Why register? ...To Enhance Your Experience
+ Reply to Thread
Results 1 to 17 of 17
  1. #1
    Forum Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Posts
    10

    Default Rear facing white lights in PA?

    Legal or illegal?


  2. #2
    Forum Member FWDbuff's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Location
    Pee-Ayy!
    Posts
    7,396

    Default

    illegal.

    Red and only very recently did they allow for one amber light.
    "Loyalty Above all Else. Except Honor."

  3. #3
    Forum Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    PA
    Posts
    2,952

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ainman View Post
    Legal or illegal?
    If you are talking about using white as a rear facing visual warning device, then most definitely illegal.

    If you are talking about using white as a rear facing scene lighting, then legal.

  4. #4
    Forum Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    PA
    Posts
    2,952

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by FWDbuff View Post
    illegal.

    Red and only very recently did they allow for one amber light.
    I'm pretty sure that the law allows for 2 amber warning lights to the rear. There's a lot of Fire & EMS apparatus in my area with more than 1 amber warning light to the rear.

  5. #5
    Forum Member FIREMECH1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    HUSKER LAND
    Posts
    2,425

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by FWDbuff View Post
    illegal.

    Red and only very recently did they allow for one amber light.
    Wasn't it a few years ago that it was mandatory to have one amber to the rear??? I believe it is optional now. Our last few rigs now have red and blue again, no amber at the rear.

    FM1
    I'm the one Fire and Rescue calls, when they need to be Rescued.

    Quote Originally Posted by EastKyFF
    "Firemens gets antsies. Theys wants to goes to fires. Sometimeses they haves to waits."

  6. #6
    Forum Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    592

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by FIREMECH1 View Post
    Wasn't it a few years ago that it was mandatory to have one amber to the rear??? I believe it is optional now. Our last few rigs now have red and blue again, no amber at the rear.

    FM1
    NFPA 1901 (1902, 1903, 1904 ad nauseum) started requiring one rear amber in Upper Zone C when they did the major rewrite in the early 1990's. It disappeared since and I can't for the life of me remember when. Pretty sure it was still there when they re-consolidated the pamphlets.

    But we must remember, NFPA is not mandatory, merely a consensus of minimum standards.

    What happened is that NFPA tread on a lot of state and local standards when they decided to include colors and had to beat a retreat. The elected cronies beat out the self appointed cronies.

  7. #7
    Forum Member FWDbuff's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Location
    Pee-Ayy!
    Posts
    7,396

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by FireMedic049 View Post
    I'm pretty sure that the law allows for 2 amber warning lights to the rear. There's a lot of Fire & EMS apparatus in my area with more than 1 amber warning light to the rear.
    I am pretty sure that if you check the Pa. MVC you will find that it only allows one amber warning device on the rear. Just becase you have apparatus that has more than one does not mean it is legal. How many blue light degenerates in your area actually follow the Pa. MVC which only allows one blue 360 degree rotating light (and nothing else) on their personal vehicles???
    "Loyalty Above all Else. Except Honor."

  8. #8
    Forum Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Posts
    635

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by FWDbuff View Post
    I am pretty sure that if you check the Pa. MVC you will find that it only allows one amber warning device on the rear. Just becase you have apparatus that has more than one does not mean it is legal. How many blue light degenerates in your area actually follow the Pa. MVC which only allows one blue 360 degree rotating light (and nothing else) on their personal vehicles???
    No mention of a specific number, only that each apparatus must have at least one red light...and may have one OR MORE amber.

    Chapter 45, Subchapter D:


    (b.1) Mounted lights and additional equipment.--
    (1) Police, sheriff and fire vehicles may be equipped
    with a mounted rack containing one or more emergency warning
    lights or side mounted floodlights or alley lights or all
    such lights in conformance with department regulations.
    (2) Additional visual or audible warning signal
    equipment, including, but not limited to, flashing headlamp
    system, flashing or revolving white or clear lights, steady
    burning lights, traffic-control emergency directional light
    assembly, amber lights and intersection lights, may be
    utilized on emergency vehicles in accordance with regulations
    promulgated by the department


    Chapter 45, Subchapter D (continued):

    (b) Flashing or revolving yellow lights.--Vehicles
    authorized pursuant to the provisions of sections 6106 (relating
    to designation of emergency vehicles by Pennsylvania State
    Police) and 6107 (relating to designation of authorized vehicles
    by department), tow trucks and vehicles used for snow removal
    may be equipped with one or more flashing or revolving yellow
    lights. The manner in which the light or lights shall be
    displayed and the intensity shall be determined by regulation of
    the department
    Last edited by ATFDFF; 02-22-2012 at 04:50 AM. Reason: cuz i dont kno how 2 spel

  9. #9
    Forum Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    East Coast
    Posts
    20

    Default

    If I remember correctly, I beleive the Amber rear warning light came in to play when many of the lighting packages where halogen and the Lighting manufacturers needed them to meet the required light output for the Upper Zone C section, per NFPA 1901. Since then with all the LED pacakages its now just perference of the Department's specifications.

