Why register? ...To Enhance Your Experience
+ Reply to Thread
Page 3 of 3 FirstFirst 123
Results 41 to 57 of 57
Like Tree2Likes

Thread: using a tow truck to pull a steering column?

  1. #41
    Forum Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Posts
    1,887

    Default

    We generally use the big wreckers for stablazing large trucks. The last time we used a heavy we actually used two to tie off a load of drill pipe. That was 3 years ago.
    I dont plan to ever have to call a mayday and need a rit team, but the time to assemble and train one is before I need them. Same thing with the wreckers , I wouldnt want to be the guy balled up in a wreck with crankcase oil dripping in my eyes and hear "maybe a wrecker would help get him out ,BUT - we havent needed one for 30 years.
    Isitjustme likes this.
    ?


  2. #42
    Forum Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Posts
    1,021

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by slackjawedyokel View Post
    We generally use the big wreckers for stablazing large trucks. The last time we used a heavy we actually used two to tie off a load of drill pipe. That was 3 years ago.
    I dont plan to ever have to call a mayday and need a rit team, but the time to assemble and train one is before I need them. Same thing with the wreckers , I wouldnt want to be the guy balled up in a wreck with crankcase oil dripping in my eyes and hear "maybe a wrecker would help get him out ,BUT - we havent needed one for 30 years.
    We have about 3 companies we do use if we need a heavy wrecker, we just don't use them for cars, vans, pickups, etc. We even have a couple of crane companies we can call in. I got to spend a day at the Operating Engineers' (Contruction union) training facility to learn rigging and hand signals. We have about a dozen heavy rescue's in the county or just outside, so additional resouces are not far away. Plus we have a USAR team as a resource.

  3. #43
    Forum Member Rescue101's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    Bridgton,Me USA
    Posts
    8,162

    Default

    Just out of curiousity how long does it take to get and set up a crane? In your neck of the woods of course.Cranes would be MY LAST choice for anything vehicular but I have my reasons.

  4. #44
    Forum Member scooby0066's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    NY
    Posts
    64

    Default

    I'm not singling anyone out here, but one of you I feel is very close minded. Rescue is a team sport my friend. There are times we need to call for some assistance. I've been around a long time.. the first thing I realize.. I might need help in some situations. I might need to call for someone a little smarter at certain things, or at the very least, have a phone number to call the person with the answers.

    As far as good tow truck operators and bad… yep there’s some bad ones, not arguing there isn’t. But in comparison, there is also some rescue personal that are equally bad too….. and there are some god awful medics. Heck to be truthful, both professions have personal that shouldn’t be allowed on the truck as they physically are a liability on a call. I’ll go as far as saying; just as there are some recovery outfits that shouldn’t be in business, there are some rescue squads that should be disbanded as they are a danger to themselves and those they are helping. It is what it is. So let’s call a spade a spade, all professions have personal that simply stink. Don’t be ignorant in the fact that there are bad in all professions.

    Anyways, I put a pic in below.. if rescue personal believe they can lift that quickly, safely and efficiently with the equipment that is readily available to them on their truck… then so be it. Personally, unless you are one of a handful of departments in the US that have Heavy wreckers in their fleet… I will safely say, you probably can’t lift it quickly, safely, and efficiently. If that mixer is on a vehicle, loaded with 9 yards, and tunneling efforts have failed, then a HD wrecker WITH THE RIGHT OPERATOR will be needed to lift enough to at least winch the casualty out. A crane has to set up in a platform/stance.. the HD wrecker, depending on the brand, can be set up in its lifting platform in less than 5 minutes. The time to work with your recovery outfit would be BEFORE this type of situation arises. It is rescue’s responsibility to interview and find a industry partner (recovery company) that is qualified to do this type of work.

    Not one to make statements and not back them up.. I’m so confident of this statement; I will challenge the one close minded individual here to a competition of that. I can lift that off the vehicle with a Heavy wrecker, one HP air bag, 2 pieces of wedge cribbing and two 4 by 4's faster, safer, and more efficiently then you can with the equipment off your rescue,,,, since it already has everything you need as you do so much rescue already. I've done it twice in real life and its a staple technique taught in our class. I can run the airbag off the wrecker's air supply. I’ll be in Cleveland, Ohio doing a class in September, feel free to join me…. and bring some coin. I know the recovery company who will be providing wreckers for the class and I am confident I can prove the theory wrong that you can do everything with the equipment YOU/YOUR DEPARTMENT has ( I already have researched the equipment you have)

    Anyways, to return to the original topic.. I would probably not use a wrecker to do a steering wheel/column pull/lift. My personal opinion is that the properly trained professional rescue team can perform that operation in less than 5 minutes. Also by using the wrecker, it would have to brace itself against the car….. and since everyone likes to crowd the scene with equipment, let’s face it, you would have to spend 10 minutes moving vehicles so you could get the wrecker in place!!! LOL you guys know I’m right on this!!! And that’s some funny stuff to chuckle about right there!!!!!

    respectfully submitted: Howard L. Eagan
    (no need to hide behind a alias here!!)
    Attached Images Attached Images  

  5. #45
    MembersZone Subscriber rmoore's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 1998
    Location
    Plano, Texas
    Posts
    808

    Default

    In the picture posted with the green color cement mixer, how was the drum stabilized to the chassis of the vehicle? With that design of mixer, isn't the drum just sitting in a cradle like the typical mixer truck designs?
    Ron Moore, Forum Moderator
    www.universityofextrication.com

  6. #46
    Forum Member Rescue101's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    Bridgton,Me USA
    Posts
    8,162

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by rmoore View Post
    In the picture posted with the green color cement mixer, how was the drum stabilized to the chassis of the vehicle? With that design of mixer, isn't the drum just sitting in a cradle like the typical mixer truck designs?
    I'm sure Scooby will respond,but we chain the drum on/down making it part of the mixer structure. I'm sure other methods could be utilized but our experience has shown this to be the quickest and safest method for US.

  7. #47
    Forum Member Rescue101's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    Bridgton,Me USA
    Posts
    8,162

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by scooby0066 View Post
    I'm not singling anyone out here, but one of you I feel is very close minded. Rescue is a team sport my friend. There are times we need to call for some assistance. I've been around a long time.. the first thing I realize.. I might need help in some situations. I might need to call for someone a little smarter at certain things, or at the very least, have a phone number to call the person with the answers.

    As far as good tow truck operators and bad… yep there’s some bad ones, not arguing there isn’t. But in comparison, there is also some rescue personal that are equally bad too….. and there are some god awful medics. Heck to be truthful, both professions have personal that shouldn’t be allowed on the truck as they physically are a liability on a call. I’ll go as far as saying; just as there are some recovery outfits that shouldn’t be in business, there are some rescue squads that should be disbanded as they are a danger to themselves and those they are helping. It is what it is. So let’s call a spade a spade, all professions have personal that simply stink. Don’t be ignorant in the fact that there are bad in all professions.

    Anyways, I put a pic in below.. if rescue personal believe they can lift that quickly, safely and efficiently with the equipment that is readily available to them on their truck… then so be it. Personally, unless you are one of a handful of departments in the US that have Heavy wreckers in their fleet… I will safely say, you probably can’t lift it quickly, safely, and efficiently. If that mixer is on a vehicle, loaded with 9 yards, and tunneling efforts have failed, then a HD wrecker WITH THE RIGHT OPERATOR will be needed to lift enough to at least winch the casualty out. A crane has to set up in a platform/stance.. the HD wrecker, depending on the brand, can be set up in its lifting platform in less than 5 minutes. The time to work with your recovery outfit would be BEFORE this type of situation arises. It is rescue’s responsibility to interview and find a industry partner (recovery company) that is qualified to do this type of work.

    Not one to make statements and not back them up.. I’m so confident of this statement; I will challenge the one close minded individual here to a competition of that. I can lift that off the vehicle with a Heavy wrecker, one HP air bag, 2 pieces of wedge cribbing and two 4 by 4's faster, safer, and more efficiently then you can with the equipment off your rescue,,,, since it already has everything you need as you do so much rescue already. I've done it twice in real life and its a staple technique taught in our class. I can run the airbag off the wrecker's air supply. I’ll be in Cleveland, Ohio doing a class in September, feel free to join me…. and bring some coin. I know the recovery company who will be providing wreckers for the class and I am confident I can prove the theory wrong that you can do everything with the equipment YOU/YOUR DEPARTMENT has ( I already have researched the equipment you have)

    Anyways, to return to the original topic.. I would probably not use a wrecker to do a steering wheel/column pull/lift. My personal opinion is that the properly trained professional rescue team can perform that operation in less than 5 minutes. Also by using the wrecker, it would have to brace itself against the car….. and since everyone likes to crowd the scene with equipment, let’s face it, you would have to spend 10 minutes moving vehicles so you could get the wrecker in place!!! LOL you guys know I’m right on this!!! And that’s some funny stuff to chuckle about right there!!!!!

    respectfully submitted: Howard L. Eagan
    (no need to hide behind a alias here!!)
    Scoob,WHY do you think you would have to "brace" the tow truck against the car? I've pulled a few columns this way and there was no "bracing" required,at least on the ones we pulled. You're only lifting the column a very few inches,enough to free the victim,hardly enough to tension the winch line.A method we have found effective(depending on victim location)is to use two nylon straps rigged on both sides of the column on the low side of the steering wheel ring to fold the lower ring up and away from the patient. Used in conjucntion with the main lift line. Certainly not something you'd do everyday but if you only have one set of HRT's and they are busy doing other things(multi vehicle crash),it is quite effective.
    Last edited by Rescue101; 06-11-2012 at 10:00 AM.

  8. #48
    Forum Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    Santa Ana, California
    Posts
    1

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by bcjack View Post
    We both carry absorbent.
    New to the forum, 1st post, What type of absorbent is being used here?

  9. #49
    Forum Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Posts
    1,021

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Rescue101 View Post
    Just out of curiousity how long does it take to get and set up a crane? In your neck of the woods of course.Cranes would be MY LAST choice for anything vehicular but I have my reasons.
    Cranes would be for something REALLY heavy, or a semi hanging over the edge of a bridge. Once, there was an incident where a guy was moving a massive crane and it rolled over on a car on the road crushing the victim. Of course it was a recovery, but that's the type of incident I'm talking about, not the typical car crash. Loaded cement mixers, etc.

  10. #50
    Forum Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Posts
    1,021

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by scooby0066 View Post
    I'm not singling anyone out here, but one of you I feel is very close minded. Rescue is a team sport my friend. There are times we need to call for some assistance. I've been around a long time.. the first thing I realize.. I might need help in some situations. I might need to call for someone a little smarter at certain things, or at the very least, have a phone number to call the person with the answers.

    As far as good tow truck operators and bad… yep there’s some bad ones, not arguing there isn’t. But in comparison, there is also some rescue personal that are equally bad too….. and there are some god awful medics. Heck to be truthful, both professions have personal that shouldn’t be allowed on the truck as they physically are a liability on a call. I’ll go as far as saying; just as there are some recovery outfits that shouldn’t be in business, there are some rescue squads that should be disbanded as they are a danger to themselves and those they are helping. It is what it is. So let’s call a spade a spade, all professions have personal that simply stink. Don’t be ignorant in the fact that there are bad in all professions.

    Anyways, I put a pic in below.. if rescue personal believe they can lift that quickly, safely and efficiently with the equipment that is readily available to them on their truck… then so be it. Personally, unless you are one of a handful of departments in the US that have Heavy wreckers in their fleet… I will safely say, you probably can’t lift it quickly, safely, and efficiently. If that mixer is on a vehicle, loaded with 9 yards, and tunneling efforts have failed, then a HD wrecker WITH THE RIGHT OPERATOR will be needed to lift enough to at least winch the casualty out. A crane has to set up in a platform/stance.. the HD wrecker, depending on the brand, can be set up in its lifting platform in less than 5 minutes. The time to work with your recovery outfit would be BEFORE this type of situation arises. It is rescue’s responsibility to interview and find a industry partner (recovery company) that is qualified to do this type of work.

    Not one to make statements and not back them up.. I’m so confident of this statement; I will challenge the one close minded individual here to a competition of that. I can lift that off the vehicle with a Heavy wrecker, one HP air bag, 2 pieces of wedge cribbing and two 4 by 4's faster, safer, and more efficiently then you can with the equipment off your rescue,,,, since it already has everything you need as you do so much rescue already. I've done it twice in real life and its a staple technique taught in our class. I can run the airbag off the wrecker's air supply. I’ll be in Cleveland, Ohio doing a class in September, feel free to join me…. and bring some coin. I know the recovery company who will be providing wreckers for the class and I am confident I can prove the theory wrong that you can do everything with the equipment YOU/YOUR DEPARTMENT has ( I already have researched the equipment you have)

    Anyways, to return to the original topic.. I would probably not use a wrecker to do a steering wheel/column pull/lift. My personal opinion is that the properly trained professional rescue team can perform that operation in less than 5 minutes. Also by using the wrecker, it would have to brace itself against the car….. and since everyone likes to crowd the scene with equipment, let’s face it, you would have to spend 10 minutes moving vehicles so you could get the wrecker in place!!! LOL you guys know I’m right on this!!! And that’s some funny stuff to chuckle about right there!!!!!

    respectfully submitted: Howard L. Eagan
    (no need to hide behind a alias here!!)
    I'm assuming here, but if you are refering to me in the first sentance, I was referring ONLY to light vehicle extrications. I'm pretty sure I stated that a few times. As I said before, large and commercial vehicles are another animal, and we would bring in outside assistance.

  11. #51
    Forum Member Rescue101's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    Bridgton,Me USA
    Posts
    8,162

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by johnsb View Post
    Cranes would be for something REALLY heavy, or a semi hanging over the edge of a bridge. Once, there was an incident where a guy was moving a massive crane and it rolled over on a car on the road crushing the victim. Of course it was a recovery, but that's the type of incident I'm talking about, not the typical car crash. Loaded cement mixers, etc.
    There was a reason for the question. I've RUN cranes.For the types of incidents you just described I would PREFER a machine like the one in Scooby's picture. A crane is designed to only have a hanging load,no side load. A rotating wrecker can endure BOTH side and hanging loads making it much more suitable for the task. PLUS it sets up in a lot less time.Typically it takes a good crane operator a fair amount of time to prepare the machine for lifting. Time we often DO NOT have.

  12. #52
    Forum Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Posts
    1,021

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Rescue101 View Post
    There was a reason for the question. I've RUN cranes.For the types of incidents you just described I would PREFER a machine like the one in Scooby's picture. A crane is designed to only have a hanging load,no side load. A rotating wrecker can endure BOTH side and hanging loads making it much more suitable for the task. PLUS it sets up in a lot less time.Typically it takes a good crane operator a fair amount of time to prepare the machine for lifting. Time we often DO NOT have.
    I get your point, sometimes those wreckers may not have the reach or capacity needed. It's going to be rare of course. One of the wrecker companies has cranes as well, just depends on what needs done that determines if they'll use them. A guy rolled a mixer just down from my house a few years ago. They used a 50T crane and a wrecker to upright it (company owned). They didn't have one of the wreckers with a rotating boom.

  13. #53
    Forum Member Rescue101's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    Bridgton,Me USA
    Posts
    8,162

    Default

    I've recovered several mixers. To date haven't used a Crane or a rotator on any of 'em. Just a couple HD and they came up fine.There is a TON of stuff you can do with wreckers, I've set up a "breechers buoy" to recover a vehicle in a block culvert,we've used one for patient extraction over a very steep icy bank.I'm sure you could have done it with ropes,belays,etc but for us it was faster and safer to use the TT. These are tools that are FAMILIAR to me,we use them all the time. Having a crane background, and given the EXTENDED response time for one, we adapted our operations AWAY from crane use. There are VERY few vehicular jobs in my response area that they would be a effective solution on.

  14. #54
    Forum Member scooby0066's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    NY
    Posts
    64

    Default

    sorry Ron for not getting back to your question, been busy had the NY chiefs show this weekend and spent fathers day with my son at a ballgame.

    I would like to spend a little time addressing your question Ron, as it needs the appropriate response, with technical data to back it up. For the most part, the days of chaining drums are gone..

    I will try getting a response back to yours and a few others questions tomorrow evening...

    tks, Howie

  15. #55
    Forum Member Rescue101's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    Bridgton,Me USA
    Posts
    8,162

    Default

    Just for clarification,when I say chain a drum,I'm referring to the NON driven end of the drum.And just to hold the drum in it's normal position on the support rollers. This can be done with a strap if you have one short and rugged enough,we prefer a rated chain.The structure under these rollers is rated for a loaded drum and all you are doing is holding the drum in it's normal transit position so it doesn't twist or leave that structure. If Scooby has a better way,I'd be interested in hearing it.We have used chain successfully(roller end ONLY)for over 25 years,doesn't harm the drum at all.

  16. #56
    Forum Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Posts
    1,021

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Rescue101 View Post
    I've recovered several mixers. To date haven't used a Crane or a rotator on any of 'em. Just a couple HD and they came up fine.There is a TON of stuff you can do with wreckers, I've set up a "breechers buoy" to recover a vehicle in a block culvert,we've used one for patient extraction over a very steep icy bank.I'm sure you could have done it with ropes,belays,etc but for us it was faster and safer to use the TT. These are tools that are FAMILIAR to me,we use them all the time. Having a crane background, and given the EXTENDED response time for one, we adapted our operations AWAY from crane use. There are VERY few vehicular jobs in my response area that they would be a effective solution on.
    On the particular incident with the mixer, they didn't have a lot of room to work. Narrow road and it was tar and chip over gravel so the crane and the wrecker put big holes in the road with their stabilizers. Not to mention the ground was saturated. The crane righted the truck and the wrecker pulled it back on the road.

  17. #57
    Forum Member Rescue101's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    Bridgton,Me USA
    Posts
    8,162

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by johnsb View Post
    On the particular incident with the mixer, they didn't have a lot of room to work. Narrow road and it was tar and chip over gravel so the crane and the wrecker put big holes in the road with their stabilizers. Not to mention the ground was saturated. The crane righted the truck and the wrecker pulled it back on the road.
    We all have different ways to do things. I'm QUITE familiar with the road type you describe,that's about 50% of our secondary roads.And,so we're on the same page,I'm not saying "my" way is the only/best way,but I CAN assure you it WORKS,and is worthy of you at least taking a look. If for no other reason than that off chance situation where you might not have that well stocked toolbox of yours to operate from.Google my home town sometime,you'll get a better idea of some challenging work enviornments. Scooby is very good at what he does,but in my area there are still way more cable(mechanical) tow trucks than the Rotators he's used too(and YES,he's VERY familiar with mechanicals too)the methods you utilize are different.I can use either but the reality is not many rotaters HERE. Nearest one,like a Crane, is at least an Hr out,sometimes more.So you use what you have available.

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. Pulling the steering column?
    By BigRig in forum University of Extrication
    Replies: 22
    Last Post: 04-16-2006, 07:54 PM
  2. Steering wheel pull
    By OnWithTheShow in forum University of Extrication
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: 06-10-2005, 08:38 PM
  3. Collapsible steering column
    By JorgHeck in forum University of Extrication
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 03-15-2005, 02:47 PM
  4. Anyone ever 'broken' a steering column?
    By BigRig in forum University of Extrication
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 05-10-2004, 05:36 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts