess with a different test. We have large communities throughout the country where there are heavy minority communities that have fire departments. Maybe we need to look at the tests that they apply or they use. For example, San Antonio, Laredo, all those large communities that have large Latino populations," Fernandez said.The Department of Justice letter says the United States will file its complaint in late October.The DOJ is hoping the city will adopt and implement new employment practices that don't violate the Civil Rights Act of 1964 -- as well as provide relief to African American and Hispanic applicants who were harmed by their hiring practices.

  10. #830
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    How about Native Americans , they should be first to be hired!!!



    Evidence of prehistoric human habitation of the Balcones Escarpment region of Texas can be traced to at least 11,000 years ago. Two of the oldest Paleolithic archeological sites in Texas, the Levi Rock Shelter and Smith Rock Shelter, are located southwest and southeast of present-day Austin respectively.[4] Several hundred years before the arrival of European settlers, the area was inhabited by a variety of nomadic Native American tribes. These indigenous peoples fished and hunted along the creeks, including present-day Barton Springs,[5] which proved to be a reliable campsite.[6] At the time of the first permanent settlement of the area, the Tonkawa tribe was the most common, with the Comanches and Lipan Apaches also frequenting the area.[7]

  11. #831
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    Quote Originally Posted by MasterSplinter View Post
    Last week FOX 7 told you about the failing grade the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission gave the Austin Fire Department for how it selected its cadets last year.Well now the Department of Justice is saying the City's current hiring process for 2013 is no better when it comes to discrimination.In a letter to the City of Austin this week from the Civil Rights Division of the U.S. Department of Justice, the Feds say they've determined "the city is engaged in a pattern or practice of discrimination against African Americans and Hispanics."In response, Fire Chief Rhoda Mae Kerr issued a statement referring to the discrimination as "unintended."Kerr said "I will continue to work with the City Law Department and the Department of Justice with regard to the hiring practices of the Austin Fire Department.'City Manager Marc Ott also issued a statement saying "We appreciate the Justice Department's attention to this matter and the acknowledgement of our cooperation during the investigation. We have been unable to find a solution on our own and that is unfortunate.""This is how I interpret that. You've got all these opposing parties who work for the same department. You've got city management, you've got the regular union, you've got the black unions, you've got a fire chief. And none of these folks for the most part have combined their efforts and said 'Look, let's get this done. Let's get away from thinking about dumbing down the process or affirmative action. Let's talk about how to make this a fair process and let's agree not to sue each other but to get the right outcome. But nobody will say that," said Nelson Linder with the Austin Chapter of the NAACP.Linder says the discrimination at the fire department has been a problem for a long time.He has spoken with minorities who are currently firefighters and those who didn't make the cut."When I talk to black folks who have taken this exam, they don't say specifics. They are surprised that they failed it. And these are very intelligent people. That's why I think obviously, it's a process and the way the whole test is structured. I think they're giving too much credit to things that people are not familiar with," Linder said.Currently whites make up 79 percent of the department. African Americans make up 4 percent and Hispanics, 15 percent.Gavino Fernandez with LULAC says if the city can't solve this, they need to look around."This is one where we need to go back to the drawing board and reassess with a different test. We have large communities throughout the country where there are heavy minority communities that have fire departments. Maybe we need to look at the tests that they apply or they use. For example, San Antonio, Laredo, all those large communities that have large Latino populations," Fernandez said.The Department of Justice letter says the United States will file its complaint in late October.The DOJ is hoping the city will adopt and implement new employment practices that don't violate the Civil Rights Act of 1964 -- as well as provide relief to African American and Hispanic applicants who were harmed by their hiring practices.
    Solutions??
    1. Hire certified people only

    2. Have a lottery

    3. No written test, and do interviews like on the voice, where you do not see the person

  12. #832
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    Quote Originally Posted by fire49 View Post
    How about Native Americans , they should be first to be hired!!!



    Evidence of prehistoric human habitation of the Balcones Escarpment region of Texas can be traced to at least 11,000 years ago. Two of the oldest Paleolithic archeological sites in Texas, the Levi Rock Shelter and Smith Rock Shelter, are located southwest and southeast of present-day Austin respectively.[4] Several hundred years before the arrival of European settlers, the area was inhabited by a variety of nomadic Native American tribes. These indigenous peoples fished and hunted along the creeks, including present-day Barton Springs,[5] which proved to be a reliable campsite.[6] At the time of the first permanent settlement of the area, the Tonkawa tribe was the most common, with the Comanches and Lipan Apaches also frequenting the area.[7]
    Enough with the stupid, nonsense comments.
    aliciaaaaah likes this.

  13. #833
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    Well austin and doj wants a diversified dept

  14. #834
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    check page 40, SA does not have much of a better record

    http://www.sanantonio.gov/safd/PDFs/...ge=1&view=fitV

  15. #835
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    Quote Originally Posted by psilentchild View Post
    Am I the only that believes this years process will be canceled? I also believe they won't let us know until the end of the month.
    Self deleted.
    Last edited by Matty_Bev; 11-25-2013 at 02:39 PM.

  16. #836
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    I haven't heard a thing anywhere about whether or not the city and the union came to an agreement in time. You'd think someone would've said something one way or the other, right?

  17. #837
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    It seems like they haven't had a smooth hiring process in a long time, in my opinion that's a little disheartening, but it worked out for the good for me Fort Worth is an awesome department and in the long run I would rather be here. Good Luck to y'all with getting on believe me in the end all the stress and time it takes to get on is worth it where ever you end up.

  18. #838
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    Talked to a firefighter today. No deal between city and union and they're under civil service rules now, so whatever list they're working on with DOJ is invalid anyway.

    See you all next year.

    Link to AFA response: http://www.iafflocal975.org/index.cfm?section=1

  19. #839
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    Seems like there should be some action soon either with the contract or doj


    Guess should have read the fine print;;;


    RECRUITING PROSPECTIVE APPLICANTS

    Welcome to the City of Austin Fire Department’s Recruiting Section. The process of becoming a firefighter is challenging, .........

  20. #840
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    So its done? Officially? So I shouldnt get my hopes up or check this page often for updates?

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