  10. #10
    Forum Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    592

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by TFD-PIPEMAN View Post
    If I remember correctly, I beleive the Amber rear warning light came in to play when many of the lighting packages where halogen and the Lighting manufacturers needed them to meet the required light output for the Upper Zone C section, per NFPA 1901. Since then with all the LED pacakages its now just perference of the Department's specifications.
    Actually the amber light was an NFPA spec item that started when they totally revamped the lighting section. It has since been removed because of state regulations that the requirement interfered with.

  11. #11
    Let's talk fire trucks! BoxAlarm187's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    Virginia
    Posts
    3,283

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by firepundit View Post
    Actually the amber light was an NFPA spec item that started when they totally revamped the lighting section. It has since been removed because of state regulations that the requirement interfered with.
    I've looked through my 1991 edition of 1901, and can't find a requirement for amber. All of the references are based on the amount of light output required to the rear, which before the popularity of LED's, was much easier to reach with a single amber light than even multiple red lights.
    Career Fire Captain
    Volunteer Chief Officer


    Never taking for granted that I'm privileged enough to have the greatest job in the world!

  12. #12
    Forum Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    592

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by BoxAlarm187 View Post
    I've looked through my 1991 edition of 1901, and can't find a requirement for amber. All of the references are based on the amount of light output required to the rear, which before the popularity of LED's, was much easier to reach with a single amber light than even multiple red lights.
    Then it was the next version. It was in the colors by zone chart as well as the wording.

  13. #13
    Forum Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    48

    Default

    I know as far as EMS goes in PA you are only allowed one forward facing white light and rearward facing amber lights at most.

  14. #14
    Forum Member FIREMECH1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    HUSKER LAND
    Posts
    2,425

    Default

    I've got the print material that shows the NFPA adoption of the single amber to the rear. Found it a couple days ago. Seems like they had removed it a year or so after we got ones with the amber. The next batch we got didn't have amber, but blue instead. Fed Sig also had a pamphlet out on the new light zoning.
    I'm the one Fire and Rescue calls, when they need to be Rescued.

    Quote Originally Posted by EastKyFF
    "Firemens gets antsies. Theys wants to goes to fires. Sometimeses they haves to waits."

  15. #15
    Forum Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    East Coast
    Posts
    20

    Default

    What verison of 1901 are you finding the AMBER requirement for the Zone "C" Upper. I have been unable to find it, other than when Amber was used to meet the light output required for Zone "C" upper lights.

  16. #16
    Forum Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Posts
    1

    Default

    my 95 rescue have 2 ambers also

  17. #17
    Forum Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    PA
    Posts
    2,952

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by happyvalleyff View Post
    I know as far as EMS goes in PA you are only allowed one forward facing white light and rearward facing amber lights at most.
    You are incorrect.

    The vehicle code allows for more than one forward facing white light, however I believe they must be part of a lightbar rather than stand alone light heads. For example, the 2 white intersection sweep lights in Code 3's MX7000 light bar is OK, but 2 Whelen Series 900 white lightheads would not be OK.

    The vehicle code also allows for more than one rear facing amber light.

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. Rear Lights Flashing
    By Just a new name in forum Firefighters Forum
    Replies: 52
    Last Post: 09-06-2007, 09:59 PM
  2. Rear facing jump seats
    By taskforce16 in forum Apparatus Innovation
    Replies: 10
    Last Post: 03-02-2007, 02:31 PM
  3. Rear warning lights
    By engine1511 in forum New York
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: 10-04-2005, 01:39 AM
  4. 'white' halogen lights
    By rualfire in forum Apparatus Innovation
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 03-05-2005, 11:39 AM
  5. Here's why white hair often accompanies white helmets
    By EFD840 in forum Firefighters Forum
    Replies: 10
    Last Post: 03-23-2004, 09:39 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts